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Gilgamesh: Enough expository banter!
This talk page is used for discussing improvements to the page "Sant' Angelo di Roma". It is not the place for general discussion or sharing stories about the topic of this article.

Why does it say that Angelo would be half German Shepherd and half Border Collie? What do you base this information on? Because die-hard dog people have all said that Angelo is definitely an Australian Shepherd and it is also discussed in several forums over the internet. Angelo has no tail, and only Australian Shepherds can be born without tails, if you are talking about a dog that size. I will believe that she is German Shepherd/Border Collie mix, if an Ultimania says that. Otherwise, I request you to change it or I will. Thank you! --Dramirth 19:46, 1 March 2009 (GMT +2)

Pages such as this distinctly mention that the Ultimania guide indicates Angelo is not a mongrel, but a pure black-tricolor Border Collie. Specifically, they state that Nomura modeled her on a very particular Border owned by a co-worker at Square during the time of the game's development. I've also done a ton of overdue grammatical cleaning. BWYuko (talk) 23:05, October 16, 2012 (UTC)

That bit about the breed might be just hear-say, it's not listed in the "Ultimania profile" section on that page either. Espirit from the wiki might know.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 23:43, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
User talk:Espritduo#Angelo from FFVIII Here's the discussion. Looks like there is no source we could readily cite but it's still true.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 11:42, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
I agree it would be best to have a more definite source than what I provided. Thanks for checking with Esprit. Wikias are all about consistency, accuracy, succinctness; it's important we make such changes. You've already made some changes, feel free to alter whatever else you deem necessary.BWYuko (talk) 16:48, October 17, 2012 (UTC)

Citation would be appretiated, especially concerning Angelo's gender, age and date of birth.

Ffx-bahamut

Apologize, I was just sure I remember Rinoa saying "He's really smart..."

Anyone find some of these limit breaks weird such as Anal Cannon and wishing Star --UndyingvsSephiroth 22:10, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

NeA-SorcerorNobody
Zidane Dissidia CG render
NeA-SorcerorNobody

Celebratory ball?Edit

It says she is seen wandering around during the celebratory ball, is this at the start if the game (when Rinoa and Squall dance) or at the end of the game? - Sencilia

NameEdit

The article should be called just Angelo, because that's what she is called in the game. Just like Gabranth's article isn't called Noah fon Ronsenburg, or Red XIII's article isn't called Nanaki.Keltainentoukokuu 14:17, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

Help it doesn't let me change it back to Angelo again. If I do the copy-paste we'll lose the talk page.Keltainentoukokuu 14:20, May 8, 2011 (UTC)
That's because the redirect page Angelo has been edited. The copy-paste method also means the page history won't be conserved.
The only way is to mark the redirect page for deletion, wait until an admin deletes it, and then the page can be moved.
And... I don't like the name either. Jeppo (Talk | contribs) 17:11, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

But we call Rosa's article Rosa Joanna Farrell. This isn't like Nanaki and Noah--Angelo is part of her real name, with the rest of it coming from the Ultimania. Don't move it. Dazuro 19:26, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

Gabranth and Red XIII are exceptions to the rule, since they are much better known for their aliases. - Henryacores^ 20:03, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

Coming from the Ultimania? Who said so, Kappa? I passed his claim of Reno's last name to a friend at Lifestream.net, a site that specializes in Ultimania translations, and he denounced it as nonsense. I can't find anything about Angelo in the translations of the FF8 Ultimania they have, and given his past I'm inclined to disbelieve Kappa's claims. If he got this information from the Ultimania, I either want a scan of the page if he has the book himself, or a link to where he read it if it's from a website. Doreiku Kuroofangu 20:10, May 8, 2011 (UTC)
My mistake, not Kappa, been there for a while. I looked through the edit history and it's Bluer who added this detail. I'm gonna ask where he got it from though. Also, "Gabranth and Red XIII are exceptions to the rule, since they are much better known for their aliases" - you can make precisely the same argument for Angelo. Edge and Balthier are exceptions as well. Doreiku Kuroofangu 20:13, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

Found a source; the other translations alongside Angelo are consistent with The Lifestream's, so I think it's legit. [1] Dazuro 20:16, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

Forums are not known to be reliable sources of knowledge. Ever heard of "Chinese Whispers"? Jeppo (Talk | contribs) 20:19, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

Never said they were. But this poster has posted nothing but previously-confirmed Ultimania translations along with the Angelo information, indicating that they come from the same source. And why the hell would he post a crapton of official information alongside a random throwaway line about a dog's name that he made up? Dazuro 20:21, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

Gamespot/GameFAQs in particular, yeah not reliable. TheLifestream is a different matter, those guys have a reputation for translating stuff as a news site and not just a forum. This guy got the info second-hand, which is actually fortunately, I'll talk to Squall of SeeD to verify.
EDIT CONFLICT - "And why the hell would he post a crapton of official information alongside a random throwaway line about a dog's name that he made up?" - the same reason as any internet troll posts anything? Doreiku Kuroofangu 20:23, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

How about this article from before the game came out? [2] Dazuro 20:25, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

It is Angelo's "real name", but she's not once called that in the game or in the game manual. I think it'd look much better if the article was called Angelo and her full name is given in the article, like as a trivia, and probably mention where it comes from so as to not sound made-up. Most of the article is about gameplay, rather than about her "character" as she doesn't really have any story that could be attributed to her anyway.Keltainentoukokuu 23:47, May 8, 2011 (UTC)

Then let's remove Joanna, Mateus (though I think that should be removed anyway), Fury (Caraway), Faremis (Gast)... Consistency, people. Dazuro 02:13, May 9, 2011 (UTC)

Squall of SeeD replied, yes it's official. Doreiku Kuroofangu 02:40, May 9, 2011 (UTC)

Angelo's just not really much of a person, but a gameplay element. The best consistency is to have the name that makes the most sense. The dog's full name is more trivia than anything. Like really should we go and edit all the other articles also to say Sant Angelo di Roma instead of Angelo, such a Rinoa's article and the Limit Break article?Keltainentoukokuu 03:59, May 9, 2011 (UTC)

Are you sure it's her "real name" and not something like its etymology or something (like Tifa/Tiffany)? Because, last I checked, there's no Rome in the game and no Saints, let alone saint...dogs. Also I'm pretty sure Reno's last name is indeed Sinclair; if it's not in the FFVII Ultimania it must be from one the earlier Japanese guides. Bluetash 09:17, May 9, 2011 (UTC)

Sinclair is Reno's surname in fandom only, it's popularly used in fanfiction I understand. The Turks never have given surnames in the FF7 world. If you Google it a bit you'll find there is no official source for Reno's surname. And yeah, Sant Angelo di Roma is Angelo's full name. Other real world references in FFVIII are the genuine real world worldmap in Raine's pub (Laguna flashback only), a woman talking about Romeo and Juliet on the Timber train station, and there are probably others I'm not recalling right now.Keltainentoukokuu 16:55, May 9, 2011 (UTC)

Also, "Gabranth and Red XIII are exceptions to the rule, since they are much better known for their aliases" - you can make precisely the same argument for Angelo. Edge and Balthier are exceptions as well.

Happens that Gabranth, Red XIII, Edge and Balthier are aliases. Dagger, despite having an alias, is commonly refered to as Garnet. Angelo, unfortunately, is no alias. It's part of the dog's full name. It should stay. - Henryacores^ 18:02, May 9, 2011 (UTC)


Putting aside the argument over other characters, I have to say that people are going to be searching for "Angelo." Whatever we decide, there should be a redirect at least with that name so it can be searched and will come up in the suggestions. There should also be a mention of the full name prominently displayed, even if we don't have it as the page name.
Now, arguing other characters, when it comes to having an alias, the alias should be used if it's treated as the character's default name for the sake of the game. Garnet is called Garnet both before and after she takes her alias and it's thus her proper name. Red XIII is called Red XIII by default and introduces himself as such before you name him. You only learn his real name is Nanaki later. Thus Red XIII is his default name. Gabranth goes by Gabranth for, I dunno, probably most of the game before you learn his real name.
So, in short, when an alias is involved, you need to look at what the person actually goes by for the most part.
Finally, my opinion on Angelo: I think that when the name is part of a full name, the full name should be the page name, even if it's not said in-game. Nobody in an RPG uses their full name in-game. It's in The Grand List Of Console Role Playing Game Clichés. Bad guys go by last name, good guys go by first name, pretty much always and forever. In Angelo's case, I think we need a redirect for sure to help people with search completion, but the page name should be the full name.
It's OBVIOUS Angelo redirects here... - Henryacores^ 19:44, May 9, 2011 (UTC)
Well, yes, it does, but what I was trying to get across was the search completion. I just wanted to make sure that we would be having that when all was said and done. I haven't really worked with redirects yet and can't say I'm 100% on the ins and outs of them. >>; Bluestarultor Best-of Stellar Arena sigicon BSA 21:23, May 9, 2011 (UTC)
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