Week 220: Last Man Standing Round 22: Kefka v. Tifa[edit source]

LMS Icon.png
VICTORY - 24½ to 18½
DEFEAT - 24½ to 18½
The Last Man Standing Championship has been proven to be quite difficult to hold onto in these past weeks, with two champions being defeated in their first round. Will Kefka share that same fate, or will Tifa stand no match for him? Who will be the Last Man Standing?

Votes for Kefka[edit source]

  1. You sound like lines from a self-help book! SetzerLeonhart (talk) 01:25, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  2. C A T U S E 01:28, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I've got sand on my boots! --Pzykosiz (talk) 01:41, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Sorry babe, I only hurt you because I'm a sadistic prick! Drake Clawfang (talk) 01:43, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  5. "My, what a rude missy!" King of Noobs 01:51, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Dance, dance!  Cecily Redwingslogo.png  02:07, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Wait he says! Do I look like a waiter? --Ffgamesftw (talk) 05:17, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  8.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 07:42, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  9.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 10:32, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Run! Run! Or you'll be well done! --ClixPsi (talk) 11:26, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Not gonna let you die quickly...! Dogurasu (talk) 11:40, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Dancing mad, no?  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png12:40, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Because he's best villain.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 13:18, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  14. -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 17:04, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  15. "There's a reason oppose rhymes with dispose... If they get in your way, kill them!" - Nope, still haven't run out of quotes. MirrorshardSceada 20:46, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Kefkef. I like him only slightly more. My apologies to Ms.Lockhart...CylindrusAltum (talk) 10:18, October 30, 2012 (UTC)
  17. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 14:03, October 30, 2012 (UTC)
  18. For some unknown motive, I always found Aeris to shine a lot more than Tifa as a character. Besides, no mere mortal can beat the God of Magic. JC Holy Knight 00:09, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Sadistic maniacal clowns make for the best characters! Free bird (talk) 23:34, October 30, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Dance, dance! JuriSuzukiDissicon ff8 Squ1.png13:22, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
  21. ScatheMote 18:19, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
  22. As much as I think Tifa is a good character (and hot), her personality is far less interesting when compared to Kefka's. There's just something appealing about his insane persona, that drives his fan-base. I also might as well throw in a Kefka quote, many others have. "From beyond the chaos, the end draws near..." --Time Master (talk) 18:38, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Cooky560 (talk) 00:27, November 3, 2012 (UTC) My vote seemed to have gone!
  24. *Insert any random Kefka quote here* (This ought to do.) Unsane (talk) 00:21, November 4, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 14:58, October 29, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Tifa[edit source]

  1. Those are some gloves right there.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 01:22, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 01:33, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Gundamz. --BlueHighwind 02:00, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  4.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 02:28, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  5. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 05:39, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Too many quotes here, my eyes bleed - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 07:58, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  7. For know particular reason 'cept I like Tifa betterSquallisnotemo (talk) 09:22, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  8. You're gonna carry that weight (READ: anti-landslide vote). SidVI 12:41, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Because I really look up to her. Rosenarm Brina-PSP-BattleSprite.png 18:39, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  10. I stated that I would do everything in my power against the sadist, and unto that I hold. Tifa may have beaten Sabin in this very Colosseum when the two of them came to fisticuffs, but if I must stand beside her now in order to see this undeserving destroyer fall, so be it. EdgarXTerra4ever 20:36, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  11. "Mock me and I'll squash you!" (Dissidia 012 intro; Tifa vs. anyone) SelkieMaiden267 22:50, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  12. "I'll show you Zangan's secret technique!"  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 23:04, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Just because. MissH <3 10:51, October 30, 2012 (UTC)
  14. like her better Cloudn 08:16, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
  15. --Leon95 20:42, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
  16. --Xardia (talk) 14:13, November 1, 2012 (UTC)She just has to Win because she's my Idol!
  17. Pizza enywen? Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 00:41, November 2, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 06:57, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 00:35, October 30, 2012 (UTC) Simply because she is not a sadist.
  3. Because Kefka beat Garnet, and I like Tifa even more than Garnet.-- 06:33, November 5, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Wonder how long it'll take for you guys to run out of Kefka quotes ;) Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 11:40, October 29, 2012 (UTC)

Between the multiple versions of FFVI and both Dissidia games, that may be a little tricky.
Small note, some of you may noticed I deleted quite a few exclamation marks from the page. Well, the spam filter, for whatever reason, is now blocking two or more exclamation marks in a row, which meant that this page, with the mix of some people overdoing it and our nice friendly "do not edit below this line" messages would refuse to save. :| I just took the liberty of making the page usable again as it'd be quicker than going to VSTF about it. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 12:25, October 29, 2012 (UTC)

@E&T: Been working on your formal language in the hopes of sounding like Edgar for the next fight or two (or maybe more), haven't you? ;) SelkieMaiden267 22:56, October 29, 2012 (UTC)

As a matter of fact, yes, I have. Someone needs to speak out against such a spiteful, rancorous, ill-natured atrocity as the undeserving clownish fiend, after all. EdgarXTerra4ever 00:18, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
Call me foolish, but this now has me looking forward to hopefully three more fights with Kefka, just so I can enjoy what well-worded votes you'll cast MirrorshardSceada 12:09, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
For the record, I may have a natural anti-villain bias, but I only ever "pull out all the stops" like that for villains of the Complete Monster type (like Kefka). EdgarXTerra4ever 18:03, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
You know the fact that you hate Kefka means that he is a good villain. Now let me explain that comment. Hate for a villain can mean 1 of 2 things generally either A. The Villain is Lame or annoying or B. The Villain is despicable and you want nothing more then for them to be defeated. Based on your comments you sound like you hate Kefka because he is B a despicable character which he indeed is. But that is a villains job is to be hated. If you like the villain why would you feel the need to stop them? So I like Kefka because he does an excellent job at being despised. He is great because of how evil he is if that makes sense. Would I like him as a person? Hell no --Ffgamesftw (talk) 03:16, November 5, 2012 (UTC)
I understand your hatred, and - despite being a Cultist of Kefka (or perhaps because of it) - I encourage it. However, my reasoning is thus: Any villain or hero is, in part, defined by his or her nemesis or nemeses, not just because Kefka is himself a Complete Monster. Thus, Edgar and Terra are, in part, defined by how they fought against Kefka, and vice versa (to say nothing of the other Returners). To deny one of them so absolutely is, well, odd in my opinion; however, I do not deny you your right to speak as you desire. (In fact, I am rather fond of your eloquence.) Dogurasu (talk) 18:08, October 31, 2012 (UTC)
Well, shy little Terra wouldn't be the Returner who makes rallying anti-Kefka speeches, would she? Charismatic Edgar is obviously more suited to the job. (Unless you thought Celes, being the one to re-gather the Returners after the Apocalypse, should be the one who speaks for them all...) -_^ EdgarXTerra4ever 20:41, October 31, 2012 (UTC)

I have a very good theory*(in fact, maybe it is very stupid at all): people like overthrows. Look at the champions: Kuja and Garland, Kefka (possibly, he is winning right now) and Gestahl, and Cecil...well, he sort of overthrew his dark side at Mt. Ordeals. JC Holy Knight 00:35, October 31, 2012 (UTC)

Week 219: Tifa Lockhart v. Wakka[edit source]

DNC Versus.png
FFX Wakka Art.png
31 - 10½
This week, we have a clash between two characters who apparently like bucking the system and taking a chance. When it comes to their respective ultimate attacks, both Tifa and Wakka have Slots or Reels, despite not having any similarities to the Gambler job class by default. Who will risk it all and come out on top? VICTOR
31 - 10½

Votes for Tifa[edit source]

  1. Bayreporta (talk) 04:27, October 23, 2012 (UTC)Tifa was a complicated character, both in the narrative and in gameplay. If you used her right, she was a powerful character in the early game and extremely adept at transitioning into a command/offensive magic character. She was also memorable.
  2. Bigots with stupid haircuts have no place in the DNC... or anywhere else for that matter.C A T U S E 04:07, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Not even a debate. Even if I hadn't played FFVII I'd say she was better then Wakka. I truthfully like Tifa though and not cause of her being a fanservice character--Ffgamesftw (talk) 05:43, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Wakka is an ignoramus. Tifa on the other hand is a decent character. Granted she should probably get over Cloud already because its apparent the man has the emotional stability of a five year old. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 06:13, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  5. I smell a landslide... and Tifa. Too inappropriate? That's my Final Heaven.CylindrusAltum 15:49. October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  6.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 14:06, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  7. I'm not really a fan of Tifa, but she's against a character I hate a lot, so my vote's easy. SetzerLeonhart (talk) 14:27, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Always liked Tifa, even outside of her original game.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 14:37, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  9. I'm not a big fan of Tifa, but Wakka is the antithesis of everything good in the world. ScatheMote 15:01, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  10. SidVI 15:01, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Easy choice for me, Wakka was an intolerant, racist, jerk for much of FFX, while Tifa was always a much nicer, and better character. However, this might be considered a more Anti-Wakka, than Pro-Tifa vote. --Time Master (talk) 15:08, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  12. I really like both. Okay, I really hate when Wakka is a big meanie, like Rikku's said. But I don't understand why some people hates Tifa, she is such a nice person! It's because both, Aerith and Tifa are in love with Cloud?. I rather prefer to see Tifa with Cloud, by a very long shot! So my vote goes for her :) OerbaDiaNestyFarron (talk) 16:27, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  13. --ClixPsi (talk) 19:52, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  14. This vote needs no explanation whatsoever.  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 23:21, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Tifa doesn't need to be an overly exciting or amazing character, she excels in the area she's supposed to, which is to be the sweet, caring girl you ultimately want to end up in your arms at the end of the night. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 23:29, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  16.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 23:33, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Just because Tifa kicks ass. SelkieMaiden267 00:22, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  18. This is really hard for me to do...I love 'em both! But...My heart is saying to vote...for Tifa! JuriSuzukiDissicon ff8 Squ1.png00:31, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  19. I guess in this case it's really a matter of which I dislike less, which I suppose is just barely Tifa. Her I'm merely disappointed in, as opposed to Wakka, who, well... Jimcloud 00:32, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Meh --Pzykosiz (talk) 01:47, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  21. You can explain away Wakka's racism all you like, but it doesn't excuse the hairdo. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 04:30, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  22. used her instead of aerith Cloudn 06:53, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Hers was probably the best fight scene in Advent Children.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 16:41, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  24.  Cecily Redwingslogo.png  17:28, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  25. No hard feelings toward Wakka, despite him being a racist and all, but it's obvious who needs my vote even more. EdgarXTerra4ever 02:20, October 23, 2012 (UTC)
  26. Being very unfair. *cough* never played FFX *cough* But I do like Tifa. MissH <3 07:34, October 23, 2012 (UTC)
  27. Ha. --Leon95 19:12, October 24, 2012 (UTC)
  28. "Meh". Simply no other word can describe it. How quaint. Unsane (talk) 20:35, October 25, 2012 (UTC)
  29. It's hard not to vote for the world's only ginger Jamaican, but seeing the inevitable landslide due to boobs and, well, boobs...sorry Wakka, hope you understand, ya? Tia-LewiseDorky Face FF7.png 21:38, October 25, 2012 (UTC)
  30. I think it's funny Tifa's hated because she leans on the main character, and she's got boobs. And what's probably more funny is people expect FF7 nerds like me to get angry and jump to Tifa's defense. Look i'm not saying she isn't over rated... But she's certainly over hated. Razordash (talk) 21:52, October 26, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. I really like Tifa. She's nice, strong, and not jealous at all. Cloud goes crossdressing to save her. Wakka, I don't like very much. He's racist (although I give him points for reforming), has a stupid weapon, and most of all, at the star of the game, he promises Tidus food, and what does he do? "You do remember the prayer, right?" "Go present yourself to the temple Summoner." "Take a nap, you look bushed." *Runs off, doesn't cook*. 23:13, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 23:26, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Wakka[edit source]

  1. I think I'll vote for Wakka, he's begun to grow on me after my last playthrough of X. King of Noobs 04:07, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  2. He's cool, ya? - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 04:10, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I know, yaSquallisnotemo (talk) 09:25, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Well, I can tolerate him at the end of X.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png13:16, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  5. To anger VII's fanboys (or rather Tifa's). ;P —Kaimi (999,999 CP/5 TP) 15:31, October 21, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I'm not excusing Wakka's racism but to be fair he was brainwashed by a church.I feel pity for people who were indoctrinated into something so hateful. Bahamut knows best (talk) 04:28, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Shock vote, I'm sure. I'm somewhat inclined to say that Wakka at least has a fairly independent personal backstory (rather than leaning on the protagonist's), and at least by the end of X and in X-2 he became somewhat more respectable, unlike Tifa, who became a thinner character than the already thin VII incarnation, with added fanservice on top of existing fanservice -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 18:46, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  8. To piss off the VII fanbase, u mad bro? Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 19:37, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  9. To me, Tifa was never useful in my VII playthrough, whereas Wakka had his use for me in X. Apart from that, I don't really like either, so yeah. Wakka gets the vote this time MirrorshardSceada 20:08, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
  10. I'm not abstaining from this fight, ya? JC Holy Knight 00:39, October 29, 2012 (UTC).

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Go Wakka! 14:37, October 25, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Just give me a list of characters who you all hate so I know who to avoid in future fights.
Actually I thought of a better plan - Go and nominate fights so the characters you want to see will show up here! - +DeadlySlashSword+ 01:37, October 22, 2012 (UTC)

Impossible. Absolutely impossible. There will always be people who consider the best-loved characters to be overrated, those who apparently hate minor characters for not playing more of a major role in their respective stories, those who hate Y because he was a hard playable character to level-up, trolls who insist on making "reasons X sucks" lists for all the major playable characters; the list goes on. You would have to shut the DNC down completely due to the fact that every single Final Fantasy character out there would wind up on your "must avoid" list. (Nobody wants that, do they?) SelkieMaiden267 05:04, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
Tidus, Vaan, Hope, Wakka, Zell, Quina, Brahne, Yuffie, Cait Sith. There's a few --Pzykosiz (talk) 10:17, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
So people aren't allowed to dislike characters, people aren't allowed to have different opinions, and people aren't allowed to be sarcastic ? Fascinating. C A T U S E 01:23, October 23, 2012 (UTC)
I'm guessing Selkie's comment was about DSS's original idea of the "who do you all hate?" list. In which case, she's right; there wouldn't be a DNC at all with that approach. And that would be a tragedy. But jeez, are you still sore at her for openly hating Kuja or something? EdgarXTerra4ever 03:07, October 23, 2012 (UTC)
Wait a sec, are you saying DSS's original idea wasn't sarcastic? That would be quite a feat, considering the DNC staffers of all people should know that nobody here agrees to anything. No offence intended if you actually weren't being sarcastic DSS -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 03:41, October 23, 2012 (UTC)
Nah, this isn't some grudge, just sarcastically pointing out sarcasm... unless Selkie's post was sarcastic, in which case I apologize. They don't have sarcasm on Betelgeuse Six, after all :P C A T U S E 03:59, October 23, 2012 (UTC)
Totally agree with DSS's 2nd comment. I feel the nomination page is forgotten about often. I put some fights up over a month ago and I think 1 person voted for 1 of them either yay or nay. But also we need to update the nomination page and create an archive folder for fights that are selected so that they get removed from the nomination page but still can show who was the original suggestor. Also while looking through the archives to see what fights have already been done is ok. A simple list telling of all fights that have occurred on the nomination page would help eliminate alot of people reposting matches that have already happened. Just some thoughts on how to make it better. --Ffgamesftw (talk) 23:43, October 25, 2012 (UTC)

I think Wakka is maybe the best character in FFX. I like the whole racism aspect. How it is usually portrayed in games is very one-dimensional, like someone wants to wipe out a race because they deem them inferior (and because they are just one-dimensionally evil) and you the player fight against this injustice. This makes the player feel like the good guy and "I'm not racist, I'm a hero" when in reality everyone has capacity to be racist. To make a player character believably racist was a bold move. Wakka's not evil but blames the Al Bhed for his brother's death, and justifies his hatred by using the religion. He wasn't so much brainwashed as that he wants to find a reason to hate the Al Bhed, because he wants a scapegoat to his brother's death. He doesn't want to face the fact that it was Chappu's own decision to go with the whole thing and it wasn't anybody's fault but perhaps his own that he died. That other people like Lulu just go with the whole thing without confronting him I think is just as bad really. Like it's really weird they want to hide that Rikku and Yuna are Al Bhed or part Al Bhed. Like what do they think he's gonna do? That's just legitimising his bigot views.

But I'm a huge Tifa fan. I wanted to be Tifa when I first played FF7 as a kid. Gooo Tifa.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 12:25, October 22, 2012 (UTC)

So Wakka is "less racist than most racists" for the above reasons. Fair enough.
Speaking of Chappu, though, I have a timeline-related question for those who must know X and X-2 better than I. Was the Sinspawn-battle that killed Chappu also the one that very literally cost Nooj an arm and a leg? It's heavily implied in X-2 that while Yuna and Rikku were on pilgrimage, Paine was caught up in the whole Crimson Squad debacle with Baralai, Nooj, and Gippal (the events of the Crimson Spheres). I'm curious as to whether Chappu's death and Nooj's maiming (both of which obviously happened before the events of X and the Crimson Spheres) are related. SelkieMaiden267 17:35, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
I don't think Wakka is less racist than most racists; you can't really measure it like that. I don't think the circumstances of Chappu's death or Nooj's maiming are ever elaborated in the games.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 23:53, October 22, 2012 (UTC)
Not elaborated on, eh? (So I didn't miss one or more important cutscenes, or anything like that?) Oh well. I blame my curiosity on a heavily Crimson-Squad-centric writer in the X-2 fan community who stated in one of her stories that, apparently, Chappu's death and Nooj's maiming had both occurred in the same Sinspawn-battle. But I guess the whole issue is still in the realm of fan speculation. SelkieMaiden267 00:49, October 23, 2012 (UTC)

Week 218: Last Man Standing Round 21:Garnet v. Kefka[edit source]

LMS Icon.png
FF6 Kefkaart.jpg
DEFEAT - 23½ to 27
VICTOR - 23½ to 27
Our newest defending champion faces a strong competitor as the World of Balance's favorite insane clown takes the stage. Does the White Mage of Alexandria have what it takes to defend her kingdom and crown? Or will the crazy Black Mage put another kingdom's notch under his belt? Who will be the last man standing?

Votes for Garnet[edit source]

  1. I was gonna vote for Jecht if he'd won based on anger for Garnet taking out Al-Cid, but then I realized I'm actually so apathetic towards Kefka that Garnet is an improvement, even if I'm still kind of sore about her taking out Al-Cid and Aeris :( Jimcloud 03:08, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Vercery 3:28, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Far cuter, less creepy. King of Noobs 03:48, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Defend the queen! (From: the stranger) MissH <3 04:54, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Really charming character...—Kaimi (999,999 CP/5 TP) 13:12, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Because a complete monster like Kefka doesn't deserve Last Man Standing glory. (Bad enough we had to see Kuja's smarmy face through five LMS bouts; now another hateful destroyer seeks the crown? I will do everything in my power against this sadist for as long as he dares show his ugly makeup and flamboyant clothes.) So, my allegiance lies with Garnet the White Queen. EdgarXTerra4ever 16:15, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  7. I like Kefka well enough, and I don't have an anti-villain bias (like SOME people) but I adore Garnet and to me Kefka wasn't as awesome as her Bahamut knows best (talk) 01:18, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
  8. God Save the Queen from this insane harlequin. --Adelbert (talk) 02:13, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
  9. KaiserPaladin (talk) 02:21, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
  10. What a nice picture. SidVI 15:18, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
  11. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 00:08, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Going for the underdog, u jelly? Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 00:49, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  13. This is somewhat tough, but considering i'm more of a hero than a villain person, I'll go with Garnet. Even if she does annoy me on occasions with her lack of concentration. she's also the one that saved my party of necron's wipe when she tranced while berserked, and was the only one alive, allowing me to bring the others back to life and eventually beat necron for the first time. Razordash02:01, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Amano must have a thing for blondes. Anyway, Kefka's cool and all, but I think Garnet needs the vote more. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 02:54, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Bloody clown! Who hired you for this party? Not meSquallisnotemo (talk) 09:19, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Garnet ALL the way Badag (talk) 10:59, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Yeah, what that IP said. Kefka is a good villian and all, but Garnier is my fauvorite heroine in Final Fantasies. And Garnier has something that Kefka does not... tits. Heheheh... Mister Tonberry (talk) 13:56, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Cloudn 00:39, October 20, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Heh, I like them both on their respective roles in the story of their games. I really could vote either way, but I'll just vote for the one that's losing SetzerLeonhart (talk) 01:07, October 20, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Even knowing that Garnet will probably lose, I'll support her as I did last LMS fight, cause she still is one of the best characters in the series. Kefka is an epic villain and a very good character overall, but I just don't want to abandon the princess now. JC Holy Knight 16:42, October 20, 2012 (UTC).
  21. This decision was very hard to make, as I'd really like for Garnet to defend her position, but at the same time, I feel Kefka deserves a lot of credit as well. In the end, I'm placing my vote here so that Garnet has a last chance to defend her throne. Even if it's a small chance... MirrorshardSceada 17:16, October 20, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Because I think Kefka is really weird and creepy.-- 05:26, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  2. When I decide to vote in FF tournaments I usually just judge the images used. Sexy white-haired Amano Garnet does it for me. 15:06, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Because Kefka is an infernal nuisance. (No wonder some of Dissidia's Chaos-serving warriors are just a little nicer to Terra than they usually are, since she's the one who stands against that annoying clown.) 17:25, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  4. I don't doubt Kefka is a good villian and character and all, but there's no way I can vote against my second favorite female character in the series. Garnet is just awesome. Unfortunately, Kefka is too popular, so she holds almost no hope of winning, but I'm still on your side Garnet. 23:05, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Garnet is my favorite female character in FF. Kefka is an awesome villain and all. Unfortunately I'm getting sick of him lately. So I'll have to vote for Garnet! Being in my most favorite FF game of all time is a plus! 03:47, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Kefka[edit source]

  1. Chris Tucker, no! --BlueHighwind 03:03, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Because Garnet never meant anything special to me. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 03:04, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  3. The second greatest evil in FFVI. ScatheMote 03:05, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  4. I have yet to finish VI, but I already know Kefka is great.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 03:11, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Because while I don't particularly care either way, I got involved in a Peanut Gallery discussion last fight that made me realize that typing /whois Catuse on Freenode sometimes will mention that I am a "DNC Troll" for a reason. C A T U S E 03:13, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  6. If there was no Kefka, would there still be any Dancing Mad?  Cecily Redwingslogo.png  03:46, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Garnet's Kinda a Mary Sue, and has a weird name I have to spell out when linking. --Shockstorm (talk) 04:03, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Kefka, Kefka, Kefka! JuriSuzukiDissicon ff13 Lig1.png 09:09, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  9. May as well jump on the bandwagon, here's the next champion of LMS --Pzykosiz (talk) 10:33, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Not sure whether the correct reason to vote is Chris Tucker jokes or the fact that it's Kefka. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 10:43, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  11. --ClixPsi (talk) 11:09, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Mage-bias doesn't come into play here. My bias toward black magic - and my self-proclaimed status as a Cultist of Kefka - does. Dogurasu (talk) 15:34, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Even though Garnet is a contender for my favorite female in the series, I can't not vote for best villain.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 15:38, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Nothing against Garnet, but Kefka is simply teh win. Also, Light of Judgment > Eidolons. --Time Master (talk) 18:20, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Getting into matches where I love both sides of the fight. But Kefka wins because he is the best villain of all time--Ffgamesftw (talk) 04:45, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Two words: Dancing Mad.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png20:36, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
  17. It has to be Kefka for me. I don't have anything against Garnet, but she wasn't even my favorite female protagonist in FFIX, and Kefka is greatly entertaining. ProfessorTofty (talk) 05:50, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Yeah... Kefka. CylindrusAltum (talk) 07:50, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  19. What a no-brainer. Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 18:44, October 17, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Read my lips - mercy is for wimps! There's a reason "oppose" rhymes with "dispose"...If they get in your way, kill them! --StragusLore (talk) 02:10, October 18, 2012 (UTC)
  21. Just because I never liked IX. GenBolt 04:11, October 18, 2012 (UTC)
  22. --Leon95 17:19, October 18, 2012 (UTC)
  23. I hate you hate you HATE YOU! ...Or something. Blackmage-ff1-nes.png ZeypherMage 08:08, October 20, 2012 (UTC)
  24.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 11:02, October 20, 2012 (UTC)
  25. I have to vote for Kefka. Garnet is a very intriguing character and one of the best princesses in the series and as disheartening as it is that she's hurting in the votes right now, I gotta vote for one of the greatest villains of all time!Free bird (talk) 16:23, October 20, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Dance! 13:05, October 15, 2012 (UTC)
  2. I didn't ever like Garnet... and... just "Dancing Mad"!! Wohooo! 10:18, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Anyones better than Garnet.."# 14:10, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
  4. One of the best villains of the FF Series! He has a weird and freak personality, and is worth of the game.

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Well, I see Garnet being on the front page isn't tarnishing the votes any. Hehehe... King of Noobs 03:48, October 15, 2012 (UTC)

Not doing it. Just...not. I don't want to perpetuate another war, which is what I'll wind up doing if I cast a vote in either direction. SelkieMaiden267 23:04, October 16, 2012 (UTC)

Week 217: Kefka v. Jecht[edit source]

Kefka alt.png
DNC Versus.png
Jecht alt.png
26½ to 21½
This time, two final bosses go head to head. So then, which kind of antagonist is superior, the remorseless and unforgivable mad clown, or the brutish and arrogant father who has a nice side hidden within? It's up for you to decide! VICTOR
26½ to 21½

Votes for Kefka[edit source]

  1. First vote for best villain.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 23:37, October 7, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Hahaha There's a reason 'oppose' rhymes with 'dispose'! JuriSuzukiDissicon ff13 Lig1.png 23:41, October 7, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Look how happy Kefka is. I just want to dance and frolic alongside him. ScatheMote 23:52, October 7, 2012 (UTC)
  4. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 00:00, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  5. "Wait," he says... Do I look like a waiter? SetzerLeonhart (talk) 00:02, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I could go on about how and why Kefka is the best villain of the series, but I'll settle for - the most depraved, insane, cruel, malicious person in the series, even above many beings that can't be classified as "person". Doreiku Kuroofangu 00:13, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Well, since this is a "villain vs. villain" vote, I'll have to go with the more villainous of the two. SelkieMaiden267 00:25, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Time to deal out the hurt! Dogurasu (talk) 00:37, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  9. --ClixPsi (talk) 01:30, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Is there really a contest? If so, it's absolutely unnecessary. ._. Unsane (talk) 02:48, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Kefka is the best villain in the series. Also Jecht is about as much of a villain as Golbez or Edea were. Although unlike the others he was a dick so people forget he was being controlled. --Ffgamesftw (talk) 05:43, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Lol, jeez. The awesome clown or the drunk dad that could mistake kefka for a woman and hit on him. Hmmmm... Kefka. He was actually a villain.--UntoldSarcasm (talk) 05:38, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Oooo, this might be the first instance i picked a winner in a long time! CylindrusAltum (talk) 17:05, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Mierna 08:31, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Ouch. Sorry Jecht, but if I had to do the comparison there's no competition. Luacas (talk) 11:37, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  16.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 12:28, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  17. I honestly thought he was a girl when I first saw him. Still cool though. Rosenarm Brina-PSP-BattleSprite.png 18:23, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Easy choice. It's either the psychotic clown (who is actually a villain) who succeeded in causing the apocalypse, shifting entire continents in the process, and then ruling the ruined world. Or a drunken, bad father, (whom I don't consider a "true" villain) that failed to completely destroy Sin, gets killed by his own son, and has a level of intelligence comparable to Fighter. No contest for me, although I do enjoy both Dancing Mad and Otherworld. --Time Master (talk) 20:32, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Dancing Mad  Sessie Redwingslogo.png  04:54, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Don't much like Kefka but Jecht has Otherworld, one of the worst songs I have ever heard. C A T U S E 05:02, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
  21. Quick! There's sand on his boots. Cloudn 07:01, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
  22. The old days, when evil is pure evil... (But don't get me wrong, I like Jecht as a person, too.) MissH <3 11:55, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Much as I like Jecht, he just can't stand up to Kefka. Both may have destroyed the world to a fair extent, but only one of them did it intentional. MirrorshardSceada 19:40, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
  24. I HATE HATE HATE HATE Kefka... just kiddin! He's the only clown I'm not scared of. Haha! --Nerdy geek bk (talk) 10:40, October 11, 2012 (UTC)
  25. Ahem, there is...oh wait, there's nothing on my boots. Move along, move along. Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 10:51, October 11, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 23:46, October 7, 2012 (UTC) My favorite villain!
  2. I'll vote for the dancing mad. 19:32, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Best villain ever -- 01:47, October 9, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Jecht[edit source]

  1.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png22:56, October 7, 2012 (UTC)
  2.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 23:00, October 7, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Falcon Punch. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 23:23, October 7, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Bronzed... (wait for it) God. King of Noobs 23:31, October 7, 2012 (UTC)
  5. I've always had a softspot for Jecht Bahamut knows best (talk) 00:30, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Kuja and Jecht are probably the best villains in FF. Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 00:43, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Jecht shot all the way!! Eloibara (talk) 00:46, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  8. You can't do it kid. I'm the best --Pzykosiz (talk) 02:06, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  9. U Jelly? Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 02:33, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  10. オメガ Mk.XII Dissicon ff12 Vaan1.png 04:46, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Miyuron (talk) 14:23, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  12. He makes me laugh when he's a dick to Tidus. --Leon95 18:32, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Because of these two, Jecht would be far more likely to pull the card of "even evil has standards," unlike Kefka (the Complete Monster). EdgarXTerra4ever 20:52, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  14. I USED TO BE A WHALE!Squallisnotemo (talk) 22:39, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Clowns give me the creeps. Picking a bro anytime. bibliomaniac15 03:48, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
  16. MY SWORD LOOKS LIKE A DICK, YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID. --BlueHighwind 04:27, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
  17. He has a very swell sword. ~Turles Has Two Feet. 22:11, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Kefka's a better villain than Jecht, but as the man said - "I'm the best!" SidVI 13:26, October 10, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Because he deserves a lot better than what some of the Kefka voters are throwing -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 19:40, October 10, 2012 (UTC)
  20. While I have nothing against Kefka, he's an awesome villain, and he made me laugh in Dissidia, my vote is for Jecht. One of my all time favorite characters in the series, and my main Chaos Character in Dissidia. Jecht has alot of untapped depth to the character. And I would love to have an FFX Prequel to expand upon the Pilgrimage of Jecht, Braska, and Auron. "Looks like you've got a few screws loose." ~Jecht to Kefka DDFF User:FatesChosenHero 14:07, October 11, 2012 (UTC)
  21. Because he is actually a warrior type final boss unlike kefka and jecht is more fun to play on dissidia also ffX-2 would have been better if it was about braska's pilgrimage.user:l'cieBeast 19:23, October 14, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Jecht all the way! 01:58, October 14, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Alright, what happened there. My vote is F'd up lol. Can someone fix that?--UntoldSarcasm (talk) 05:40, October 8, 2012 (UTC)

I find it difficult to define Jecht as a villain here. It probably swayed my vote a bit, but since I believe Jecht at least broke out of a sort of mental state, it makes me less inclined to think that he is an actual "villain". Misguided maybe. Luacas (talk) 11:45, October 8, 2012 (UTC)

I'll agree with you there. Even in the Disidia series, he wasn't as much a villain as a concerned father. King of Noobs 13:12, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
Yeah 2nd that statement. Jecht was actually a hero as he was wanting to defeat Sin and rid Spira of him. Of course he became the final aeon to accomplish this not accepting that it wouldn't work and was in turn possessed by YuYevon. I really don't see how this makes him a villain. If every drunk father who was a bit of a jerk was a villain then you'd account for tons of people. Kefka on the other hand...How isn't he a villain? --Ffgamesftw (talk) 22:00, October 8, 2012 (UTC)
When I put the battle in the nomination page, it was a battle of final bosses, where one uses magic and the other uses physical strength. it wasn't really to do with being villainous --Pzykosiz (talk) 01:28, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
In that case, I still choose Kefka. Jecht has limited range; Kefka's smart enough (and enough of a, well, censored) to hide far away and spam Trine. Dogurasu (talk) 01:34, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
And by "well, censored," you mean a spiteful, cowardly son of a submariner, right? EdgarXTerra4ever 04:11, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
You say "cowardly"; I say "pragmatic." XD Dogurasu (talk) 07:47, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
It's true that Jecht is only an antagonist from Tidus's personal point of view, whereas usually players think the antagonist as someone who wants to destroy the world and you play as the good guys to stop him. People who don't care about the "save the world" kinda storylines may be more drawn to these kinds of "bad guys".Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 02:41, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
imo, every drunk father who's not there for their kid is a villain. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 05:52, October 9, 2012 (UTC)

Alternatively people could vote for Jecht because he's cool rather than bash him for not being evil enoughSquallisnotemo (talk) 22:44, October 8, 2012 (UTC)

@Catuse: Otherworld by no means beats out Dancing Mad, but to say that it's one of the worst songs ever is just not right. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 05:50, October 9, 2012 (UTC)

I also think it's one of the worst songs ever. Cloudn 07:03, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
You just ain't right. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 18:13, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
It's the most horrible song ever conceived. 19:32, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
Says the most horrible person ever conceived.*(To all: Please note the liberal use of sarcasm. Love ya, Jonny :3) - +DeadlySlashSword+ 20:35, October 9, 2012 (UTC)
Heh, pop music might be shallow and overplayed (and mark my words, it is) but Otherworld's vocalist somehow rendered Fight, fight, fight as Fra, fra, frooooooooooooog. C A T U S E 23:16, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

So it looks as if Garnet will be facing Kefka in the next LMS battle. And frankly, I'm awful worried on her account, because Kefka sure did become one powerful son of a submariner to reckon with. My prayer is the same, all things considered, as that of the Returners before their final battle: I pray that we checkmate our enemy, preferably without sacrificing our queen. (Not an actual FFVI reference; I saw that in a fanfic where Celes and Cyan were playing chess on the airship-ride to Kefka's tower, and Edgar, aware that the battle might cost Terra her life win-or-lose, made a statement to that effect.) EdgarXTerra4ever 02:17, October 10, 2012 (UTC)

I guess that kind of makes sense, since the law of succession does dictate that Garnet becomes queen of Alexandria when Brahne is killed, but I'm not sure that anyone could "checkmate" a foe who clearly sets no store by rules or strategies (like Kefka). So, bad analogy there. (Or was the idea of referring to Terra as the queen*(on the Returners' side of the proverbial chessboard) due to her power? Being that on a chessboard, the queen is easily the most powerful piece, and as such, the most valuable...) SelkieMaiden267 22:49, October 12, 2012 (UTC)
Well, that's one interpretation of the chessboard analogy that the writer of that fanfic was trying to set up. However, I was thinking that the "hopefully without sacrificing our queen" bit carried more weight due to the fact that Edgar (a king who has it in his power to make Terra his queen if that's what they both want) was the one who said it.
In any case, I really hope Garnet wins the next LMS bout, because I just can't bear to see a complete monster like Kefka win. EdgarXTerra4ever 23:13, October 12, 2012 (UTC)
Thanks! I hadn't decided who to vote for next time, now I know to vote for Kefka to counter all the anti-villain votes ^_^ C A T U S E 23:16, October 12, 2012 (UTC)
What kind of fiend are you, a Cult of Kefka member? D-:< EdgarXTerra4ever 23:35, October 12, 2012 (UTC)
Hey, I resemble that remark. Dogurasu (talk) 00:30, October 13, 2012 (UTC)

Week 216: Last Man Standing Round 20: Al-Cid Margrace v. Garnet[edit source]

LMS Icon.png
AL-CID Margrace
DEFEAT - 30 to 26
GARNET Til Alexandros
VICTOR - 30 to 26
The prince faces off against the princess in this week's LMS clash. For the third match in a row, a Final Fantasy IX character seeks to win the title, but can Al-Cid keep his crown?

Votes for Al-Cid[edit source]

  1. Hard decision. But sexy accent and glasses. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 04:15, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Preemptive pity vote and also because he has this mysterious aura around him I can't quite describe. C A T U S E 04:16, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I really wish we could have seen more of him, all smooth and sexy and off fightin-, er negotiating to prevent war. I believe he was more of a major player than was shown. Also, accent and sunglasses. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 04:18, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Partially Aerith loss-related impotent rage, partially pity vote, partially DAT AL-CID. Jimcloud 04:56, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Many people voted in favour of Garnet previously because Aerith is 'overrated' and 'useless' to the plot. It also seems to me that a good portion of people decided upon choosing the character from their favourite game, rather than by looking objectively at the candidates. So I return the favour. Cop dat Aerith Haterz! Sexeh accent FTW! CylindrusAltum 15:49, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  6.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 05:52, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  7. I vote for Al-Cid partially because I've never played FFIX and partially for his sexy accent. His sexy assitants are just a plus. --Marael (talk) 11:33, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  8. SidVI 12:05, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 14:09, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  10. only for his cameo part in FFTA2 - a man that powers up for evey woman in the battle, hilarious, Balthierfan (talk) 14:58, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  11. I want to vote Garnet but I feel drawn to Al-Cid because reasons that I cannot disclose at the current time because meta -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 21:30, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Cannot resist. Rosenarm Brina-PSP-BattleSprite.png 21:35, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Smart and sexy. --Shockstorm (talk) 23:18, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  14. My brain says vote for Al-Cid but my heart says vote for Garnet. I'm going with my brain this time! JuriSuzukiDissicon ff13 Lig1.png 13:38, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  15. My initial thought was to vote for Garnet. However, after reading the votes and comments, I realized I should really give this guy a chance. Sure, he's a NPC, but he also represented an entire nation that is more or less the FF XII version of a world Superpower. Yes, Garnet represented Alexandria to an extent, but is was Brahne who was primarily calling the shots until Bahamut killed her. Nevertheless, I'm going with Al-Cid because I like to give the underdogs a chance at times; and quite frankly, I'd like to vote for a non-FFIX character for a while. No offense intended to Garnet or FFIX itself, as I do like them both. --Time Master (talk) 18:43, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  16. I'd hit that. --Leon95 19:01, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 04:19, October 2, 2012 (UTC)
  18.  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 04:31, October 2, 2012 (UTC)
  19. I was sweet-talked into this. — YuanSalutActa 04:42, October 2, 2012 (UTC)
  20. It seems that... "I am but one of very, very many." YEEEEAAAAAHHHHH. Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 22:34, October 2, 2012 (UTC)
  21. BlueLionheart Cloudy Wolf.jpg (T/C) 22:39, October 2, 2012 (UTC)
  22. ScatheMote 23:37, October 4, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Because he has an amazing accentSquallisnotemo (talk) 01:41, October 5, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 06:46, September 30, 2012 (UTC) Garnet is obviously to win, but come on, Al-Cid's the man !
  2. Al-Cid has swaaaag. He is the definition of tall, dark, and handsome. 04:29, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Too sexy. 14:05, October 1, 2012
  4. Al-Cid is just to awesome to lose. 14:17, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Cause I don't like Garnet. And Al-Cit's awesome.# 14:00, October 4, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I don't play FFIX, but i play FFXII.-- 12:29, October 5, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Garnet[edit source]

  1. Eh...  < Kamikaze Pardee > 05:08, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Even though XII is my favorite in the series and they're both important, Garnet is more obviously important. Besides what can Al Cid even do??? (Besides his assistant I mean) Bahamut knows best (talk) 05:38, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  3. --ClixPsi (talk) 05:53, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Much more character depth, not much really to Al-Cid --Pzykosiz (talk) 07:53, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  5. To be honest, I totally forgot who her opponent was which means that he can be that great, therefore no chance against my favorite character. Badag (talk) 09:20, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I am unabashedly mage-biased. Plus, I don't know Al-Cid. Dogurasu (talk) 10:48, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  7.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 12:23, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Not a hard decision at all... SetzerLeonhart (talk) 12:29, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  9. As much as I love the sexy accent and that cool man pose over there, I think I'll put my vote over here again. Besides, AL-Cit spends a lot of time protecting women. I don't think he would approve of having to fight one. King of Noobs 13:19, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  10.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 13:20, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Same reason why I voted for Blank two weeks ago: because overall I like IX better than XII. EdgarXTerra4ever 15:48, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Better character, playable character, MAIN character. =D --Adelbert (talk) 19:24, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Obviously the better character. MystRay 00:57, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  14. How has no one said DAT ASS yet? Kupohunter FFV gilgamesh.gif 02:57, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  15. As interesting as a character that Al-Cid was Garnet simply was a far more developed character and I liked her quite a bit. Now if we replaced Al-Cid with Edgar who I tend to find them similar in a way then I would vote the other way. --Ffgamesftw (talk) 04:51, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  16. This is not a vote against Al-Cid, who is definitely an awesome character on his own. This is a vote for Garnet, who will always hold a special place in my heart. Also, think of it this way: Would Al-Cid ever harm a princess, even if she were his oponent? He's too much of a gentleman for that. MirrorshardSceada 08:49, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Mierna 16:58, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  18. My vote is other here. --BlueHighwind 22:11, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  19. I think Al-Cid defers to Garnet, naturally ;) 8bit 22:24, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  20. FFIX all the way! I love her song. --Sencilia (talk) 13:49, October 2, 2012 (UTC)
  21. I believe Garnet truly deserves to be the third LMS champion. KaiserPaladin (talk) 14:25, October 2, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Garnet <3 Redwingslogo.pngCecily  19:24, October 2, 2012 (UTC)
  23. ^^ Yay for Garnet! :) AtmaCrisis (talk) 23:56, October 2, 2012 (UTC)
  24. I put my vote for Garnet. Again. Al-Cid just annoyed me. Luacas (talk) 11:16, October 3, 2012 (UTC)
  25. I can't vote for Al-Cid when I know next to nothing about XII, so I guess I'll vote for Garnet in this round. SelkieMaiden267 18:00, October 4, 2012 (UTC)
  26. Al-Cid is pretty fabulous and all, but Garnet is Garnet. Or should I say Dagger? Or Sarah? I don't know anymore. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 00:38, October 5, 2012 (UTC)
  27. I supported her in the last fight, and I'll do it again. Garnet's way of living and passing through things is inspiring, and I can't vote against someone who has Melodies of Life as a theme. JC Holy Knight 01:47, October 5, 2012
  28. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 08:33, October 7, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Garnet has always been one of my favourite characters, she's so sweet :) 11:00, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Garnet all the way. She is a great character and mage, plus I've always had a soft spot for Summoners ever since Rydia in FF IV. I don't know if she's my favorite character of IX, but she is up there and is my favorite female from the game. She has a great character arc, has to overcome so much, but she does it to the best of her ability, with some help from her friends, even though she's not entirely certain how to actually do it. So come on Garnet, let's follow on the heels of Kuja and become the third LMS champion. 18:21, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Because I like her better than that other guy. 22:24, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Stronger, prettier and above all MUCH MORE interesting 13:39, October 5, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Dagger all the way...with the short hair - Eloibara 00:39, October 8, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

That's interesting, Al-Cid takes an early lead --Pzykosiz (talk) 07:54, September 30, 2012 (UTC)

Comments like these were to be expected, but I'm calling them out anyways.

Better character, playable character, MAIN character. =D

Just...so much ignorance packed into such a little sentence. Is this implying only main characters only have redeeming qualities? Only playable characters are worthwhile? Not even looking at the current match-up, but as NPC versus PC. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 20:24, September 30, 2012 (UTC)

Okay are you for real? Obviously most people are going to favor a character that they knew over one they didn't. And more than that they'll generally favor someone who was on screen for more than 2 scenes. I don't think anyone would say that NPCs never have impact and are unimportant but in this case Al-Cid was much less important than say Gabranth, Marquis Ondore, Larsa (whom I consider an NPC bc you can't control him), Dr. Cid, or even Emperor Gramis. I love XII in a way that a massive portion of the FF fandom doesn't but even I felt like Al-Cid was added just to say "Hey Rozarria does exist! Here's someone from there!" NPCs can be fascinating with great character depth but not in this case. Bahamut knows best (talk) 22:53, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
You just failed to address anything he said. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 23:01, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
I failed to address nothing. I stated that NPCs can be intriguing, deep, and meaningful characters. BUT those things need to be present. Nobody's favorite character is the Treno Auction-house auctioneer or the armor shop merchant in Figaro. NPCs are generally less important or developed than the party members. Why should that be forgotten because someone decides that we have to love every single character npc or pc completely equally. Bahamut knows best (talk) 23:09, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
Him: Are you guys seriously implying that NPCs are always worse than PCs?
You: Al-Cid is insignificant.
While correct, in the context of what was asked, it was completely irrelevant. Thanks for coming back and actually addressing things though. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 23:17, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
My point is that when it comes to NPC vs PC (and I'm referring to important NPCs, not shopkeepers or townsfolks), there is a large group that will always gravitate towards the PC because they're the PC and the NPC, in their opinion, isn't worth investing time into simply because they're an NPC. In the case of Al-Cid, he was a very relevant character with a developed personality and backstory who could have made a great PC, but is very overlooked because he was off doing important storyline stuff in XII and in few cutscenes. He's more relevant a character in XII than he was in the game where he was actually playable, TA2. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 01:37, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
I was so expecting we're going to go to Rozarria sometime, since Al-Cid keeps inviting Ashe saying that she must come. Then you don't even go there in RW or any time ever. How does Al-Cid travel I wonder.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 23:02, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
Something I kinda liked about FFXII was it was obvious that the part of the world you see is not the whole world. Makes it more realistic. It'd be certainly cool to go to Rozarria though. C A T U S E 23:05, September 30, 2012 (UTC)
Ashe visited Rozarria between XII and RW, but it's not described what it's like there, or what she did there, or anything really other than she went. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 01:37, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
Damn I don't remember that at all. Good to know she at least went though. I mean who cold refuse Al-Cid's offer. ;)Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 02:14, October 1, 2012 (UTC)

Wow thanks Bahamut for actually understanding what I was getting across. From one fellow FFXII fan to another, Al-Cid was a waste of space compared to Garnet's role in FFIX. But it's surprising how many can ACTUALLY disagree with that, hence why this matchup is still competitive for some stupid reason.--Adelbert (talk) 01:57, October 1, 2012 (UTC)

Why do people ACTUALLY disagree with that? Oh, because they like Al-Cid. Shocking, no? C A T U S E 02:01, October 1, 2012 (UTC)

(semi-relevant) I read an interesting fan-theory once about how FFXII was based on the Cold War. Rozarria is the United States/NATO, Archadia is the Soviet Union/Warsaw Pact, and the countries they fight over are various countries that got into a proxy war because of the struggle for communism. Manufacted nethecite is the H-Bomb, obviously. Of course, no magical cataract pharos thingies were discovered during the actual Cold War :3 C A T U S E 02:01, October 1, 2012 (UTC)

That's a cool theory. Allusions to devastation by nuclear weapons may lay deeper in Japanese mindset than in the west after all. I just played FFXII recently and was thinking that. I think there is some feeling toward that kind of thing, especially with Reddas's character. I think an issue with the FFXII storyline is that on one hand it tries to be all serious and grown-up....but then it's actually about ghosts and the main antagonist transforms into a robot dragon.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 02:13, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
It's not about ghosts or robot dragons. :/ - +DeadlySlashSword+ 04:35, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
It's kind of about ghosts. They may be god ghosts but they're still ghosts. Bahamut knows best (talk) 04:42, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
I think the story holds fairly well until you suddenly have to go to an ancient temple to get a magical sword forged by ghosts that is just there just to hold the sword...apparently. Until that point you were fighting to re-instate Ashe as legal heir of Dalmasca and then work to prevent war by diplomatic ways, or if that fails, to fight for your sovereignty (perhaps forge a deal with someone like Rozarria?). But then the story turns around to...get a magic sword to destroy the empire's magic stone and then when that fails go to an ancient ghost town and talk to ghosts who give you another magic sword (didn't really need this one, guess it's symbolic) and then... well but then when you destroy the Sun-Cryst then it's like Vayne doesn't need the nethicite anyway, here comes the war! So screw all that storyline right. And then Vayne becomes a dragon. That's ridiculous. In FFT the supernatural elements held better because the Lucavi were trapped in another dimension and wanted to break out and the bad guys want to break the seal with all their numerous conspiracies and the good guys want to stop the bad guys. In FFXII it's like they kinda wanted something like that, but there is no conspiracy, there are just Occuria in the sky who give you stones because they think it's amusing seeing people fuck each other up or something. They can't directly influence the physical world, although it seems Venat can possess people and give them superpowers. So like what's in it for them. A bad guy with ambiguous motive works poorly.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 12:17, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
Sorry, can't hear you over Famitsu's 40/40. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 12:51, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
FFXIII-2 is also 40/40. The scores are careful decisions and are influenced by other things than the actual quality of the game (which is subjective anyway, so fair enough). Developers of FFXII have said themselves after the game was out that in hindsight they don't think the story is up to Final Fantasy standards. FFXII is still my favourite in the series even if the story loses momentum too early.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 14:36, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
Bringing up Kotaku's ratings? Honestly? 14:55, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
(Kotaku?) I've read an article on why did Famitsu give FFXII a perfect score even if it isn't a perfect game, which also shed some light on their scoring policy. They don't have all those polls on their website for nothing; one thing they are used for is to evaluate which games fans don't want to see getting bad scores. So a KH game or a FF game is unlikely to ever get a bad score from Famitsu, but which games get a perfect score is still a careful decision. Supposedly FFXII got a perfect score because it is such a drastic change in the series that it was bound to receive backlash from fans; the score is more about "it's different but give it a chance" than "this game is perfect". Putting it in this light it is easier to see why Vagrant Story and FFXIII-2 would also get perfect scores.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 15:14, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
Kotaku has nothing to do with Famitsu. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 15:43, October 1, 2012 (UTC)
Awww DAMMIT. I meant Famitsu. I've only ever seen Famitsu praise FF. What was it? XIII got 39, XIII-2 got 40? I hardly trust any games reviewers bar one because I know that they don't care about what developers/publishers do in response to getting bad ratings. Admittedly, I don't agree with all their ratings but then that's because of personal difference.
Still, my point was that a perfect score from Famitsu on a FF game goes nowhere toward convincing me it was a good game (not that XII isn't a good game), forget perfect. 15:49, October 1, 2012 (UTC)

Week 215: Aerith v. Garnet[edit source]

DNC Versus.png
Garnet Til Alexandros XVII character.jpg
24 to 30
Two young White Mage women in touch with mystical forces, taken away from their parents at a young age and raised by another. Both of them fall in love with the protagonist. Both of them are involved in a love triangle. Both of them have sparked edit wars on the Wiki over their name. Pretty similar, if you ask me. VICTOR
24 to 30

Votes for Aerith[edit source]

  1. Dunno. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 04:23, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Say what you want, she'll always be one of my favorites.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 05:34, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  3. She died. No amount of traumatic muteness or cutesy-wutesy coming of age schmultz could fight against the TRAGEDY OF A DYING CHARACTER! And I'm no fanboy - I liked Tifa better. CylindrusAltum (talk) 16:38, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  4. I must say Aerith's death is quite sad. And whenever I see Zack die... I pity her. --Nerdy geek bk (talk) 08:13, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  5. I've always had a special place in my heart for her. Not to say I don't love Garnet, but it's just not the same. MystRay 10:32, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  6. --ClixPsi (talk) 11:49, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Wow, this was a really hard decision for me... My favorite two female protagonists! While I really like Garnet, I think I like Aeris just a bit more.. SetzerLeonhart (talk) 15:19, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Best theme. --Leon95 16:48, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Like 'em both, but Garnet's head is way too big XD --UntoldSarcasm (talk) 17:03, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  10. This was a difficult decision for me. I enjoy both their respective songs (Melodies of Life and Aerith's theme). However, I'll go with Aerith because her character was always very sweet, and to me, she always seems like that symbolic last ray of hope for the oppressed people in the slums. The flowers in the church of the slums always seemed to personify that to me. Garnet is a great character, but I feel more of a connection with Aerith, if that makes sense. --Time Master (talk) 18:25, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Aerith actually had power that affected the game. No matter how many eidolons dagger could summon, she was usually still a damsel in distress and only airship power won the day in the end. Aerith cast Holy, and the party's actions were just to Support her being a badass. even after death. --CarloGrimaldi (talk) 20:57, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Kingdom Hearts, I guess.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png00:05, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Sorry Garnet, you won't get my vote over Aerith. --Lycropath 04:08, September 25, 2012
  14. Aeris is prettier. Besides, overall I've always liked VII better than IX. EdgarXTerra4ever 15:41, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Jimcloud 16:09, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  16. nothing against Garnet, i just prefer Aerith waaaaaaay more! JuriSuzukiDissicon ff13 Lig1.png 18:45, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Xabryn (talk) 11:39, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
  18. My heart tells me to vote for Aerith. I know it's unfair, but... yeah. MissH <3 15:48, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
  19. I'm one of the people laughing in Sephiroth's pale, pointed face because he didn't realize that killing Aeris would only make her stronger. SelkieMaiden267 21:30, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
  20. I went back and forth a bit here. Just voting for the one who is losing. ScatheMote 02:21, September 27, 2012 (UTC)
  21. I've been following a Let's Play of Final Fantasy VII over the last few weeks and it actually reminded me how badass Aeri(th/s) was in the original game. I like Garnet, too, but right now I'm more fond of the flower girl. Miyuron (talk) 13:22, September 27, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Rodrigosanmartin (talk) 18:55, September 27, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Save the world after being killed? Check. --Winged Lion (talk) 06:35, September 28, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Looking purely at their skills (screw the sappy stories) Aerith would win. She gets off her first limit break, and garnet is boned. "Aerith uses Seal Evil"....."Garnet is silenced" Done. "Aerith uses Planet Protector"......"Garnet summons Bahamut"....."Aerith takes 0 damage" Done.‎ 03:57 September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 19:50, September 25, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Garnet[edit source]

  1. Allow me to be the first to say, I've always had a place in my heart for Garnet. I grew more attached to her as a gamer than I ever did to Aerith. King of Noobs 04:00, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Vercery 04:47, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I'm ambivalent, but Aerith has many disturbing fanboys. So Garnet for me. C A T U S E 05:09, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Don't know why, but I'm voting Garnet --Pzykosiz (talk) 07:41, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  5. She needs some support to make up fro being groped by ZidaneSquallisnotemo (talk) 10:33, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I sort of like Garnet better, probably because she had mom problems. BIG ones. Luacas (talk) 10:58, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Aerith died quickly and became a plot point. Garnet lived, suffered, survived, and helped to drive the plot instead of become it. Dogurasu (talk) 11:02, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Aerith's death wasn't a tragedy. SidVI 13:28, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Although I really like Aerith, Garnet has always been my all time favorite in the series. She somewhat doesn't fit in the "damsel in distress" cliché being both a bit naive and stubborn/audacious. Besides, summoners are classy. Badag (talk) 14:38, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  10. The most beautiful FF character.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 15:49, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Nothing against Aerith but Garnet is one of my favorites. Probably 4th behind Terra, Tifa, and Rydia. She just has so much more personality. --Ffgamesftw (talk) 19:18, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Simply enough, Garnet didn't die. Need we say more? --Adelbert (talk) 22:35, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
  13.  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 00:19, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Better Backstory and lived to get a happy ending. Also she can summon Bahamut and Ark! What can Aerith do? Oh that's right, she died to cast Holy... KaiserPaladin (talk) 07:41, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  15.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 11:27, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  16. I liked VII Aeris, didn't like CC Aerith, and liked neither as much as Garnet -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 12:40, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  17. I always liked Garnet more because i think Aerith died too early to be a real main character (became more of a plot device, like Dogurasu said). Garnet's personality and story is touching, and Melodies of Life rocks. JC Holy Knight 15:08, September 25, 2012 (UTC)
  18. I love IX and you know Garnet makes it through the entire game and proves to be incredibly talented and competent. Aerith on the other hand..... And like JCHN and Dogurasu pointed out she's more of a plot point than a main character.Bahamut knows best (talk) 16:25, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
  19. DAT. ASS. User:R8.50Mango/Sig2 17:11, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Hey Aerith, Garnet perfected that lovely pose before you got your fancy new Crisis Core render, so..... back off o uo 8bit 18:34, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
  21. This is one of the more tougher choices I've ever had to make voting here. Garnet gets an unfair slight margin from me,for being gf to Zidane, but other than that, love both characters, even if Garnet occasionally annoyed me with "command failed, Dagger can't concentrate". Razordash01:46, September 27, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Garnet is tied with Zidane for favourite character in my second favourite FF game and also tied with him for second favourite character in the series. -wtdrm
  23. I can't be doing with the hype about Aeris, however awesome her Limit Breaks are (and they are). I remember the time I levelled up around Treno so much that Garnet could summon Ifrit and Shiva. Proud Tia was proud (it's not hard to do ;_;). Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 15:10, September 27, 2012 (UTC)
  24. Teehee! Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 01:13, September 28, 2012 (UTC)
  25. Garnet <3 - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 02:29, September 28, 2012 (UTC)
  26. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 02:33, September 29, 2012 (UTC)
  27. I really think Aerith's death is slightly overrated. Like someone before me said, other characters from games before FFVII had deaths much more impactful (for me) than Aerith. For one, I never bothered to use Aerith when I played VII (I had tifa with a cure materia) and thus, when she was axed it really made no difference to my party.
    So basically, I prefer Garnet. Cloudn 06:04, September 29, 2012 (UTC)
  28. For me, Garnet will always be linked to Melodies of Life, and I just love that one. Also, Aerith's death never left much of an impression on me. Most likely due to it having been spoilered to me a good three or four years before I actually got to play VII... I guess if you don't see it coming, it is much, much more heartbreaking and leaves a bigger impact. But alas, that wasn't the case for me... So, it's Garnet over here. MirrorshardSceada 12:30, September 29, 2012 (UTC)
  29. This girl has gone through so much and she matures beautifully. Mierna 12:40, September 29, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 19:19, September 24, 2012 (UTC) I always liked Garnet over Aerith. I never liked Aerith, Tifa was always nicer. But Garnet is kind of like a more developed Lenna. They were both naive, but only Garnet really tried to act like a normal girl. Understandably, Lenna never had much of a reason to, though.
  2. 16:19, September 29, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

By the way, as a note, I would have used an FF7 picture for Aeri(s/th), but when I saw this fight I thought of these two posing near-identically and I could put no other picture in place. And about the love triangle comment, yes, I meant Eiko. I went there. Jimcloud 03:46, September 24, 2012 (UTC)

Does it REALLY count as a love triangle when one of the love lines is a bit one-sided? King of Noobs 04:01, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
FFIX's love triangle is more of a "love mystical-shape-with-2.5-sides". - +DeadlySlashSword+ 04:21, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
Yeah, though I've never heard of a triangle with 2.5 sides... --Nerdy geek bk (talk) 08:15, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
That's what makes it mysticalSquallisnotemo (talk) 10:35, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
If Eiko counts, why don't we include Priscilla, Jessie, and Yuffie in VII's... triangle...? 16:44, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
And Mukki surely. Everybody wants Cloud.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 16:57, September 24, 2012 (UTC)
Don't forget Barret now. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 17:38, September 24, 2012 (UTC)

It doesn't really matter who wins this match-up as far as Last Man Standing goes I think either of these two will trounce Al-Cid and yes I did vote for Al-Cid last time. --Ffgamesftw (talk) 20:15, September 24, 2012 (UTC)

@Anon: The thing about Limit Breaks is that they require time to build up. Additionally, Seal Evil could be defeated by Loudmouth, and Planet Protector lasts only so long. Aerith would be dead before Garnet would need to worry about either. Except, y'know, Aerith's already dead... Dogurasu (talk) 11:04, September 25, 2012 (UTC)

You know i would of thought the fact that Seal Evil effectively casts stop was more damaging than silenceSquallisnotemo (talk) 10:21, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
Which is similarly defended against with the Locomotion ability. Dogurasu (talk) 10:23, September 26, 2012 (UTC)

There are few things that disgust me more than people who decry Aerith because she died. I wonder if they think of other characters that way, and I pray they don't talk of real people like that. Doreiku Kuroofangu 17:05, September 26, 2012 (UTC)

The difference is that real people are real. People decry Aerith because she died because she made a stupid decision to run off alone. Are you saying you've never criticized the stereotypical stupid bimbo character in a horror movie for running off alone and getting carved like a Thanksgiving turkey? Most people have more tact than to speak ill off the dead but Aerith isn't really dead because she was never really alive. So yes I'll decry Aerith all I want for dying because it was it incredibly preventable.Bahamut knows best (talk) 17:20, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
Were Aerith a real person, I would not speak so ill of her. Even so, given that she is still a rather vital deus ex machina in the Compilation of Final Fantasy VII, I daresay she isn't so much "dead" as "ascended." However, given that all of this stems not from reality but from fantasy - Final Fantasy, at that - then yes, I will state that I prefer Garnet Til Alexandros and her survival to Aerith Gainsborough and her transition from, going by the timeline to the best of my ability, flower girl NPC (Crisis Core, I believe) to temporary playable character (Final Fantasy VII) to deus ex machina (Advent Children; seriously, she just up and cures Geostigma out of nowhere). Furthermore, why do no other deaths get such treatment? Leo Cristophe dies, and nobody bats an eye. Yang Fang Leiden, Cid Pollendina, and Palom and Porom of Mysidia all perform heroic sacrifices, even if the sacrifice part doesn't quite work out, and nobody cares. Minwu, Josef, Ricard, and Scott from Final Fantasy II all wind up dead as doornails and the best people come up with is "But I leveled so long with them!!" What, then, makes Aerith different? Dogurasu (talk) 17:50, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
"People decry Aerith because she died because she made a stupid decision to run off alone" - It wasn't stupid at all. She made it to the Forgotten City alone didn't she? As she left the party was worried about Cloud because he kinda-sorta got possessed by Sephiroth and beat the crap out of Aerith. Oh yes, and what happened when Cloud followed her? Sephiroth did it again. Frankly, running off alone and leaving Cloud behind was the smart thing to do because she clearly wasn't safe around him anymore. Her death was indeed preventable, but through no fault of her own - Cloud could have fought Sephiroth's control more and stopped him from impaling her, or another party member could have done it, Aerith was slightly busy praying for Holy to save the planet. Unless you want to argue she didn't need to go to the Forgotten City, and it's heavily implied she did. Hell, given that Sephiroth deliberately waited for Cloud to arrive to try and make him do the deed, Aerith might have survived if Cloud had just taken his time getting to her and she finished before he got there.
"Furthermore, why do no other deaths get such treatment?" - I know, this was mentioned on the IRC. People like Leo and Galuf and Tellah are remembered for their epic final stands. Such a double standard. And if dying makes you a bad character, Sephiroth is the worst character in the series with all the times he's died. EDIT - to clarify, I adore Garnet too, why I'm not voting yet, I'll vote to tie it up because they're both awesome. But really people, "she died" is just a pathetic reason to dislike Aerith. Doreiku Kuroofangu 18:16, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
While I can't speak for anybody else, I simply stated that I prefer Garnet as a character, not that I dislike Aerith as a deus ex machina. I do have to admit to being a little miffed due to the accusation of not caring about real people because I was untouched by a game event, but that isn't the point. In short, I feel as though defending myself, my thoughts, and my choices is a warranted action. EDIT - Additionally, I don't see why I should be upset, now that I think about it; this tirade about Aerith is coming from the same person who decried Cyan Garamonde's loss of his family, his lord, and his kingdom because of the way his special ability was programmed... Dogurasu (talk) 18:25, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
Who has used "she died" as a reason to dislike her? 18:28, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
Oh believe me Aerith's death isn't why I don't like her. I feel her death was by far the most meaningful thing she did in the entire game. I dislike that she's treated as a saint by the entire fandom when she's no more so than any of the other playable characters who die throughout the entire series. I dislike that she's the least powerful party member but the hardest to get limits with. And I dislike that she's a temporary character at best who's basically one of the two most popular female characters in the series. Larsa, Blank, Reddas, and Galuf spent lots of time with the party and made huge sacrifices for their cause but Aerith gets more attention than all of the other deaths combined. Garnet on the other hand is smart, resourceful, and possibly your most powerful party member in the game. She's funny and sweet and I love her relationships with the party. Aerith basically has no interesting interaction with half the party because she doesn't meet them or it wasn't something they could fit in in the small time she's in the game. And btw we both know that even if Cloud hadn't shown up there was no way Sephiroth would have let Aerith finish the spell. He'd have tied her up like an old black and white movie actress and killed her anyway.Bahamut knows best (talk) 18:38, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
That's not a problem with Aeris though, that's a problem with FF7 as a whole. As for Sephiroth letting Aerith finish the spell, he did, which was precisely the point, the White Materia was glowing as it fell from her hair, and Sephiroth was holding Holy at bay in the Lifestream. Doreiku Kuroofangu 18:53, September 26, 2012 (UTC)
I never wanted to state that I don't like Aerith because she died, and I'm sorry if this was the message I left. Actually, I praise her sacrifice in the game, but I think that the creators should have "postponed" her death, and it would be a good idea to show her more as a character to us. I also think that the entire "saint" image (created not only by the fans, but in some manner stated in Advent Children: Aerith appears, we're saved from Geostigma) ruined the meaning of her death in the original game. I like Garnet more not because she survived in the end, but because I know her more as a "person" than I know Aerith. I actually care more about her than I ever cared about Cloud, and her death on the end of the first disc was a shock to me, and for me it killed a part of FF VII story, that would be much more interesting with her alive, even if only for a little longer. And, people, let's just enjoy this fight and see who will be the best voted character of the two, ok? No "Kuja like" discussions anymore, there's no need, because I think nobody dislikes any of the characters for silly reasons (I heve stated mine, and would like to see your opinion). JC Holy Knight 20:41, September 26, 2012 (UTC)

Aerith's death I must actually admit didn't touch my heart when I first saw it. I was still a kid mostly when I was playing Final Fantasy 7. At the time all I cared about was advancing, getting stronger, and winning chocobo races. Also one last thing... Back then, one of my friends told me that it was possible to revive Aerith and have her on your team once again, and that he even had proof of it. Giving me all the details on how to bring her back alive (I was sadly gullible enough to believe it). That probably had some contribution to me not caring much at first for her Death. Razordash01:54, September 27, 2012 (UTC)

I didn't cry or get emotional like many gamers, but then I played FF7 for the first time as an adult and knew all about it going in. That said, I did still hate to lose Aerith, she was so adorable she quickly endeared herself to me. I think perhaps this was a conscious decision - the developers made her flirty, spunky and witty in addition to the generic "sweet and caring" archetype to help endear her more to the player so they were that much more affected when she was killed. I really dislike how much they play up the saintliness of her in the Compilation too. Aerith is loving and spiritual and compassionate, but the girl also suggested Cloud crossdress to save Tifa and threatened to rip off a mafia boss's balls. She is not as innocent and naive as SE tries to play up, that girl has fire to her. Doreiku Kuroofangu 14:34, September 27, 2012 (UTC)
I have a question that might make people think a bit: Why is it that White Mages are always the ones who get killed or are slated to die? Minwu in II, Aria Bennett in III, Aeris in VII, and Yuna in X (although Yuna's is subverted because eventually her Guardians find a way to defeat Sin without sacrificing her, and they lose Tidus instead). Why has it become a convention that "you can't defeat Final Boss without sacrificing your White Mage"? Is it simply because the folks at Square Enix hate them for some unknown reason?
And while I'm on the topic, I do notice that there tend to be three main female characters in every FF adventuring party: the Strong-and-Serious, the Perky Girl, and the Ingenue. Why is it that of the three, it's always, always, ALWAYS The Ingenue who has something terrible happen to her? Rosa was held captive in the Tower of Zot by Golbez and Kain; Terra was forced into Imperial service (and possibly worse) through the use of Kefka's Slave Crown; Rinoa was possessed by Ultimecia for some time; we've named examples for both Aeris and Garnet above; being anywhere near Seymour was horrible enough for Yuna. Why? SelkieMaiden267 16:36, September 27, 2012 (UTC)
Maybe it's the tradition that you need to sacrifice whatever it's most important to you if your goal is complete success. Maybe it wants to teach us that some special people (being a White Mage is not easy) have special tasks that must be completed, even if it involve danger/death. Or maybe SE just want to make we suffer... Whatever. On a side note, in X the Tidus time magic spells are treated as white magic, so technically they killed a half White Mage, and maybe this confirms your theory (Too many maybes for a comment, don't you think?). JC Holy Knight 01:53, September 28, 2012 (UTC)
"I don't want friends to die, or fade away. I don't want battles where we have to lose in order to win." Yuna had the right idea near the end of X-2, and not just because she was telling Nooj why his plan sucked (which it did). I can't be the only one tired of seeing the White Mage be the one who gets offed. But if we absolutely must sacrifice someone, why can't we make it the Thief, or the Black Mage? Or maybe the Dragoon? Mix it up a little, Square Enix! SelkieMaiden267 03:28, September 28, 2012 (UTC)
Plenty of other characters have been killed off... just the White Mages are the ones that get attention, because that's how fanboys work. C A T U S E 03:48, September 28, 2012 (UTC)
Or because the Cure and Life spells are so vital in gameplay :). But seeing further, some playable characters weren't white mages, like Leo Cristophe of FFVI (sort of Paladin) and Tellah of FFIV (Sage). Also, the first that died in the series was a monk (Josef). This revises my previous comment and the theory... but I still think these deaths have something to do with the Japanese "code of (samurai) honor" thing. JC Holy Knight 16:04, September 28, 2012 (UTC)
Is that some Japanese storytelling thing? Because I have seen it in many other JRPGs too, not just the FF series, and probably it's also a thing in whatever anime and manga that I wouldn't know about. My understanding is it happens much less often in modern western storytelling, although maybe I don't pick up on it as people tend to have a blind spot to their own cultural norms. Stuff like Disney movies used to do that but it has drifted away from that direction a long time ago now.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 02:23, September 28, 2012 (UTC)
All I see here is confirmation bias. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 04:18, September 28, 2012 (UTC)

http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2011/059/7/f/no_peeking__aerith_by_neoslashott-d3an1td.png Doreiku Kuroofangu 02:30, September 28, 2012 (UTC)

Week 214: Last Man Standing Round 19: Al-Cid Margrace v. Blank[edit source]

TA2 Al-Cid.jpg
LMS Icon.png
AL-CID Margrace
VICTOR - 21 to 15
DEFEAT - 21 to 15
With Kuja becoming the second champion of the Last Man Standing, two new randomly selected fighters take the stage. Will Al-Cid charm his way to the top, or will the Tantulus thief steal the crown? Who will be the Last Man Standing?

Votes for Al-Cid[edit source]

  1. Xepscern (talk) 19:55, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Well... Jimcloud 20:03, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Just has more personality then Blank. --Ffgamesftw (talk) 20:12, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  4. His name isn't as ridiculous. C A T U S E 20:22, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Sexeh accent. CylindrusAltum (talk) 06:41, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Hmm, support characters. I'll go with a representative of the Rozarrian empire, rather than the guy who got petrified in the first dungeon of his game. --Time Master (talk) 20:51, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  7.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 21:47, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  8. I have my reasons. And surprisingly, sexy accent is but one of them -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 22:11, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  9. I agree with the other sexy accent followers. King of Noobs 22:45, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  10. "Not even a womanizer pimp like Al-cid can resist DEM THIGHS" - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 23:35, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  11. MystRay 00:37, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  12. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 01:40, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 02:30, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  14. That guy looks weird. Blackmage-ff1-nes.png ZeypherMage 06:37, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Gotta love that accentSquallisnotemo (talk) 08:58, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Final Fantasy IX was a great game, but so was XII, so they tie at that, but Al-Cid has more swag. I still haven't learned his "sunglass technique". ZaFlareStar 16:38, 17th September 2012 (GMT+3)
  17. SidVI 18:43, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  18. I've never played FFIX but blank just looks so....blank...JuriSuzukiDissicon ff13 Lig1.png 21:52, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  19. While Al-Cid has pretty much no significance to the game whereas Blank does to IX, Blank didn't have a woman following him around everywhere with his sunglasses between her breasts. Can I say that? Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 18:42, September 18, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Meh. Unsane (talk) 18:48, September 18, 2012 (UTC)
  21. --Leon95 16:55, September 19, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

Votes for Blank[edit source]

  1. Nice, I can say I played both games these guys are in. But I was disgusted with the lack of attention the Rozarrian Empire got in FFXII in spite of it being the source of the Archadian Empire's fears. Had we gotten the chance to actually explore the region of Rozarria I might be voting the other way. --Adelbert (talk) 21:30, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Sadly, it looks like he'll need this vote more. Oh well. In any case, consider this a vote for what I always believed to be his character theme, Vamo Alla Flamenco! MirrorshardSceada 22:28, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  3. --ClixPsi (talk) 01:13, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  4. He was my first favorite character and would've been used the entire game if possible :D Vercery 01:55, September 17,2012 (UTC)
  5. Bros before Roz :) AtmaCrisis (talk) 10:39, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  6. It's time to rock.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 10:40, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Eh. I like Blank more.--Otherarrow (talk) 12:59, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  8. I might hate Kuja for destroying a planet, but overall I think I like IX better than XII. So I'll give Blank my vote. EdgarXTerra4ever 15:32, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  9. I respect men that manage to save the protagonist on multiple occasions without ever seeing anything.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 17:46, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  10. yay SetzerLeonhart (talk) 18:25, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
  11. the guy risked his life, i'll give him points for that --Pzykosiz (talk) 01:18, September 18, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 06:52, September 18, 2012 (UTC)
  13. MMLN メーマウリアン 00:28, September 19, 2012 (UTC)
  14. For the Tantalus theme songKupohunter FFV gilgamesh.gif 01:34, September 24, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Blank's just cooler. The guy's outfit is made of flippin' belts!# 14:38, September 19, 2012 (UTC)", Gabby
  2. Go Tantalus! 10:00, September 20, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

You know, these two characters are similar enough that you'd never guess Scathe created this fight using GFSacred's bull roll command. C A T U S E 22:55, September 16, 2012 (UTC)

Or maybe we would have, considering that's how we always pick fights after a new Champion's been crowned. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 01:38, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
Considering that there have only been two champions so far, it'd be a bit remiss to assume everybody knows how new challengers are selected in this scenario. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 06:06, September 17, 2012 (UTC)
Hence the "maybe" - the first set of new challengers were so dissimilar that them being chosen by random selection would have been the logical and fair conclusion and this time around is no different :/ - +DeadlySlashSword+ 18:12, September 17, 2012 (UTC)

In Al-Cid's little screen time in XII, I don't think he came off as that likable of a character. In fact, I don't understand him at all. From my experience on the wiki I first thought they added him as a reference to TA2... which I've only just discovered came out after XII.

I only got the impression he was tacked on and pointless. But I also don't remember the story of XII very well. Though I don't remember him starring heavily in it. 23:02, September 16, 2012 (UTC)

As with a lot of XII's plot, he plays an unseen role, he's the Rozzarian dude Larsa is working with to keep Rozzaria and Archadia from going to war, relevant to the overarcing story but not to much that Ashe is doing. I also recall reading somewhere that he had a smaller role at first, then they got Norio Wakamoto as his VA and the developers fell in love with him and expanded his role because they were impressed with him. Doreiku Kuroofangu 23:12, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
I think they were wanting to show he is posh and important with the little screentime they had available, so they gave him a servant who follows him everywhere and show-offy mannerisms. He is supposed to be one of the more down to earth Rozarrian aristocracy though, as I understood it.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 00:08, September 17, 2012 (UTC)

Week 213: Bahamut SIN v. Bahamut Fury[edit source]

DNC Versus.png
Bahamut Fury
31½ - 8
Alright, alright, we get it; you guys like Kuja. Here, have some Bahamuts. Get at it. VICTOR
Bahamut Fury
31½ - 8

Votes for SIN[edit source]

  1. I'm sad because i'm all alone :-(Squallisnotemo (talk) 10:14, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Because Bahamut Sin or whatever the real name is, happens to be ugly as hell, and for once in Final Fantasy there is a monster that atleast tries to be scary, instead of being "cool" or "nice looking". ZaFlareStar 15:44, 10/09/2012, GMT+3
  3. Look how adorable it is. =D --Leon95 16:33, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Bahamut SIN reminds me of a certain kind of goat, the Jamnapari goat, that I, through various circumstances, witnessed one being born and it was subsequently named after me. Of course, the goats were rather dirty, putrid (it took days to get the smell off), and were rather ugly. But I still have a special place in my heart for these strange, ugly goats. ScatheMote 20:00, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  5. There's just somethin' about SIN... King of Noobs 23:51, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Renegade for life. --UntoldSarcasm (talk) 00:41, September 12, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Because I'm in love with Advent Children.... Even after watching it goodness knows how many times... Hell-Fire98 (talk) 15:39, September 13, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Since I watched Advent Children again today I'm feeling in a good enough mood for this guy. ~Turles Has Two Feet. 07:01, September 16, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

Votes for Fury[edit source]

  1. Bahamut sin is ew. Jimcloud 16:49, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Turns the moon into a Kill Sat. Drake Clawfang (talk) 16:57, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I like Bahamut Fury more because he blows up The Planet and moon with his attack, Exa Flare. He is also one of the best Summons in Crisis Core, and thus very hard to obtain. Bahamut SIN is alright, but he only affected Edge, and his name isn't even correct. --Time Master (talk) 16:59, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  4. User:Syenyho 17:13, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  5. My girlfriend's Eidolon.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 17:16, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I just find Fury to be cooler SetzerLeonhart (talk) 18:02, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Ooh pretty C A T U S E 18:06, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  8. My Eidolon.  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 18:18, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  9. --ClixPsi (talk) 19:01, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  10. I like the design and attacks more. Sin is still awesome though.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 20:07, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  11. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 20:48, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  12. CylindrusAltum (talk) 06:57, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  13. MystRay 23:53, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
  14.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 00:08, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Ha, landslide. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 01:11, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Only because it was summoned by a decent character --Pzykosiz (talk) 02:33, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Lulz. Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 03:31, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Carbuncle.pngEpicCarbunkl 03:55, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Bahamut Sin don't look right, its eyes are kinda buggy...At least Fury is golden! Juri (talk) 06:53, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  20. It's less lonely over on this side. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 07:24, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  21. That thing on the other side is supposed to be a form of Bahamut? Dear God... Miyuron (talk) 08:07, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Tetraninja321 08:13, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  23. O_O SIN is one ugly as hell Bahamut... -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 10:01, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  24. I'm going to go with the golden dragon, rather than...whatever that thing is. EdgarXTerra4ever 15:04, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  25. I suppose it's just as well Kuja has ascended to a higher plane. We all know how he deals with Bahamuts, so the next round would have been a mere formality -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 16:12, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
  26. It's gold... It's Shiny... but most importantly,I could summon it. Razordash02:16, September 12, 2012 (UTC)
  27. Awe. Some.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png16:20, September 12, 2012 (UTC)
  28. I just think this one looks cooler than the other Bahamut. --Marael (talk) 03:48, September 13, 2012 (UTC)
  29. Shiny. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 19:00, September 13, 2012 (UTC)
  30. Advent Children was...okay-ish. Blackmage-ff1-nes.png ZeypherMage 01:29, September 16, 2012 (UTC)
  31. Exaflare...and the moon...tis all. LegendAqua  (Talk/ Colosseum/ QFC) 09:34, September 16, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. SIN doesn't fire moon lasers. End of story. 07:59, September 16, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Complete, utter landslide. Biggest one I've seen in a while. Carbuncle.pngEpicCarbunkl 03:56, September 10, 2012 (UTC)

There's a Fleetwood Mac song that would fit this occasion nicely... Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 08:54, September 10, 2012 (UTC)
Yeah, I like Gypsy too. Gukkor (talk) 13:20, September 10, 2012 (UTC)

I am of the personal mindset that the original is a good enough Bahamut. Why so many evolutions? Is he becoming a Digimon? Dogurasu (talk) 13:59, September 10, 2012 (UTC)

lol, I've always wondered the same thing. There's, what, five variations of Bahamut? Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 03:42, September 11, 2012 (UTC)
More. There's the original, Neo Bahamut, Bahamut ZERO, Bahamut SIN/Tremor, Bahamut Fury (Neo through Fury from Compilation of Final Fantasy VII), Chaos Bahamut, Jet Bahamut, Amber Bahamut, and Garnet Bahamut (these last four from Final Fantasy XIII-2). There are also Dark Bahamut (Final Fantasy X-2) and Lunar Bahamut (Final Fantasy IV Advance version), bringing the total to eleven Bahamuts. So many Bahamuts. Dogurasu (talk) 04:01, September 11, 2012 (UTC)
Don't forget Bahamutt! Well, OK, that's not Final Fantasy, but it's a reference to Final Fantasy. C A T U S E 04:37, September 11, 2012 (UTC)
And then there are the different incarnations across the whole series... Wow, it's like a whole Lagoon of Bahamuts! Dogurasu (talk) 13:28, September 13, 2012 (UTC)
Speaking of lagoons, we can't forget the Bahamut in his own game, Bahamut Lagoon! Even if it's not FF, it is related to it too, and we can put this one into account JC Holy Knight 01:02, September 14, 2012 (UTC)

@Time Master: Blowing planets up is indeed awesome. Oooh! Come to think of it, there's someone else who does that, IIRC. I'm sure you'll like them too. Lessee, what was it... Kuja, I think his name was? Yeah, Kuja. Totally awesome, blows up planets and doesn't afraid of anyflare -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 16:10, September 10, 2012 (UTC)\

You are hereby relegated to so last week. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 17:56, September 10, 2012 (UTC)

@SN: Just because Fury and Kuja have something in common, does not mean I like one over the other for that attribute exclusively. I do not wish to restart any old conflicts regarding Kuja, as they should remain in the week they were posted. I will not allow your smart-aleck remarks to incite me into flammatory action over a resolved fight. If you were trolling, it did not work; so let's just focus on this week, okay? --Time Master (talk) 18:19, September 10, 2012 (UTC)

@ Time Master: I'm fairly sure SN is just pulling your strings for some hoohaa, I don't believe there was any ill intentions. In any case, the Kuja debate won't likely end anytime soon since that's pretty much who we're placing everyone against.

@ SN: Yea, it didn't matter which bahamut won, Kuja without a doubt had a solution for either one. Might as well crown Kuja here and now. Maybe we should of brought Terra to give Kuja a real challenge? Or even bring back... the forbidin one... Vivi. Kuja is in need of worthy challengers at this point. Razordash02:42, September 12, 2012 (UTC)

Ya know... Kuja's a RETIRED LAST MAN STANDING fighter now, along with Cecil. We'll be having fresh new combatants next week. King of Noobs 02:48, September 12, 2012 (UTC)

Week 212: Last Man Standing Round 18: Kuja v. Gabranth[edit source]

Dissidia Kuja ex.png
LMS Icon.png
Dissidia JudgeGabranth EX.png
VICTOR - 26½ to 19½
DEFEAT - 26½ to 19½
Kuja's ultimate Last Man Standing round pits him against a certain Judge of Archadia. Will Gabranth sentence Kuja for his crimes? Or will the enforcer of Archadia be punished himself? Who will be the Last Man Standing?

Votes for Kuja[edit source]

  1. Here's your invitation - will you wag your tail for me? Here's your finale: Curtain, rise! Dogurasu (talk) 15:24, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Tum te tum -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 15:26, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Fitting match-up, the evil brothers who redeemed themselves. While Gabranth is certainly awesome, Kuja gets my vote. He's one of the few Final Fantasy villains to get genuine character depth or complex motivations, instead of a token Freudian Excuse to explain why they're evil. Moreoever, his revived Dissidia 012 story is completely in-character for him and so it's utter heartbreaking to watch him try to be a hero and have his plans explode in his face in the worst way. Drake Clawfang (talk) 15:26, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  4. I'm a Kuja fan SetzerLeonhart (talk) 16:14, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  5.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png16:46, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  6. The harder boss C A T U S E 16:49, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  7. I have supported Kuja ever since he took out my favourite Zack, and I will not stop now. A man that can take out Zack deserves to win the Last Man Standing contest. Also, he impressed me more than Gabranth has, although he still might once I get around to finish XII MirrorshardSceada 19:29, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Now for my one-man show... User:Rezana7 19:34, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  9. MystRay 21:34, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Kuja for champion! Also, haters of Kuja, think of it this way; if he wins, he won't be seen in the colosseum for quite a while. Voting for him is a win-win situation. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 22:30, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  11. ^Nice. xD - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 23:37, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  12. I like both characters, but Kuja just edges him out. --Pzykosiz (talk) 00:29, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  13. @Pzykosiz What you just posted is so dirty and wrong but nothing you probably couldn't find in some FF fanfiction somewhere. Now lemme take my mind out the gutter. --Adelbert (talk) 04:47, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Kuja's come too far to lose to Gabranth now. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 06:10, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  15. I vote, once again, for the poetic, man-thong wearing, tail hiding, planet destroyer. King of Noobs 20:59, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Hmmm Kuja or Gabranth...Kuja all the way for me! Juri (talk) 00:48, September 4, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Balthierfan (talk) 13:12, September 4, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Do I have to explain myself? Really? Really? Unsane (talk) 14:42, September 4, 2012 (UTC)
  19. As if what can be said hasn't already been said about this Sexy Dynamo of a character/villain. Keep the Pretty Train rolling, Kuja. Choo-Choo! No way he can lose to a boring metal'd up bum like Gabby. --AnonyMan (talk) 16:02, September 4, 2012 (UTC)
  20. So yeah, Kuja for second champion. ScatheMote 01:35, September 5, 2012 (UTC)
  21. At least I won't have any qualms for voting Kuja, as I would have if Seifer had won. MentalChocobo (talk) 06:18, September 6, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Kuja, no contest whatsoever. Carbuncle.pngEpicCarbunkl 01:09, September 7, 2012 (UTC)
  23. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 17:01, September 8, 2012 (UTC)
  24. Although I have no idea how Kuja made it this far, he is better than Gabranth. Then again, so is slamming your hand in a car door... --Ammyissun (talk) 17:45, September 8, 2012 (UTC)
  25. Both bad guys who have a change of heart. Tough choice, but I like Kuja by a slight margin. Razordash05:50, September 9, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Come on Kuja, just one last victory to go. A much better villain, from a much better game, it'd be a shame to lose now. 21:56, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 03:54, September 5, 2012 (UTC) Yeah Kuja!!!
  3. 19:23, September 5, 2012 (UTC) When my friend gave me FFIX , he said "look forward to the end of disc 1 , you'll see Kuja" .. and when i saw him in the FMV , the hairstyle , the feather , the treacherous smile ,the arrogant walk .. i knew he was the chosen one .. such an epic character.

Votes for Gabranth[edit source]

  1. --ClixPsi (talk) 16:22, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  2. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 16:30, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  3. <3 Miyuron (talk) 17:57, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  4.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 18:06, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  5.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 22:03, September 2, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I believe I've made my position and reasoning clear at this point. --Time Master (talk) 00:04, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  7. I just can't vote for Kuja. It's unfeasible. And I do like Gabranth, even though he was always destined to lose this fight... CylindrusAltum (talk) 14:18, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  8. For the sake of balance. ZaFlareStar 17:33, 3rd September 2012 (GMT+3)
  9. --BlueHighwind 15:55, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  10. --Leon95 16:16, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  11. This guy really needs votes, huh? I also actually prefer Gabranth... Hell-Fire98 (talk) 16:24, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Even though Gabranth is a douchebag, and I thought I'd never be voting for him, I most definitely do not want Kuja to emerge victorious again. Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 16:56, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  13. "What must be defended is inevitably lost. You will know despair and emptiness."  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 21:58, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  14. At least Gabranth didn't stoop so low as to destroy a whole planet. No villain who does that ever gets a shred of forgiveness from me. EdgarXTerra4ever 23:02, September 4, 2012 (UTC)
  15. --Xabryn (talk) 01:17, September 5, 2012 (UTC)
  16. There's something to be said about this guy being a more forgivable villain. How often does that happen? Luacas (talk) 11:43, September 5, 2012 (UTC)
  17. If I have to choose between the two... well, my answer's pretty obvious! --Nerdy geek bk (talk) 08:46, September 7, 2012 (UTC)
  18. SidVI 17:26, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Never played IX, so have to go with Gabranth 16:27, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 19:57, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Gabranth Rules 09:23, September 4, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Arg, this is so hard. I'm trying to not let Kuja's last time in LMS bias me. He's still an amazing villain from my favorite game, but I really love Gabranth in the Pharos scene. And his voice is teh win. Maybe if I actually played XII instead of watching cutscenes my choice would be more clear... 8bit 20:51, September 2, 2012 (UTC)

Sadly, it seems that Kuja will become the 2nd LMS champion; although I still cannot fathom where the rush of support that appears to sustain him through the end comes from. It truly baffles me why he is so popular, despite having myself and many others strongly dislike him for a myriad of well supported reasons. Regardless, with his likely victory, the DNC fights will be freed of the oppressive and undeserving scourge that is known as Kuja. Thus, the DNC shall wipe that disgraceful blot from the pages of future conflicts in LMS; and a new period of better (non-kuja) fights shall begin. --Time Master (talk) 00:14, September 3, 2012 (UTC)

I see just as well supported refutations of said arguments every time they have come up.
Oh, and before I forget, another reminder for everyone to remain civil. We don't need a repeat of week 208. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 00:20, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
Time Master, I mean this with no disrespect, but please actually play Final Fantasy IX before claiming Kuja is a terrible character. Almost everyone who constantly bashes Kuja either bases their opinion off Dissidia (which represents every character poorly) or just hates how he looks.
I don't mind if people vote against him, but it gets annoying having to hear another reason as to why Kuja is the worst Final Fantasy character ever each week coming from people who haven't actually played the game. I can guarantee that if you had played IX, you wouldn't be so opposed to him. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 06:16, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
I think it's better to just take it easy. I mean, just deal with the fact that many people like a character you hate. There are probably a lot of people who hate some characters you love, but it's just how it goes. I actually think this is a good thing, this means the series created characters that can appeal to different people SetzerLeonhart (talk) 15:25, September 3, 2012 (UTC)

God damn this was a hard one to pick. Both did a complete 180 to help you at the end, both were brothers of the main characters, both were the second last boss of the games. this type of connection should of put them in the DNC already --Pzykosiz (talk) 00:34, September 3, 2012 (UTC)

Gooo Kuja. Doesn't look like he will even need my vote. I like Gabranth too, but can't get a good picture of him as a character. Could be interesting to know more background and more about his relationship with Basch.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 01:32, September 3, 2012 (UTC)

I agree Kelt. With Gabranth I always got the impression he wanted full out war because he was disgusted with himself and what he had become, and wanted to see Archadia and the Resistant and Rozarria destroy each other, which was why he tried to taunt Ashe into using the Sun-Cryst. But then, what's up with his deal with Larsa? Does he actually want to protect Larsa, and if so why? Is he just honoring Drace's last request, and if so why does that mean so much to him, why were he and Drace so close? Does he want Larsa to be part of things for some other reason we aren't told? Doreiku Kuroofangu 15:53, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
The details of how Landis fell and how Basch and Gabranth ended up where they did is never elaborated at all in the game, which is a shame. It may be that Gabranth sees a bit of himself in Larsa and doesn't want Larsa to become corrupted the way he did, and start to hate his brother (Vayne) the way Gabranth ended up ruining his relationship with his only family, Basch.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 16:00, September 3, 2012 (UTC)

@Mateus: I have played FFIX all the way through to the end, multiple times. See my previous posts on the DNC for proof. I've witnessed Kuja's first appearance in Burmecia at the end of disc 1, just before the main party gets the crap kicked out of them by Beatrix. I've seen Kuja's rise to power by inciting war with Mist and Black Mages, as well as gaining the control of Eidolons with the Invincible to eventually get back at Garland, and prove his superiority to Zidane. After pivotal events such as the capture at the Desert Palace, and the failed Eidolon extraction at Mt. Gulug, Kuja is faced on his home planet of Terra, where he kills Garland, achieves Trance, and proceeds to blow up the planet. Back on Gaia, he is eventually met and defeated at Crystal World, where he aids the party after Necron's defeat. Zidane goes back for him in the Iifa Tree, but Kuja appears to die, regretting his previous actions. In short, I know Kuja quite well after dealing with him across four discs. my opinion is based off of FF9, and not Dissida, as no one is that game is accurately portrayed. I rarely argue so strongly on something that is just a game, but there are just a few characters that I regard with absolute hatred and derision for many previously stated reasons. --Time Master (talk) 19:53, September 3, 2012 (UTC)

Okay, lemme break your complaints from #209 down one by one:
Kuja was also too weak to muster any physical attacks at all"
Because he's a mage and mages have no use for swords and spears. Magic is almost invariably more powerful than them.
"A mere frog was able to undo the "inescapable" traps at his desert palace."
Not a mere frog, a frog with human intelligence. Presumably Kuja thought a human was too big to handle some of the traps, and a smaller animal like a frog too stupid.
"His flawed character isn't interesting or unique."
And Gabranth's character isn't flawed, and you'd rather have a Mary Sue...?
"He commits numerous hackneyed atrocities"
And so does Gabranth and just about any other villain in an FF game.
"his desire for ultimate power and his fear of his mortality"
Are perfectly human traits.
"I conclude that no matter what way you look at it, Kuja is little more than a tragic character whose final fate in unknown; all too similar to many other characters in literature."
That is one's opinion. So why are you complaining that other people have different opinions? Does not compute. Which is why everyone's raising a fuss about your hate for Kuja. C A T U S E 21:00, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
Of course it's his opinion. And he can voice his opinion. And people can challenge his opinion in a stuck-up way saying "Play his OG man" as if there can't be anything wrong with Kuja.
Embarrassing attempts at poetry, doesn't shut up, has to be the centre of attention, and when he does something villainous he acts like he's standing in front of a mirror practising his role as Scar in his school play for the Lion King. His character borrows from Kefka a lot, and also from Blade Runner.[1] 21:17, September 3, 2012 (UTC)
I think it is time that we all stopped these arguments and just agreed to disagree. Some of us like Kuja. Some of us hate him. Some of us love to hate him and think that's what makes him a great villain. Everyone has their reasons and be they as they may, it's no reason to start another argument over it. Let's just enjoy this fight and see who emerges victorious sunday, alright? MirrorshardSceada 22:22, September 3, 2012 (UTC)

"Kuja was also too weak to muster any physical attacks at all" Yeah, he was just physically strong enough to take a damn mega flare in the face and that could only make him bleed abit. I like both characters, but I won't bother to go in the detail why. Generally FF villains aren't anything special compared to other villains out there. But what makes them so good is how simple they are: they are driven by simple human desires, they want to be powerful, they want to prove themselves superior, stuff like that, they're not made of super-deep motives like Irenikus or something. ZaFlareStar 17:54, 4th September 2012 (GMT+3)

Looks like there was a pretty heated debate. I must admit that I never imagined Kuja being this populer, While I don't personally hate Kuja, he's also not someone I exceptionally love like Kefka or Sephiroth. But I'm not sure if I go over the top to dis a character bunch of other people like. Yea, it gets annoying when one character gets more praise than he probably should, but I'm not going to hold it over the character himself. I remember when everyone praised Cloud and Squall, even for someone like me who loved Cloud, hearing constant praises of him tends to get annoying, it's like you know... there are other characters out there. Sorry... not trying to make the fire any bigger, just putting my own feelings out there. Razordash05:48, September 9, 2012 (UTC)

Week 211: Seifer v. Gabranth[edit source]

Wal VIII 07 clean.jpg
DNC Versus.png
Gabranth - 012 CG.png
25½ to 27½
This week, the two infamous traitors face off. While their actions are often cruel and seemingly unforgivable, underneath their façades are kind souls.

Also, they kinda look alike.

25½ to 27½

Votes for Seifer[edit source]

  1. He's gonna need it, and Seifer is one of the few characters in VIII memorable for a reason other than total incompetence. Drake Clawfang (talk) 19:24, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  2. They do kinda look alike. And we all know which one of the two that look alike has a scar. SEIFER LIVES! DON'T LISTEN TO GARDEN'S LIES! -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 19:32, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  3. MMLN メーマウリアン 19:54, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Seifer killed Odin without even blinking CardboardBoxMan (talk) 19:57, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Tough choice, I like them both. However, I'll go with Seifer because I liked his duel with Squall in the intro, he killed Odin, and thereby summoned Gilgamseh; and *Spoiler alert* he doesn't die at the end of his game, unlike Gabranth/Noah. --Time Master (talk) 20:22, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Since I know more about VIII than XII, I'll go with Seifer. Besides, slicing Odin in half was badass of him. SelkieMaiden267 20:50, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Doesn't matter, I will NEVER go for Gabranth. Marauder 09 I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 22:29, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 23:12, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Vercery 23:09, August 26,2012 (UTC)
  10. SetzerLeonhart (talk) 03:16, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  11. I want his trenchcoatSquallisnotemo (talk) 05:23, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Chicken-wuss. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 06:04, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  13. eeeeeeeeeeehhhhhhhhhhh... OK, I'll vote for slicing Odin in half. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 09:44, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Because he's the reason Squall has his trademark scar. MissH <3 10:28, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Dunno why, I just like Seifer Hell-Fire98 (talk) 13:21, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  16. I can see his face. Rosenarm Brina-PSP-BattleSprite.png 16:41, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Seifer needs the votes...Balthierfan (talk) 21:17, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  18. I have to go with Seifer - he's just way more entertaining. "Let's go after them monsters!" ProfessorTofty (talk) 22:05, August 28, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Free bird (talk) 14:23, August 30, 2012 (UTC)
  20. He's one of those characters you always want them to join your team, even though they never do. Besides, even Odin was cut in half when trying to defeat him. JC Holy Knight 00:30, August 31, 2012 (UTC)
  21. He is definetly the better party leader, and I would have rather had him as a party leader than Squall. And I could trigger his R1-Crit from the beginning. He's more like my timing. MentalChocobo (talk) 09:56, August 31, 2012 (UTC)
  22. I love how close this fight is, and thus I cast my vote with Seifer, to make it a bit closer again. MirrorshardSceada 14:35, September 2, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Bad-ass sorceress' knight. Failed big-time, but still bad-ass anyway. Voting! 10:27, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  2. My bro agrees with me on this, for once! HAHAHA!!!! 02:41, August 28, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I can see that Gabranth might win this. But I really do want Seifer to win. 08:30, August 29, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Seifer'll show you the meaning of judgment, you bunch of chicken-wusses! 00:31, August 31, 2012 (UTC)
  5. The sorceress made him a knight for a reason. 08:37, August 31, 2012 (UTC)
  6. There was a reason Squall was scarred first 09:03, September 1, 2012 (UTC)
  7. ^ Yea. :))) 12:59, September 2, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Gabranth[edit source]

  1.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 19:18, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  2. <Random Hate joke/quote here>  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 19:20, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Oh come on. We don't even get to know wot drives the other guy. Fëasindë Peth 19:35, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  4. A good match-up. Gabranth was an awesome villain and character, so I'll stick with him CylindrusAltum 05:50, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  5. I hate FFVIII and Gabranth is the better character besides (though he's also the easier boss ;_;) C A T U S E 20:28, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Seifer's path to villainy is badly written.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 20:36, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  7. This one could go wither way for me :\ I prefer Gabranth just a little, though, I suppose. Jimcloud 21:14, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  8. --ClixPsi (talk) 21:42, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Gabranth actually learned a lesson and helped you at the end. Seifer was a jerk to the very end --Pzykosiz (talk) 22:33, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  10. He could have made a good Sith. (I've been playing WAY too much SWTOR...) King of Noobs 23:28, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Seifer is a douche. BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 - 23:32, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Shmeh. Unsane (talk) 23:49, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  13. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 13:21, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Sorry Seifer, you may need a vote for the sake of balance, but this guy over here is the best assisting antagonist ever. ZaFlareStar 17.04 August 27th 2012 (GMT+3)
  15. MystRay 16:56, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Obviously. --Leon95 17:08, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  17. My favourite FF character ever. Miyuron (talk) 20:32, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  18. He's a badass, nuff said. Constructive comment is constructive. Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 19:13, August 28, 2012 (UTC)
  19. For some reason I really don't like Seifer. Perhaps because he was partially deluded. At least Gabranth had his reasons. Luacas (talk) 12:43, August 29, 2012 (UTC)
  20. I do actually like both, but I consider Gabranth to be the more complete character. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 17:48, August 29, 2012 (UTC)
  21. Ok Rodrigosanmartin (talk) 17:35, August 31, 2012 (UTC)
  22. ScatheMote 02:37, September 1, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Gabranth is just cooler, but, if it was KH2 seifer, then i would have picked him, but it's not. Detrimont 03:36 September 1, 2012 (UTC)
  24. Far better design, excellent voice, excellent character, fun as hell in Dissidia; he's got it all. Absolclaw (talk) 14:42, September 1, 2012 (UTC)
  25. Cyruny 13:02 (CET), September 1, 2012

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Gabranth is a better character. Besides, he has epic armor.-- 21:27, August 26, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 08:20, August 27, 2012 (UTC) Seifer was awesome and cool , but gabranth .. Gabranth has an epic voice , look and his story was so tragic ..
  3. Gabranth is the coolest of the two. 18:52, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
  4. 19:52, August 30, 2012 (UTC)
  5. -- 07:34, August 31, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Is it just me or does anyone else agree that the two HOTTEST FF characters just went head to head in this Arena? For that reason alone I'm abstaining. God help whoever loses. =;( --Adelbert (talk) 21:53, August 26, 2012 (UTC)

Neither one seems that hot to me. Not Gabranth; not even Seifer, for whom I cast my vote this time. Would say who I do consider hot, but it's too cliche. SelkieMaiden267 00:17, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
Why is it "too cliche" to you? Is it because your Final Fantasy "hottest guy" is Sephiroth? Because (if I judge by looks alone) he is rather good-looking for an evil character. And he was one of the good guys before it all went wrong at Nibelheim... EdgarXTerra4ever 17:34, August 28, 2012 (UTC)
No, not Sephiroth. But my "hottest guy" in Final Fantasy does have something in common with the silver-haired badass in question... SelkieMaiden267 00:52, August 31, 2012 (UTC)

@Pzykosiz: Could be wrong, but in the ending cutscene it seems as though Seifer has made peace with the heroes, when he looks up at Garden and smiles. That's the vibe I got, anyhow. Though it doesn't exactly explain why Galbadia let a war criminal off the hook... Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 06:10, August 27, 2012 (UTC)

Galbadia is left without a leader at the end of game. Maybe they have other stuff to worry about than Seifer. Doesn't sound like their president is chosen by democratic elections, and who knows who was supposed to be Deling's successor. Unlikely people would want Deling No.2 though. Maybe chance for someone to seize power! I always thought Galbadian civil war would be a good FFVIII-2 plot. No more supernatural stuff.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 14:02, August 27, 2012 (UTC)
@matteus I found him to be so much more of a dick to everyone, and without much reason, I just can't bring myself to like him. Gabranth was doing it more because it was his job --Pzykosiz (talk) 01:45, August 28, 2012 (UTC)

Well, son of a submariner. Seems I can't vote at all in this fight...both Seifer and Gabranth are decidedly unsavory characters. EdgarXTerra4ever 17:34, August 28, 2012 (UTC)



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