Gilgamesh: Enough expository banter!
This talk page is used for discussing improvements to the page "Aevis Killer". It is not the place for general discussion or sharing stories about the topic of this article.

Where is this known as "Avis Killer"? - Henryacores^ 00:51, January 24, 2013 (UTC)

If I had to guess, based on the names of the pictures, it would be the Airborne Brigade's version of the weapon. Since that was the most recent translation of it, the page name would have been changed to that. Now that ATB uses Aevis again, it would have to be changed back again. This back-and-forth silliness is one reason I do not support the whole idea of compulsively going with the most recent translation, and instead support naming the page whatever the majority of the references use. Espritduo (talk) 01:01, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
We base the page names on majority. If there isn't one, then we refer to most recent. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 01:09, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
And Aevis Killer is the majority. And it is now also the most recent as well! So....? Espritduo (talk) 01:10, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
I don't see any names for Dimensions, AB, or ATB there, or else I'd have moved it. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 01:12, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
We base the name on the most recent and recurring. The most recent example of two-consecutive matching names (that aren't just part of the same sub-series) --since that proves it's not an exception. If SE start to translate things differently why should we continue to use an older name? JBed (talk) 01:16, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
I've never seen that practice used. And even if SE starts to translate it differently, we stick with the more recurring name because that's what more people will be searching for, unless you want to use the argument that more people will be searching for the most recent games, which I don't agree with. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 01:19, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
I agree. If FF started calling Cactuars Sabotenders in FFXIV and FFXV (and having already called them thus in FFXI, they might, you never know), we would still call them Cactuars. That still begs the question as to why this page is still named Avis Killer when the only game in the entire series to call it that is Airborne Brigade, which is both non-majority, non-recurring, and obsolete. I can change it, right? Espritduo (talk) 01:23, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
A more recurring name is normally given priority to a new name in a more recent installment. If # names have the same number of appearances, the most recent is used. - Henryacores^ 01:26, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
What are the names for it in Dimensions and ATB? - +DeadlySlashSword+ 01:27, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
Aevis Killer in both. EDIT: Actually, looking at the Final Fantasy Dimensions weapons page, it is Avis Killer in Dimensions. Still, most recent and most recurring, and most correct is still Aevis Killer. (NB: not the most correct)Espritduo (talk) 01:30, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
Only in the fanslation of FFV, though, which we should never consider unless it's all we've got to go on. PSX FFV's was the wonderful "Ab Splitter" and Advance is Aevis Killer. Espritduo (talk) 03:10, January 24, 2013 (UTC)

Hang on: So if SE started translating Phoenix Down to "Phoenix Tail" instead, you expect us to wait for them to release 32 games with that name before we move the page? 10:11, January 24, 2013 (UTC)

If there are 32 games in a row that use Phoenix Down, then yes, we'd need a helluva lot of games to justify changing the name of the page that represents every Phoenix Down in the series to a name that only represents a tiny portion of them, recent or not. 32 games? Probably not. But definitely more than two or three, especially if they aren't main games. It takes time for new names to be accepted as the de facto for something, both in real life and in FF. Espritduo (talk) 12:18, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
The wiki tries to use the most recent translation for everything. This is always the case for single-appearance games.
But we don't just use the most recent translation for recurring pages because sometimes translations are an exception.
And we don't take into account two "exception" translations if they are part of the same sub-series because they could have decided to use a different name system for that (e.g. Ivalice's "Magick"). Included in this may also be games that take names from other games... like ATB, Dissidia, et al.
But if we have two consecutive unrelated most-recent games calling it by the same "exception name", then it seems to make it quite clear SE are changing how they translate something. It's SE's intention. And we would assume that if SE were to re-release every game they'd ever done to date they would update the name in all of those (except in the case of Cactuar where they like to give alternate names-- if we can make a case for something being an exception then it can be an exception).
Anyway, stuff written at the naming policy. If we decide on something we have to update it. I'm completely against being the only deciding factor-- and recent games definitely needs to come into it. JBed (talk) 12:49, January 24, 2013 (UTC)
I don't think we really disagree here. I agree that # of games should not be the only deciding factor, but neither should most recent. It should be a balancing act between the two, with best judgment and general consensus being the deciding factor in sticky cases. In general, it should be the more # of games a name already has under its belt, the more most-recents it's going to need to justify changing the name. For something as time-honored and established as, say, the Phoenix Down, just two consecutive main series games with something different just isn't enough. I would say at least three, preferably four. And then hope it never comes to something like that for something like a Phoenix Down.
Anyways, this page really needs renamed, right? I mean, there's no argument on this page that it should be Aevis Killer, right? I honestly can't remember if I have to power to rename articles or not. Do I need to suppress redirects and some junk? Espritduo (talk) 01:15, January 25, 2013 (UTC)
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