Final Fantasy XII, widely believed to be the rebirth of what may have been a dying series. I know for a fact that if it wasn't for this game, I never would have played another Final Fantasy again after X-2, XI, and Advent Children. So what's your deal, fanboys? What is your problem with one of the greatest games ever made? I have heard waaaayy too many comments about how much people hate this game, and yet have heard no good reasons. So I want to know. What's up? | |||
I know what you mean, people think that FFVII is a gift from god, well, XII is. Give me one good reason to hate it. I'm waiting. *Starts humming a tune* | |||
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It's just that they're not used to switching items on the fly me thinks. At least one reason is that bosses are insanely hard if you don't use this to your advantage. On another note, I managed to somehow beat Elder Wyrm without knowing how to switch items inbattle lol | |||
Here's a guess. Personal preference. It's probably the people who are used to the turn based and active time, random encounter battles and don't like how they changed it so drastically. It might be that they don't like the blatant ripoff of Star Wars. The story is so similar it's not even funny. And the battle system's similar to KotOR 2 (Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords). | |||
Proboly the same reason others hate FF7, over milking by the "heads" and fanboys claiming it's the best thing ever. And the Star Wars thing too. | |||
Moogle_king - Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chocobo TALK - i have no need time,do you? {{{time}}} | |||
here the reason why i don't like it and maybe why fanboys don't like it either:The story is not fresh.I heard it before but in just bit and pieces made by some rpg company.The ff12 battle system shocked the hell out of us which is what oath stated. even chorno trigger was good because it was different but not too different to have fans not like it.FF12 however....blow the whole damn case open with its a new everything in it.Now,we hate it more because it paved the way to have final fantasy rgps with mmorpg gameplay.But here to the old ff games and maybe a ff7 remake, and rpgs made by mistwalker. | |||
I actually don't think the story is that much like Star wars, of course there are a lot of things like balthier and fran and the strahl that make you think is star wars but apart from that the game is pretty original. ALSO I don't think Vaan is a reason to hate the game. Vaan is just a boy that got stucked in the middle of this war with his friend penelo, both lost everything at the war and now they want peace. Another thing, Balthier is definitively not the main character of the game, Ashe is. | |||
Not fresh? Take a look at the previous Final Fantasies, they're all so cliche'd that it isn't funny anymore, you can just predict what's the overture, what's the climax and what's the ending tune:
Crystal issues
Rebel with a princess, the Emperor wants to rule the world.
More crystal issues
Fairyrtale; oh sure, there's also the "I'm your brother and I'm jealous of you, and therefore I will submit to the darkside, and destroy you.
Moar crystal issues
Again, rebels with a deranged clown, also "destroy the world issues"
Adrogynous here with a hazy past; Pretty boy as a villain, also destroy the world issues.
You do not want my fingerprint in this one.
Perhaps the most original story, though somewhat similar to Final Fantasy IV
Bitch, "destroy the world!" Oh yeah, a lousy dresser who consumes about 80% of hair gel per day femine sub-villain.
Perhaps also moar "destroy the world" issues.
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Thanks, N/A. You expressed my point a lot much more better than me ^^ | |||
Moogle_king - Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chocobo TALK - i have no need time,do you? {{{time}}} | |||
You belittled the final fantasy games like its nothing but you made ff12 important?FF12 got pretty boys in it.The charcters are identical too.Han solo was in to get money,not save the world.Luke Skywalker wanted to explore the world like vann too,so yes,they are identical to me.Villan taking to take over land.Check.There was backstorys in other ff so if ff games are not orginal ff12 ain't either.Its just another chip in the pile. | |||
But you forget. Star Wars is awesome. One cannot fault anything for wanted to be like Star Wars. And taking over the world is very different from what most Final Fantasy villains want: to destroy the world. Conquer and destroy. Very different plans. PS: There are these things called capital letters in English. You may want to use them if you want to seem like you know what you are talking about. Also there are spaces between sentences. We don't use Internet Speak here. This wiki is sophisticated. | |||
Whether it was too much like Star Wars or not does not change the fact that it was an awsome story. All of you have talked about how its unoriginal but being unoriginal does not change whether it was good or not. No one has stated a reason that it was bad. If you are going to nail this for not being original you can't ignore the fact that ffI-VI all pretty much were the same thing, but this does not make them any less awsome. Also, liking something because it has pretty boys in it or because other people drool over it is a horrible attitude to have. You people critisize these games waaaaaaaay too much. This is a FAN site, just enjoy the games. I haven't hated any of the games in the series, I love all of them =). I'm still waiting for a reason why this game is so horrible. Not to mention, FFXII has a far greater story than star wars in my opinion. | |||
Nope, Balthier never intended to get money nor the Nethicite, he got sidetracked until the village of Golmore Jungle, where Fran warns that Balthier is losing his original goal. He only wanted to settle the score with his deranged father. EDIT: It's my review, so I get to crush and deal anything ruthlessly about it. Heck, maybe you guys will notice that all games has it's flaws and pros. And I agree with Booff7's remark. FFXII's storyline is better than Starwars, at least there's no fancy weapons. | |||
Final Fantasy better than Star Wars??? Don't be silly. For example. Vayne's goals honarable? Maybe. But Star Wars produces the most badass of badass villains. And heroes. http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t296/link599/Revan.jpg Revan. The ultimate warrior, conquerer, savior, destroyer, helper and all around badass all rolled into one. He makes Master Chief and Link look small time. There is absolutely no villain or hero that equals Revan. For more information on the ultimate badass, see here. | |||
bob the geomancer - Do you know what cancer is? it is a piece of evil. TALK - I had a dog once. cancer overtook him {{{time}}} | |||
i've never played FFXII but it sounds good but you know whats even better kirby!!!!!!! | |||
Apparently, people have no idea what an archetype is and/or didn't really pay attention to Matsuno's other games and/or are stuck in the 80s. | |||
Yeah, the jaded older hero that guides the young hero with his knowledge of the world is as old as the freakin' hills. Han Solo just happens to be the only example that many of these sad uncultured youths have ever seen. Just how redeemable scoundrels have their been in literature? Far too many to count. And they will keep on coming. | |||
Moogle_king - Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chocobo TALK - i have no need time,do you? {{{time}}} | |||
But now we have to put up with these lameass games with thier story because ff12 and other rgps probably going to be clones of ff12 and 13 and every game going to be unoriginal,boring,mmorpg gameplay and so on,copying ff 12 and 13. | |||
Good thing that FFXII had a good story. And FFXIII is not going to be a clone of XII at all. Just read the page, they are nothing alike. We are on the verge of another revolution my freind. I for one, am very excited. And how was FFXII's gameplay unorigninal? The Gambit System was completely a new thing. You could never do that before in any other RPG. Infinite possibilities in life, and all you can do is whine. How sad. | |||
Moogle_king - Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chocobo TALK - i have no need time,do you? {{{time}}} | |||
how sad.you misunderstand what i said.i meant that the rpg games made by other companies probably going to copy the ff12 and ff13 games.plus,i seen ff12 out of vargrant story and some other games.so read carefully next time. | |||
I actually like XII a lot, even though I'd consider myself a fanboy. | |||
Finally someone besides me makes a good point, thank you Booff7. I can think of a reason why "fanboys" hate FFXII, because its different. Not so different but it has taken a turn(somewhat backwards turn imo) than what people have gotten used to, and some people are afraid of change, kind of like FFVI and under fanboys (EPSECIALLY FFVI fanboys!) I don't personally have much of a problem with FFXII, but I kind of wish the battle system could have been like Crisis Core. Now I am aware that CC came out after FFXII but the battle system was amazing in my opinion. I think it should have been as "speedy" and then it would have been perfect for me, and alot of other people. In my opinion Square takes too many spins and turns, they should have stuck with their newer styles instead of trying to be like FFVI and under which ended up not doing so well. I am not saying its bad, but it seems like they tried to appeal to the FFI-VI fans who are always irate about the newer games, but it ended up not being exactly like it. And then the so-called "fanboys" didn't like it because they too were afraid of change. Everyone gets a taste of their own disappointment, and you guys shouldn't complain that someone doesn't like what you do. | |||
man, I envy you. You got to play Crisis Core, so what's the battle system like? | |||
It's actually alot like XII, only quicker, and a little simpler. The DMW (Digital Mind Wave) system is cool, because you'd always get some kind of surprise. Some people would think it is horrible, because you can't choose the limit break, but its actually pretty fun, because no matter what happens, things usually go in your favor. I didn't like that you only had a limited amount of material slots however, even though it gradually gets bigger. I suggest going to the offical site link title. I can't wait for the american release, I've beaten the japanese version twice, and it got a little too easy (excluding alot of the harder side missions ofcourse) | |||
I bet it has everything to do with nostalgia. Some people have more turn-based nostalgia than others though and they cannot see that this is probably the most innovative RPG made since Final Fantasy II. | |||
Well I have played FF games since 6 came out(i've also played the earlier ones) and they are all great games with new things in all of them. At first FFXII is a little wierd having to watch your characters stand around a monster waiting for their ATB to fill up, Especially since i had just beaten KH2 and was used to the nonstop fighting. I eventually got used to it and it grew on me. The sidequests were fun, and the story isn't horrible its just Political and most people who have played only FFVII - FFX aren't used to it. One thing i disliked though was that every character, except Fran, has blondish hair. It's not diverse enough. Especially since they all can equip every weapon and use every spell. It seems like their all just different models that can all do the same thing. Just don't compare it to other final fantasies because its a totally different game and its still amazing on its own. | |||
on FFXII international, you can choose the job of every character and there are twelve different license boards for every job class | |||
Quickly. First, i did not read the whole page yet. Second, XII doesn't suck because it's like Star Wars, that's just why Baltheir sucks (he's a bad rip off of Han Solo). I don't like the battle system, but it's okay. Next, how do you switch weapons on the go? I beat the Elder Wyrm, but what is this with switching items? Also, OtO, Revan does not help you in saying Star Wars is better than Final Fantasy (which it is). Revan isn't a real Sith Lord, he's lame. Vader and The Emperor are the only real Sith Lords. -- Drake
You go into the menu, select equipment, and then adjust. You may not know this, but you can actually change your weapons in many Final Fantasy games. FFIII, FFV, Final Fantasy Tactics all come to mind. I don't remember any others, but trust me: this is not a new thing. | |||
There's FFII. Sometimes I think the whole Freelancer ways of FFXII are taken from FFII, where pretty much everyone's a Freelancer. Heck, you can even make the Dragoon a master mage if you have the time for it. By the way, thanks BH on the whole Internet Speak post. | |||
Revean was a real sith lord before the game.I wish i got to see what revean's past was like.Anyway,FF12 is boring unless you know where to go and what to do.I didn't know where to go or what to do. | |||
I just didn't find the story very catchy. I usually prefere games where you want to proceed in the game because the story is made of awesome, rather than because you did all the side quests possible and you have to force yourself to proceed, in order to unlock more sidequests, because quite simply, they are far more interesting than the main story. | |||
Agree with Hecko, FFXII's story sucks. The best stories in the series are IV, VI, VII, IX, X, and Tactics. The sidequests in XII weren't that great anyways as well.
I am definitively not going to change anyones opinion about the story but I think the story is equally or even better than the sidequests. The story is actually very exciting. This huge war and how to stop it... | |||
Am I the only one who finds political dramas and intrigue compelling? | |||
If compelling means something good then I'm with you, if not, well then I'm not with you | |||
I thought that XII wasn't bad. I can see why people complain about the story though. BH, it is really good except that I think people just get bored at some parts. I liked XII's story but it was somewhat boring at times and hard to get interested. Once you do though it's really one of the better ones. | |||
bob the geomancer - Do you know what cancer is? it is a piece of evil. TALK - I had a dog once. cancer overtook him {{{time}}} | |||
i liked FF as an turn taking thing. i mean yes FFXII was a good game, but it now means that i have lost my turn taking battle system, which is what i really liked. FFXII's gameplay wasn't bad but now it means i have two legend of zelda-like games. | |||
I'm just glad it got rid of the random encounters. It makes seem a little more realistic...for a fantasy game. Okay, that makes almost no sense, but you know what I mean right? Anyway, I always got "random" encounters when all but one of my party was dead, and that guy/girl was in critical health, and I was 3 steps away from leaving the dungeon. I hate random encounters. | |||
CK has a point, random encounters can be really hateful when you need to get out from an extra-hard dungeon. that's make me remember when I was going to kill scarmiglione on FFIV. god! I had so many encounters before killing him! | |||
@CK, maybe you should train more then? @Nelo, yeah you really ticked me off by belittling all of the FF games and make 12 seem super good. XII-so cliche, a kingdom destroyed now a group of rebels must band together against the superevil empire. XII is A LOT more complicated and deep than that and so are all of the other FF games (except X-2), so do me a favor and don't treat the others like crap by making one you like seem better. Oh and look at your description of FFII, you could say the exact same thing for XII and replace emperor with Vayne. | |||
Boy, you really hate XII huh? By the way, my description was during training. | |||
I hate it when they belittle every damn game or movie in a series but they make one special.just like with ff,star wars,mega man,mario,sonic,metal gear soid,godfather and halo.They are all damn good but there is a fan boy or girl that can't keep their mouth shut and babble about how one is better and how you completely disagree with that person. | |||
Its strange how every single thing you mentioned as an example are all excellent games/movies. What in the world is wrong with The Godfather? | |||
He didn't say there was anything wrong with it. Read the whole comment. Congrats on completeing your walkthrough, by the way. @Seifer: Well said. | |||
Thank you,Chief.I love all them things,but there is always a person saying that it sucks. Summary:Some people need to Shut the hell up.period. | |||
I personally liked it, but there were some things about it I did not enjoy. First of all, the story was good, but the characters were all pretty bad (yes including Balthier). None of the characters really developed any bonds throughout the story, and I felt like something was missing the whole time. The fighting was fun and new. It was great that even when you leveled up the fights were just got better. The bad thing about that was that eventually gambits kinda took over the gaming part of the game. To fight, pick up items, and heal status effects all you needed to do was walk around the dungeons. Two complaints in an otherwise amazing game. | |||
I'm playing through both at the minute. I'm a big fan of the turn based action from VII and when I first played XII I was a little less than impressed with the battle system. I thought it was too much of a step away from what Final Fantasy should be. Now that I've been playing through XII for a while longer I've gotten used to the system, and dare I say it, I like it! Storywise I think they're both interesting and engaging. To rule either out because they use already common themes like rebellion, rivalry, loss, or whatever it may be is in my opinion stupid! And just because characters embody traditional archetypes doesn't mean they're a rip off. | |||
I don't hate XII at all, I hate that people belittle all the games in the series except for their favorite. As for the politcal drama aspect for the story, Tactics's story is better. | |||
I like XII. To an extent. But hey, frankly I think people are starting to worship it on the level of FF7 fanboy-ism. It hasn't reached that stage yet, but it will, and that annoys me. I mean, its good, but it ain't so good you need to worship it... Besides, so what if people don't like it and you do? I mean, everyone is entitled to their own opinion right? So if people moan about it, let them moan, I say. | |||
It's an okay game obviously, and has nice characters, but it's too much of a departure from the original formula for Some fans of the series, but XIII is going to be the same battle system so quit bitchin'!! | |||
Although I've never played FFXII, I have seen the gameplay and I think it's great. Just because the gameplay is diffrent isn't a reason to hate it. But hey, if people are gonna find stupid reasons to hate games, that's there problem. | |||
I hated XII. 'Nuff said. Maybe I would've liked it more if they didn't put the two words 'Final' and 'Fantasy' in the title, as well as the roman numeral. I'll just say I hated everything. Just like how you people hate VIII. Heck, I even made this tiny website once about how horrible XII was. (I didn't bother reading through this whole page) I guess this will start a flame war, huh?--Born from Darkness 03:37, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
Every post I've read so far has made a decent point and counterpoint, but permit me to ask this. If you are going to bash a game you more than likely have never gotten past the first 10 hours of total playtime, why even bother to bash it if you don't even know the rest of the game's story or gameplay niceties? Granted, some Final Fantasy games may seem harder than others, but as far as XII goes, I welcome the challenges and changes like the Gambit System and whatnot. Comparing one game to another outside of their respective series is ignorant and asinine, in my humble opinion. Arguments over who reigns as the supreme video game series is an endless debate by fans and will never end as long as games are around. Just my two cents and some change... | |||
You are right. FFXII gets very exciting at the yensan sandsea. The first is partly good | |||
I love all of the FF games but, as far as gameplay and visual beauty goes FFXII is my favorites thus far. A ton of things also reminded me of Vagrant Story. (Loved that game.....WHERES MY SEQUAL SQUARE!?!?) I squeeled like a rabid fanboy when I saw the similar artwork, menus, colors, and music tracks. Also, if you play FFXII enough you'd realize it has aspects and characters taken from almost all Final Fantasy titles. It had music from some of the older games, characters, character names and similarities. Some battles would remind you of one of the older titles; like the Gilgamesh battle and the chosen music for it. Monsters and Espers were taken from nearly every main FF title. The fighting WAS turn based but, it was just a faster paced turn based system for a new age and time. However, weren't there options to not use it and use a more traditional system? Or am I not remembering correctly? | |||
I agree with Some Color Mage about not counting Vaan as a reason. XD | |||
Oh and I think that FFXII's the best. 8D | |||
I love XII. In my book it's tied for #1 with VII(yes VII! And I've been playing FF for years!). I agree it had faults, like so many fair-skinned people living in the middle of a DESERT. Plus I wish it had a little more humor and charm(Ashe wardrobe malfunction anyone?)But those faults weren't enough to keep me from enjoying an FF with a more grown-up plot. | |||
Is it just me or are a lot of old topics being bumped recently?
Vayne's story is great... everything about Vayne is good too. Vaan and Penelo sucks and the battle-system isn't liked by me. The other characters are good. But I like the FFX-2's battle system. ILHI 19:14, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
someone new must be replying. I only just saw this at the top today. I didn't know how old it was. | |||
I personally thinks FFXII is a great game, the story is really mature, I understand some VII-X-2 fanboys cant get used with politics, diplomacy and that the bad guys dont always destroys worlds. This goes to another point: The bad guys arent pure evil and the good guys arent saints. This makes FFXII a really realistic game where there's no black and white, only darker or lighter gray. The non-random encounter's a great move too, it's realistic and it removes the annoyingness of a near death character in a minefield. Next: Versitality, you can shape your team anyway you want: a melee badass or magic champ, or both, it's all yours to decide. Then you're not sure who's the main protagonist. Vaan is technically one. Ashe is logically one. Balthier is Traditionally one. Hell, even Basch is a "Kain-like" protagonist. And dont forget, if it wasnt for Penelo getting kidnapped by Ba'Gamman and Vaan ask Balthier to save her, the party would never go to Bhujerba and really start the adventure. | |||
theanonymousfangirl - If you leave me tonight, I'll wake up alone... TALK - Maybe there's a way out... {{{time}}} | |||
I think FF12 has strengths and weaknesses, but so do all games. I must admit I didn't love FF12, and have honestly stopped playing because the first 7 hours bored the hell out of me, and I have a terrible attention span and cannot be forced to wait for something to get interesting. However, the battle system was a new turn from the usual turn-based-in-a-line-type-formation battle system(but I was nostalgic for that. Haha) And I don't like how the characters can be strong in both magic and strength. And Vaan was...very insignificant for me. For the first SEVEN hours(and for me, that is a lot...), he seems to have very little personality...so yeah... However, when it comes to plot, this is very mature and different from the others, and I can see how Square Enix has matured in making their plots, but a bit more fleshing out in the early parts of the game would have been better, I suppose. Graphics are amazing. So basically, it's a game. It has good and bad sides to it. Every game does, so stop endlessly praising it or endlessly shunning it. I haven't exactly heard of a perfect game yet, so stop expecting it to be perfect by denying its flaws or denying it has anything good about it. | |||
Final Fantasy XII has way too LAME story, and the battle system sucks. It really does. Charaters are also boring (Except Fran ;P) and looting takes too much time if you really need money. Well, maybe I need to give another shot for XII, but I think it wont change my opinion. | |||
Gambits kick ass, the story was good (not great), most of the characters were interesting (Except Vaan), The battle system was awesome, and the Marks system rocked. If you want to complain about a bad square enix game, then whine about The Last Remnants the framerate sucked, the dialouge was horrible, cutscenes were too long, and the story overall was boring. | |||
It's really only your opinion. One can hate Final Fantasy XII for being different and tedious at times. However, some people such as I, can look at the game and see it as intuitive, a new step, and a fun game. There's nothing wrong with someone's opinion, and this forum looks as if disliking Final Fantasy XII is wrong. There is nothing wrong with it at all. | |||
I think it's only wrong to criticize a game if you haven't either played it or played enough of it. You should at least reserve judgement until so much hours of gameplay. Those who played the first two dungeons and say "this sucks" have nothing, yet if you force yourself to get through a substantial part of it(which you should, since somebody had to pay for it), then you can decide if it's good or not. If people can get through X and its insufferable cast, getting through half of XII can't be that much torture. If you finish it and still don't like it, you don't like it, but you know enough to know you don't like it. See what I'm saying? | |||
I can understand Initial Realitys point, but maybe I can say that XII is lame after over 20 hours of gameplay (Dont get me wrong, I´m here not to argue.)? | |||