Week 210: Last Man Standing Round 17: Kuja v. Yuna[edit source]

LMS Icon.png
Victor - 28½ to 19
Defeat - 28½ to 19
Kuja's fourth Last Man Standing match finally faces him off against a fellow mage, though of a different discipline, and disposition. Can the inaugural PS2 FF heroine take down the final PS1 FF antagonist?

Votes for Kuja[edit source]

  1. Ah, finally, I can vote for Kuja without any concerns for the other side! Thank you, Yuna! :D Jimcloud 04:14, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  2. C A T U S E 04:16, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Kuja is prettier than Yuna. Somehow--Otherarrow (talk) 04:18, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Don't know why. Just have to. BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 04:29, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Kuja's reign will last forever! Or for five matches, whatever. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 04:32, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Kuja's no longer the underdog. Let's see if he can make it to the end. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 05:20, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  7. While I really like Yuna and her story, I prefer Kuja's and thus, my vote goes to him. MirrorshardSceada 10:05, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  8. A) What OA said. B) From the PS1 era. C) More interesting. User:R8.50Mango/Sig2 11:49, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Kuja all the way SetzerLeonhart (talk) 12:30, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Hmm... I'm running out of man-thong joke. Oh, I know. Yuna's summons won't do her a whole lot of good, since Kuja masterminded the whole "rip the summons right out of her" that Garnet had to go through. King of Noobs 13:13, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Kuja is much more fabulous. Drake Clawfang (talk) 13:59, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  12. You need more 'a's and a tilde, Drake. Faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaabulous~ -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 13:57, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Balthierfan (talk) 14:33, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  14. While Yuna is a summoner, Kuja is a summon-controller and can laugh off a full blast from Mega Flare. Dogurasu (talk) 14:58, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Begin with broth of Mist, add fermented souls, and boil... Then, pour genuine black magic into a mixing bowl and heat to make an 8bit 19:41, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  16. How can I NOT vote for Kuja? Unsane (talk) 20:34, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  17. It takes two summoners to take down Kuja --Pzykosiz (talk) 22:32, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  18. MMLN メーマウリアン 23:25, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  19. I saw this, and I thought I was going to choose Yuna, but then I thought of Duodecim, and how Kuja, in his own way, was trying to help Cosmos' Warriors and switch sides for the next war. So he earns my vote and respect, even if Kekfa did make him go crazy the next cycle. A.J. two (Smashboards) 05:13, August 20, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Remember how he destroyed a planet? I doubt a single summoner can provide Kuja any challenge. User:Rezana7 13:00, August 20, 2012 (UTC)
  21. Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 13:52, August 20, 2012 (UTC)
  22. I really hate Yuna's voice in X. --Leon95 17:01, August 20, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Vercery 17:57, August 20, 2012 (UTC)
  24.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 13:54, August 21, 2012 (UTC)
  25. The power of the man-thong compels me... wait, no. Wrong week. MentalChocobo (talk) 06:47, August 23, 2012 (UTC)
  26. ScatheMote 23:34, August 23, 2012 (UTC)
  27. Cloudn 00:19, August 26, 2012 (UTC) Go Kuja!

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 08:35, August 20, 2012 (UTC) Kuja! ^_^
  2. 07:50, August 22, 2012 (UTC) sorry yuna , but in ffx-2 you were an epic fail , unlike kuja who was simply epic
  3. I'm actually casting this vote with a heavy heart, but shall still do so - anything so Kuja may no longer participate in the LMS. 23:33, August 23, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Yuna[edit source]

  1. Just liked her better, nothing more. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 04:17, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  2. She was a more useful party member. --BlueHighwind 04:18, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  3. It should be obvious.  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 04:37, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  4. I think it time for Kuja to step down, it get boring if someone always win the LMS.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 04:39, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Because I genuinely love Yuna. I admired her in FFX, and loved her even more in FFX-2 (liked the way she became more assertive and upbeat). SelkieMaiden267 04:44, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  6. This is the hardest fight ever... My two favorite characters of all time!!! Well, Yuna just barely edges out the competition for being...well...Yuna. MystRay 05:56, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Summoners are always targetted because than can summon aeons, very powerful aeons.—Kaimi (999,999 CP/5 TP) 15:16, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  8. --ClixPsi (talk) 15:29, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  9.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 16:26, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Go Yuna!!!!  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png17:02, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  11. I definitely prefer the kind-hearted girl who saves the world TWICE over the angry wizard who destroys a planet. EdgarXTerra4ever 17:30, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  12. I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja I hate Kuja...CylindrusAltum 07:19, August 20, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Yuna could pwn Kuja if she Grand Summoned Anima, forcing him to take at least 99,999 damage, and resulting in his death, and thus a better world. See the comments for the rest of my argument. --Time Master (talk) 21:26, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Anyone who can summon Anima gets my vote. --Marael (talk) 21:52, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  15. "What can I do for you?" Beat Kuja please.Squallisnotemo (talk) 09:11, August 22, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Why the hell not. Marauder 09 40px I can make the Black Sun look like a Swoop Gang. 17:17, August 23, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Easy. Not even close for me.--Random!to a point! 23:08, August 23, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Oh, please. MissH <3 16:00, August 25, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. I'm on the side of Time Master and the FFVI lover above him. Narcissistic planet-destroyers bug me. 23:44, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Voting for Yuna once more! Kuja is an excellent villain, but he lacks a summoner's power (considering he orchestrated the extraction of eidolons from Garnet). Therefore, Yuna would be more powerful. 02:38, August 21, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Having gotten to a certain point in Duodecim, I learned that Kuja was at least partially responsible for sabotaging Kefka's control over Terra, so that she eventually broke free of Chaos's ranks. Very well, I suppose I can fork over a few respect points for that. (But I'm still not going to vote in his favor. Certainly not when he's against beautiful, kind, and oh-so-caring Yuna, because of everyone who's stood against the silver wizard thus far, I really do consider Yuna to be my favorite.) SelkieMaiden267 04:52, August 19, 2012 (UTC)

@Tidus357: Tidus, you traitor! How could you? Don't you have a Summoner you should be guarding? SelkieMaiden267 05:09, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
A summoner, you say?!? I seem to be under the preposterous illusion that this "summoner" is of the common rabble, playing with guns and such things.
Er, yeah, my Kuja impressions suck. BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 05:30, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
Eh, Kuja would just extract Yuna's Aeons and blow crap up with them anyway. Y'know, Bahamut style. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 05:34, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
Guess I expected someone with a Tidus-based screen name to act in a manner more befitting a Guardian, especially given that Yuna is the Summoner involved (i.e. casting his vote for Yuna).
And no offense, but Kuja does have some commonality with Seymour Guado: both are destructive mages with flamboyant dress and pretentious mannerisms. *raises hands defensively* I would've thought any voter with a FFX-based alias would understand that much, at least. SelkieMaiden267 05:51, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
The same can be said for Emperor Mateus, actually. Ultimecia as well, to a degree. And don't even get me started on Kefka. XD Dogurasu (talk) 15:02, August 19, 2012 (UTC)

I really hope we can get through this week without another ridiculous argument breaking out. The Peanut Gallery from the last LMS is just... ugh. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 05:38, August 19, 2012 (UTC)

Well, thankfully if Kuja does win this bout, we only have to see his smarmy face one more time before he gets either toppled or forced to retire. If that means we never see him again, so much the better. EdgarXTerra4ever 18:34, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
I'd like to point out that flinging insults at Kuja is not making me more hopeful. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 22:56, August 19, 2012 (UTC)

Hey, maybe if Yuna wins this fight, her next LMS bout will force her to face off against one of her or her father's former guardians...or a much more dangerous foe. I've seen Jecht v. Golbez, Jecht v. Kefka, and Auron v. Sephiroth all on the current shortlist. How would that be if Yuna had to face Jecht or Auron, or maybe someone decidedly more sinister? EdgarXTerra4ever 18:51, August 19, 2012 (UTC)

Even Garland (ff9) knew Kuja was a failure, which is why he created Zidane. Kuja was also too weak to muster any physical attacks at all, so he was forced to rely on the supposedly "inferior" Zidane to retrieve the Gulug stone of Oeilvert. Also, a mere frog was able to undo the "inescapable" traps at his desert palace. I've stood against Kuja every step of the way, and will continue to do so, until he has been purged from existence (or the DNC I suppose.) --Time Master (talk) 21:29, August 19, 2012 (UTC)

Well, suffice to say that I and a couple of others have explained previously why the "faults" you list about Kuja are precisely what make him one of the most compelling characters in the series. Clearly you didn't listen. What a pity -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 21:36, August 19, 2012 (UTC)

Well, I was simply arguing why he is a weak character (which he is). However, I can step away from that issue for now. I do not find him compelling at all. His flawed character isn't interesting or unique. He commits numerous hackneyed atrocities; including his desire for ultimate power (trance in this case) and his fear of his mortality, (reminds me too much of Xande's goal is ff3.) Thus, I conclude that no matter what way you look at it, Kuja is little more than a tragic character whose final fate in unknown; all too similar to many other characters in literature. --Time Master (talk) 22:15, August 19, 2012 (UTC)

Considering his Ultima is a TPK, and is strong enough outside of battle to destroy a planet, whereas Yuna struggles to take down a giant floating whale (and can't do so head-on) ... I'm fairly certain Kuja is actually the superior mage. And lets be frank here, the only reason Yuna would be used as a physical attacker is because her ultimate weapon is the easiest in the cast to get at full power. Subpar strength is a weakness they share.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 22:24, August 19, 2012 (UTC)
"Kuja was too weak to muster a physical attack..." No, he was a mage and believed physical combat to be beneath him. Magic is more elegant, and he fought like a mage. "A mere frog was able to undo the inescapable traps..." Yes, a mere frog... with the mind of an engineer-king. "...isn't interesting or unique." An angel of death orchestrating wars and overthrowing his master isn't interesting or unique? "...his desire for ultimate power and his fear of... mortality." Ultimate power is a major goal of every Final Fantasy villain from Garland to Vayne Novus Solidor, and his reason to fear mortality occurs as he is basically told "You have an incurable illness and may have a few months to live if you're lucky." So what if he has a few passing similarities to other villains? His personality is different, and that is what counts most of all. Dogurasu (talk) 14:13, August 20, 2012 (UTC)
Don't forget that Kuja was hit by a direct blast from Bahamut's Megaflare (the same attack that destroyed Brahne's fleet and Alexandria), and came out with nothing but a scratch. Hell, he even laughed afterwards. I wouldn't call that weak.
By the way, someone should update the DNC fight on the front page of the Wiki. It still says Yuna vs. Serah. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 05:55, August 20, 2012 (UTC)

I don't understand. After reading the votes for Yuna, what's with all this hate for Kuja? Where's the basis of this hate? Apart from Time Master who is actually the only person who manages to give valid reasons for his dislike, the rest of them seem as though they hate Kuja simply because he's winning these DNC fights. Cloudn 09:13, August 20, 2012 (UTC)

Could be because (and I know this because I've been watching) some people believe that villains inherently deserve all the hate that audiences throw at them, and the voters currently in Yuna's camp are running out of ways to express their hate without getting cracked down upon by the committee. Because of that, they're frustrated. In the fight where Kuja-haters cast their votes for Fang, someone with a FFXIII-based alias got yellow-carded, apparently for mocking Kuja's questionable sexuality. In the one against Cloud, Selkie (whose vote in this fight seems to have more to do with genuinely loving Yuna than with hating Kuja) mentioned that she too was ousted...though that might have been more about the "blame the committee for letting Kuja in to begin with" remark than about her referring to the wizard as "He-Who-Doesn't-Deserve-To-Be-Named."
Me? Mostly I vote against Kuja because I'm an inherently pro-hero voter who would never be caught dead casting my lot with any villain. And there's nothing wrong with a broad pro-hero streak, is there? EdgarXTerra4ever 16:05, August 20, 2012 (UTC)
He was not yellow-carded for questioning Kuja's sexuality, but for calling him a "girly fag". (Please do not post anything obnoxious and/or extraordinarily lengthy or it will be removed.) C A T U S E 03:04, August 21, 2012 (UTC)
I knew it was some degrading descriptor of such nature as people frequently throw at individuals who are either known or perceived to be of alternative sexuality. Hence someone in the committee wouldn't tolerate it. EdgarXTerra4ever 04:31, August 21, 2012 (UTC)
I only read one vote that directly expresses much hate. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 16:27, August 20, 2012 (UTC)

I think if Kuja wins the Last Man Standing, he should go up against the other LMS winner, Cecil Harvey. Now that would be a good fight. Who's with me? Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 05:05, August 21, 2012 (UTC)

Fights like that are being reserved for special situations where the previous "Qualifying" fight isn't compatible with the current "Last Man Standing Champion." ie. a Spell fight, or things of the such. Don't worry, we'll see something like that EVENTUALLY. It's inevitable. King of Noobs 13:20, August 22, 2012 (UTC)

Week 209: Yuna v. Serah[edit source]

DNC Versus.png
Serah Farron - White Mage Attire.png
34 to 15
Two characters, who are shy and reserved, are thrown in extraordinary circumstances and must stay strong through suffering and loss. Or, at least that's what happened in their original game.

Now they get to run around in more and more revealing clothing, go through tons of strange sidequests and minigames, and are thrown into circumstances that less than sensible.

But hey, at least there's a jump button now.
34 to 15

Votes for Yuna[edit source]

  1. I really liked her strong willed, devoted, serious character in 10, even though X-2 was much worse than XIII-2, i think Yuna still comes out ahead --CarloGrimaldi (talk) 06:31, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Both sequels killed the character from the original and replaced them with something completely different, it's just that I didn't care for the "before" Serah. Also, Yuna is very sweet. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 06:44, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 07:20, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Yuna is just better. Plain and simple.  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 07:55, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Going with the girl who willing to die to save world but survive over the girl who *coughdidanddestorytheworldcough*  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 08:13, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  6. --ClixPsi (talk) 08:30, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Favourite game, strongest character, better story, didnt' die....the list goes onSquallisnotemo (talk) 08:42, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Eh. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 09:10, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  9. This was a hard decision.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png11:43, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Because she's a summoner. And an ex-summoner. Dogurasu (talk) 12:36, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Ummmm, it's Yuna. If you know me, you know why I vote here. MystRay 12:38, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  12. This is for Pre-2 Yuna, who was a surprisingly powerful party member. Unlike Pre-2 Serah, who was stuck in a crystal almost the whole game. King of Noobs 13:33, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  13. I haven't actually played XIII-2 but I have read the outline for it here and have to say I liked X and X-2 better. Joshbl56 13:57, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  14. W00t! Go Yuna! EdgarXTerra4ever 15:58, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  15. (From being spoiled by others,) I get the impression that Yuna is stronger character/personality-wise than Serah. Just a feeling, though. :) MissH <3 16:09, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Are you KIDDING ME?? What is the point of this? --BlueHighwind 16:16, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  17. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 18:33, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  18. CylindrusAltum Only Yuna has the strength to usurp the evil Kuja. I vote with this in mind. 06:05, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Syenyho If someone has to go against Kuja, then it is obvious that Yuna will be the victor. Serah is not my type at all. Plus, not to be mean or anything, but she is the sister of Lightning. 13:34, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Saved the world twice --Pzykosiz (talk) 04:04, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
  21. --Reim D'Neir (talk) 06:21, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Hands down. bibliomaniac15 06:53, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Summoner represent! also cos Yunie's my fave character in the series --Arciel Spira (talk) 07:04, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
  24. ==Trindadex== 00:27, August 14, 2012 (UTC)
  25. Yuna is a great character in X who went downhill with X-2. Serah was crystallized for 90% of the game, and was only active at the very beginning and end. She seems to have gotten better in XIII-2, but Yuna is still better personality-wise (in X), and she actually made a large impact in her original game. Bringing the Eternal Calm > Crystal Stasis. --Time Master (talk) 03:45, August 14, 2012 (UTC)
  26. Isn't it obvious? Yuna is absolutely the better character, and I say so without a single shadow of doubt in my mind. Unsane (talk) 01:05, August 15, 2012 (UTC)
  27. ScatheMote 02:46, August 15, 2012 (UTC)
  28. Playing through X right now, and so far, I like Yuna more than Serah. No question that my vote goes here. Carbuncle.pngEpicCarbunkl 18:53, August 16, 2012 (UTC)
  29. If I recall correctly I suggested this fight ( ;P ). Unneediness aside, personally, I think that Yuna did way better in X-2 than Serah in XIII-2: Yuna finally started to live her life, while Serah was still made a puppet of gods... -_-" —Kaimi (999,999 CP/5 TP) 19:40, August 16, 2012 (UTC)
  30. Yuna is my personal favorite female protagonist of all time since FFX is my fav FF series, so sorry Serah! --TerraBranford145322 (talk) 06:49, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
  31. Voting for Yuna cause her earring rocks and Serah's too much of an 'sticky girlfriend'. --Nerdy geek bk (talk) 12:20, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
  32. Destriker73 (talk) 14:05, August 18, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. When I played through FFXIII and FFXIII-2, I like to call Serah "Miss Useless". And for good reason. Go Yunie! 07:03, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 16:27, August 12, 2012 (UTC) You see Yuna throughout the whole game, and she becomes your best spellcaster, even better than Lulu. Plus, super-powered Aeons? Double Overdrives? I vote for her!
  3. I agree with Cylindrus, and with the anon-voter just above me. 20:35, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  4. I am creeped out by the fact I literally thought of this fight just two days before it was posted! That said, I was already decided on Yuna, my favorite female character! 14:52, Augst 12, 2012 (UTC) 21:53, August 12, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Serah[edit source]

  1. WhatisthisIdon'teven. Why are we voting Yuna v. Yuna? Well, I'll just vote for the Yuna with a real weapon. C A T U S E 05:50, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  2. I don't like Yuna's personality. At all. I don't care if she's supposed to represent a Japanese ideal or if Tidus and Yuna's relationship is supposed to represent how that ideal isn't always, well, ideal; I just don't care for her personality. It irks me. Jimcloud 05:51, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Serah is just a little more appealing to me.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 06:13, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 10:55, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  5. MMLN メーマウリアン 19:39, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Pity vote, and my whoring is more visible here :p. Doreiku Kuroofangu - Visit the Soul Shrine! 19:54, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  7. I like Yuna, but I think Serah is the better character. And while XIII-2 has its problems, it didn't damage Serah in my eyes as much as X-2 damaged Yuna -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 20:01, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  8. I wanted to come up with a good reason for this vote, but I couldn't think of anything except the bowsword and the fact that she needs the vote more. MirrorshardSceada 21:12, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  9. ^ This. Although, I definitely think XIII-2 Serah was an improvement over XIII Serah, if only because we were able to gain a better understanding of her character. I also really like her voice actress (who also voiced Cloud of Darkness :3) 8bit 21:25, August 12, 2012 (UTC)
  10.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 03:36, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
  11. I have always loved Serah so yeah:) GlassAngel13 (talk) 10:28, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
  12. They didn't completely ruin her in the sequel.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 22:58, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Yuna winning? How come? Serah is such a more attractive girl and better character overall. Why not choose her? --BGMaxie (talk) 03:20, August 14, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Squee. --Leon95 16:44, August 15, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Serah has naturally pink hair, beat that Yuna! 19:08, August 14, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 17:23, August 18, 2012 (UTC)I know Serah is going to lose, but she's so cute!

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

So... assuming Yuna wins, are we gonna have her in her X-2 Gunner picture next week? Skimpy mini-skirt vs Man Thong? King of Noobs 01:15, August 13, 2012 (UTC)

Yes. Let it be so. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 01:26, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
That might be absolutely horrid, but this very fight was going to be much worse. Having seen a picture of what Scathe looks like makes it even MORE terrifying. C A T U S E 02:51, August 13, 2012 (UTC)
*shakes the Eight Ball* Hmm. Not Likely. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 04:36, August 13, 2012 (UTC)

In all fairness, SirLaguna, I think the only reason Serah wasn't messed up in the second game was because her part in the first was next to non-existant outside of "in the past" cut-scenes. King of Noobs 02:04, August 14, 2012 (UTC)

And, of course, that is your opinion. Some could argue that she had no real personality in X-2. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 02:45, August 14, 2012 (UTC)

It's funny that you should say that Serah had barely any part in her first game. It's because of her Lightning highjacked a train in search of her, Sazh follows Lightning just to make it out alive, Snow turns the whole place into a battlefield to save her, which in turn causes Hope to get caught up in all of it, and makes them all turn into L'Cie, gaining uber-magical powers and starting most of the plotline. Lol. Meanwhile, Vanille and Fang are on their own agenda, which would be unaffected by the other's actions anyway. --UntoldSarcasm (talk) 07:00, August 14, 2012 (UTC)

My issue with Serah is that the first game treats her as a plot device rather than an actual character. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 11:58, August 14, 2012 (UTC)

Serah's White Mage costume is so much better than Yuna's.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 00:18, August 15, 2012 (UTC)

Are you talking about her outfit in X, or her dressphere in X-2? - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 00:37, August 15, 2012 (UTC)

There's a lot of similarities in the girls as well. Say both of of them wear more revealing clothing in the sequels, and are quite soft-spoken. What's more, they have been kissed by their respective 'boyfriends' (though I doubt Tidus is considered Yuna's hun) --Nerdy geek bk (talk) 12:15, August 17, 2012 (UTC)

Week 208: Last Man Standing Round 16: Kuja v. Cloud[edit source]

Dissidia Kuja.png
LMS Icon.png
Cloud Dissidia Artwork.png
Victor - 37½ to 31½
Defeat - 37½ to 31½
Fresh from his second victory, Kuja moves to score his third win in this heated competition, while Cloud moves to dethrone him. Will the spiky-haired protagonist ruffle Kuja's feathers? Or will the genome's magic make Cloud's chocobo hair run away? Who will be the Last Man Standing?

Votes for Kuja[edit source]

  1. Peacocks are obviously so much better than chocobos. C A T U S E 19:27, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Cloud isn't nearly sexy enough. --BlueHighwind 19:59, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Tetraninja321 20:09, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 20:10, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  5. No contest in my eyes. Kuja is among my favourite villains, whereas I never really liked Cloud. Plus, the guy's a poet, that's gotta count for something! MirrorshardSceada 22:13, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I never thought I'd say this, but I agree with BH. :P -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 22:26, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  7. I would have voted Kuja anyway, but the outpouring of mindless Kuja hate on the other side only strengthens my vote. Kuja is by far and away one of the most complex and interesting characters in the series, and while I like Crisis Core Cloud, even he doesn't compare, let alone any other incarnation of Cloud -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 01:03, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Meh. I'm just a big enough fanboy, I suppose... Unsane (talk) 02:11, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Those who refuse to worship the man-thong are heretics and shall be punished. King of Noobs 04:16, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  10. --Pzykosiz (talk) 06:52, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Sadly, I don't think Kuja can overcome the might of the VII fanboys :( Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 07:42, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  12. I sorta knew the whole thing was leading to that. But hey, it's still worth trying. User:Rezana7 12:08, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Curtain rise! Dogurasu (talk) 12:56, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  14. SetzerLeonhart (talk) 13:30, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Balthierfan (talk) 15:22, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  16. User:R8.50Mango/Sig2 17:15, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  17. This is clearly gonna be close so better vote this round. But I think the Angel of Death will pull this one through. Adelbert 22:22, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  18. ^Cat. Also, ^Blue. Also, ^Noobking, ^Mateus, and ^Rezana. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 22:59, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  19. So I love both characters, but the hate for Kuja makes me support him more than Cloud. Sorry Cloud, I don't mean to vote against you, but I think Kuja along with FFIX is underrated. Cloudn 04:05, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Voting with the knowledge that Kuja can't be "butchered" (with regards to Flanderization) anymore than Cloud can. Seriously, Cloud doesn't deserve it, nobody does. SidVI Dissicon ff7 Tifa2.png 15:31, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
  21. Cruel moon, bring the end - The dawn will never rise again 8bit 22:25, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
  22. ScatheMote 13:27, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Vote moved to Peanut GallerySutebenukun 15:32, 8 August 2012 (UTC)
  24. Kuja is an excellent character, and one of the best antagonists in any game, showing deep and true development. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 21:31, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  25. Second best villain behind Kefka, in my opinion. Go Kuja. Carbuncle.pngEpicCarbunkl 02:38, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  26. As much as I love Cloud, Kuja was just a perfect villain. I also hope this time someone doesn't mess around with votes just so their character can win >:( --NeoExdeath (talk) 04:54, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  27. Kuja is a swell guy. Cloud is lame and evil.--Random!to a point! 05:32, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  28. I can't see what is so brillant about Cloud. I quite like the guy, but... I don't think he is THE GUY people keep saying (especially when we consider the compilation). Kuja, on the other hand, is arguably the most developed villain in the series, and brings us a very interesting backstory. Besides, in a fight like this, Kuja is much more powerful(Ultima). JC Holy Knight 11:58, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  29. ==Trindadex== 18:36, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  30. " I won't let this world exist without me!" Vercery 19:05, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  31.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 22:12, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  32. No contest MystRay 15:26, August 11, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 06:05, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 17:01, August 6, 2012 (UTC) kuja is awesome!
  3. 18:03, August 6, 2012 (UTC)"So the curtain rises! Perfect, my canary. Let me show you the truth about your mother! First Act: The End of the Ugly Desire. It's showtime!"
  4. 01:34, August 7, 2012 (UTC)Kuja Rocks!
  5. Never really understood the huge appeal of Cloud. Kuja, on the other hand, was a great villain and overall character in his own right. Kuja all the way. 01:38, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Kuja for sure! I don't necessarily approve of his crazy sense of, er, style, but he was a great antagonist with plenty of depth and distinctive characterisation - not to mention the fact that he's great fun to fight. As for Cloud, I never could find it in me to like him or even sympathize with him, and I suspect I never shall. -- 16:43, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Cloud is not the best hero in the series, but Kuja is the best antagonist. 20:03, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  8. 21:50, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Kuja 4 the win (cloud's overrated84.13.38.238 11:51, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Cloud has enough attention already! 06:24, August 10, 2012 (UTC)
  11. I've always liked Kuja. But I've never felt a strong connection to Cloud, so Kuja gets my vote. 22:35, August 11, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Cloud[edit source]

  1. I'd like to vote for Kuja. I don't dislike him. Honestly. But people keep making it so that the fights that come up are all with people I'll vote for before Kuja! Why is that? Jimcloud 19:26, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  2. No contest for me.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 19:27, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  3.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png19:29, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  4. I voted for Lightning because I thought she had the best chance of dethroning Kuja. I will continue to vote against this miserable excuse for a character so long as the sky is blue and the Earth rotates east around its own axis. CylindrusAltum 05:46, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  5. This vote needs no explanation!  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 19:56, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  6. But Cloud is sexy. --Shockstorm (talk) 20:10, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Because I specifically like Cloud's character growth in VII alone more than I liked how Kuja evolved in IX. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 20:59, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Rodrigosanmartin (talk) 21:39, August 5, 2012 (UTC) Come on Cloud! You are the best! You're Zack's living legacy and you make a great couple with Tifa! XD
  9. MMLN メーマウリアン 01:07, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  10.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 04:29, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Because I like anti-heroesSquallisnotemo (talk) 09:11, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  12. --ClixPsi (talk) 15:40, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Eh. --Leon95 16:50, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Rosenarm Brina-PSP-BattleSprite.png 17:23, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Cloud is alright, but my real reason for voting here is to stop the horrendous character known as Kuja from gaining victories at the DNC. And before anyone starts aiming Flare Stars and Ultimas in my direction; I would like to point out, that I will explain my reasoning in the comments. --Time Master (talk) 19:06, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  16. So sorry, Kuja. After thinking this through, I guess I have nothing against you, after all. But I haven't played IX yet, so... MissH <3 23:46, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Cloud again, he is an awesome character in the original, and dissidia flanderized every character, not just cloud. have you even seen dissidia Bartz?? ugh. --CarloGrimaldi (talk) 09:11, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Cloud only crossdressing at one point in the game. Yiazmat slayerz (talk) 09:37, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Cloud is better. --Reim D'Neir (talk) 12:38, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  20.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 12:58, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  21. --Xabryn (talk) 13:05, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Thisisabluelink 13:58, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  23. maybe he is overatted but he is still awesome!XAZARZOTL/TALK 21:21, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  24. Cloud J Strife (talk) 21:34, August 8, 2012 (UTC)Cloud wins hands down! Reasons: I've never seen him lose a fight yet (but then I'm new to FF), he's so cool in Advent Children and sharp swords settle scores!
  25. オメガ Mk.XII 04:38, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  26. Anyone who destroys a planet (or even tries to) deserves a good hard ass-kicking. Cloud gave Sephiroth the ass-kicking he deserved TWICE; now I want to see him do the same to Kuja. EdgarXTerra4ever 04:47, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  27. ZaXXaZ 05:53, August 9, 2012 (UTC) i doubt kuja is a men.

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 22:44, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Because Cloud rocks. 15:59, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
  3. 16:23, August 6, 2012 (UTC) Cloud Wins!
  4. 21:54, August 6, 2012 (UTC) Cloud IS Zack's living legacy, so he should avenge him.
  5. 01:45, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
  6. 09:29, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
  7. 20:27, August 8, 2012 (UTC) Yeah my bro (Cloud J Strife) came to me saying "Wiki, Cloud, vote, now" and i'm like:"...Ok!"
  8. 03:04, August 9, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Come on! Cloud can't be allowed to lose to a man with silver hair! Even if said silver-haired man is a wizard instead of a swordsman. 22:55, August 9, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Scathe's currently incapable of accessing the internet, and so here I am, updating the DNC. Like this. Updating. Yeah. Anyways. Um. So. There's a, uh... fight. Yeah. A fight. And it's all up and stuff for you guys to vote on. Yup. Jimcloud 19:25, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

err... right. Sounds... nice, I guess. C A T U S E 19:27, August 5, 2012 (UTC)
It sounded a lot better in my head. Jimcloud 19:28, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

Go on, Cloud. Finish what Zack started. (Again.) SelkieMaiden267 20:05, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

On the other hand, if Cloud wins (especially if Cloud wins), I hope that another short-time-on-the-shortlist fight does NOT wind up taking place. Because then, calamity and a fanwar will most definitely ensue. SelkieMaiden267 05:09, August 6, 2012 (UTC)

@Tetraninja: it's way, waaay too early to say that. Kuja's only down by four votes right now, by my reckoning. Now, if the lead was more like ten votes, then I might be inclined to agree. Wait until more votes start coming in. Jimcloud 20:14, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

@Selkie: And being a pretentious twit is a bad thing because ... C A T U S E 22:29, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

Oh, I could think of many other, more colorful monikers to describe the character in question...but I don't have any wish of getting ousted by someone in the committee for use of obscene language or some other nonsense like that. So, for now, "pretentious twit" will do. SelkieMaiden267 05:09, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
I take it you haven't played Final Fantasy IX...? Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 07:45, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
Didn't need to. My experience with Kuja was in Dissidia, and even there I found him terribly annoying. (At least Kefka was funny some of the time, unlike this peacock!) So, I figure, how much MORE obnoxious must he be in IX? "I am NOT in the mood!" (intro; Kefka to Kuja) SelkieMaiden267 15:10, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
So you base your opinion of a character on a game that mercilessly butchered all growth any of the characters had in their original game? That's like judging the movie Iron Man based solely on watching Avengers. Or any individual movie for that matter. Pardon me if this sounds rude, but to me, that's just pure ignorance. MirrorshardSceada 15:16, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
Ohhh, that explains your problem. Dissidia's portrayal of Kuja was not accurate, and though D012's was a bit closer it wasn't accurate either. You really need to play the game to get the character. You can't just play Dissidia and hope to get it. Jimcloud 15:18, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
Yes you do need to play IX to judge Kuja properly. Your basing your liking of Kuja from a game where he appears alongside twenty other characters who all try to take the limelight.
In FFIX he is one of the key villains and he has a proper back-story, proper ties to other characters, and its his original story. You're basing your liking of Kuja on him being not-very-nice? Well he's a villain, and you're more likely to get it if you played his original game (with his original story). He also didn't have a voice in IX which is a major plus. 15:21, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
Actually, a lot of the villains tend to be a little less obnoxious in their original games. Dissidia in general emphasized particular personality traits and basically made everybody hammy in order to get them to stand out around one another - at least, that's how it seems to me. Dogurasu (talk) 15:34, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
I'll agree with a lot of the others. Kuja was much more poetic, artistic and human in Final Fantasy IX. It's such a good story to see, even though we know he's the main antagonist and must be killed. If you have access to the PSN, I really suggest you purchase FFIX from their PSOne Classics. If just for how classic the gameplay is. King of Noobs 16:36, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
I just lol at the implication that Cloud was any better in Dissidia. And at least DFF!Kuja was capable of speaking without. Having a pause. Between every. Other word he. Said. Now that, I call annoying -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 17:26, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
So you didn't play the original game, and then based your opinions on a version of the character in a game where they Flanderised them to hell and back? Aaaand you think your opinion is valid...how exactly? User:R8.50Mango/Sig2 17:30, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
I shall echo the sentiments of those above, in particular Sceada. Judging a character entirely on their portrayal in Dissidia is pretty much the same as judging a book entirely by the blurb. Dissidia condensed and exaggerated characteristics to such an extent that the results are well known for being massively Flanderized. Specifically, Kuja in the original Dissidia was so oddly characterised that it was necessary in Duodecim to add an arc explaining that Kefka had messed with his memories in the previous cycle. The voice actors also do not help in some instances, and the JP VAs for certain characters are far more fitting.
Ultimately, you have managed to prove that your blind hatred of Kuja is no more than pure, unbridled ignorance. You loathe the character without fully understanding them or even making any effort to try. Jejune only begins to cover it. Oh, and I will also add that your habit of contextomy is irritating, although it has ascended to quite hilariously fatuous of late.
To summarise, this video describes you and your opinions quite marvellously. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 18:01, August 6, 2012 (UTC)

@Kuja and @Sorceror: "You're annoying." (Sephiroth to Kefka) SelkieMaiden267 18:10, August 6, 2012 (UTC)

"Try coming up with something both witty and original, rather than neither." (me to you) -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 18:56, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
...there really are no words adequate. I'll try replying in your language. "I'm... at a loss for words..." (Kefka to Exdeath, Duodecim) http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 19:18, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
Hey, I'm not the one who started all the trolling. Blame the committee. They're the ones who thought it would be a good idea to let He-Who-Doesn't-Deserve-To-Be-Named compete in the DNC to begin with. SelkieMaiden267 19:23, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
The DNC is there for all characters, not just those you like. If you don't like the way things are run here, open your own arena. The committee is fair in the way it acts and chooses fights, and as we can see from the example with Kryle, it gives every character a chance to shine. And I for one highly appreciate that. MirrorshardSceada 22:19, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
Damn, what the hell happened here? I think a few people have been taking this a little too seriously. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 02:04, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
My guess is since it's summer there are more people with free time and corrospondingly spend more time here. That means more opportunities for teh dramahz, since it's been happening a lot recently.C A T U S E 02:08, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
A classic case of milking the lolcow. IMO there's a lot of ignorant people out there, and he/she's just one of many. You guys already educated him/her on the subject, so let's leave it at that. Let this guy be ignorant if he/she wants to. Chocolancer (talk) 05:56, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
For more people being here, still having only 15 to 30 votes per side is pathetic. I remember when this place used to clear 50 to 60 votes a side easy. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 03:38, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
That was when matches stayed up for three weeks on average, though. Changing fights punctually may prevent some of our more passing visitors from voting, but it's still nice to have reliable updates. 8bit 03:55, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
I meant on the wiki in general. The VfFA flame war for instance, and the Article Creation Policy debacle. C A T U S E 03:59, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
That was not a flame war. That was a discussion with substance. In that discussion there were instances of peoplebeingdicksandnotaddingvalue tho'. At least, I didn't see it as a flamewar.
I think people read things wrong. 13:03, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
It may be a discussion with substance but the random ranting is enough to make it a flame war. C A T U S E 04:33, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
I don't see how a discussion created as an experiment to "see if anyone noticed" was a "discussion with substance". And that's by Jbed's own account. --Shockstorm (talk) 14:25, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
I was only referring to the VfFA "flame war". I'm sorry I did not make that clear (because I forgot he even mentioned the ACP thing). JBed (talk) 14:42, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
I can't say I really know you, Ark, but frankly... you're more than awesome. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 04:23, August 7, 2012 (UTC)
Why thank you; I am flattered :p
...we should form an alliance. Starfall and Ultima! Together we could rule the wiki world! http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 21:31, August 8, 2012 (UTC)

(From my earlier post) I have played and replayed FF9 all the way through, and I still do not like Kuja. A good villain does not leave the protagonist on another planet to prove his supposed "superiority" rather than outright killing him. Kuja's enormous ego (and hubris) is best noted in the (paraphrased) quote, "the world shouldn't be allowed to exist without me". What is meant to be "artistic" and "cool" comes off as snobbish, childish, and arrogant. That (among other reasons) is why I will (almost) always vote against Kuja. --Time Master (talk) 19:11, August 6, 2012 (UTC)

Killing Zidane outright wouldn't prove Kuja's superiority. He wanted to be superior even after Zidane had grown. And Kuja is snobbish, childish and arrogant. He'd be far less interesting a character if he weren't. All of his grandeur and posing is part of his complex. He's not "meant to be artistic and cool", and if that's what you think his character design was aiming for, then you really haven't understood him at all -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 19:22, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
Kuja may think himself that he is "artistic and cool" but the player is meant to be able to see through his façade of how immature and broken he really is.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 19:30, August 6, 2012 (UTC)
Not all characters are supposed to be "cool" or "relate-able" on every level, especially villains. They should have to explain their motives, something they can do in only their own terms, which will almost always come off as arrogant or self-serving. They are, in the end, there to be defeated by the heroes or else the world is condemned to destruction or death; no matter what lofty goals they proclaim to have, the villain is, ultimately, in it for his own power and prestige. Additionally, the statement "the world shouldn't be allowed to exist without me" is at the point where he has just been pushed over the edge of sanity, anyway. It serves no purpose other than to demonstrate that he is no longer even attempting to keep up a facade of sophistication. ...In my opinion, anyway. Dogurasu (talk) 12:43, August 7, 2012 (UTC)

@ - Dissidia 012. Cloud gets his butt kicked by Chaos. Then again, I think the way he defeated Sephiroth at the Nibelheim reactor proves one of two things: Either Cloud is exceptionally powerful, or Sephiroth is weak enough to be mortally wounded by a 14 year old rookie. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 04:13, August 8, 2012 (UTC)

I'm leaning on "weak enough to be wounded by a 14 year old rookie". It would explain why the final battle is ridiculously easy, esp. compared to Carry Armor and Demons Gate. C A T U S E 04:33, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
Just like Achilles has his heel, Sephiroth has his vulnerability to teenagers with silly hair. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 07:27, August 8, 2012 (UTC)

Erm... I have the feeling that the three votes for Cloud by Cloudfan1998, Cloti4ever and Bagrisks98 are sockpuppets. All three accounts were made at the same time purely to vote at DNC within a short time frame, all three usernames are somewhat related (two include the date 1998, and two are related to VII), and the message "Cloud 4ever" is the same for two votes. Methinks it's another attempt to ruin poor ol' Kuja's chances in the vote. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 08:48, August 8, 2012 (UTC)

I'm going to point it out to the next DNC staffer (Probably Jimmeh, I think) that comes onto IRC, let them decide what to do. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 08:52, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
It was almost certainly sockpuppetry. If the users whose votes I deleted want to contest this decision, they are free to. ScatheMote 10:12, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
Cloti4ever is an VII related name as well, it's the fan-name for the CloudxTifa ship. C A T U S E 13:26, August 8, 2012 (UTC)

I would like to point out that Kuja is the only villain in the entire franchise that you never beat. In every single battle he fights you, he wins and knocks you out; he then kills you which shows that even killing the god of death won't make you powerful enough to kill Kuja who then saves you before you die again where he tells Zidane that all he really wanted was a chance to live. He has manipulated a world into complete chaos and disorder causing war after war and the destruction of two kingdoms, created an entire race of beings and a new specie of monster, destroyed a world out of pure anger and came quite close to destroying the crystal of another world.Sutebenukun 15:32, 8 August 2012 (UTC)

@Sutebenukun: Um, no, going for accuracy, Golbez has him beat by nearly a decade on never being defeated by the party. Jimcloud 14:48, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
@Jimcloud: I thought he had been, in the Crystal Chamber behind Giott's throne. All the same, that did not stop his disembodied hand from crawling up, grabbing the Crystal, and vanishing. It was a defeat, but not exactly a loss, for Golbez - he still got what he was there for, despite being defeated in battle. Dogurasu (talk) 14:51, August 8, 2012 (UTC)
Oh, you're right, I spaced and forgot about that part; that's what I get for writing things early in the morning. Jimcloud 16:46, August 8, 2012 (UTC)

MORE CHEATING? For the love of Jenova... C A T U S E 01:24, August 9, 2012 (UTC)

Huh. Was kinda hoping Lightning would have won the last one. Cloud's had enough time in the spotlight... Wonder if Caius will show up in here, and how he'll do. Caius is a boss, but I respect your opinion if you'd like to try and hate on me. --UntoldSarcasm (talk) 06:28, August 9, 2012 (UTC)

SE's putting her in the spotlight; this is just a popularity contest. As far as Caius, I personally don't think I'd ever put up a fight with him in it seeing as how I have never played XIII-2 and generally don't have the will to, but hey, this is a three ring circus we run here, and I'm just one wheel. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 06:41, August 9, 2012 (UTC)

I guess you're right. Maybe you should look up a playthrough on youtube, or check his page on this wiki, lol. Kinda unrelated, but I'm still kind of angry about a post I saw a while ago on this site, about how FFXIII fans are getting grouped in with the FFVII fans. That's just not cool in doing that, give us a break lol. But yea, just out of personal curiosity, I'd like to see how he does. He'll probably lose, because everyone seems to hate the XIII's. Honestly, I started my FF fan-ness with XIII, just because it looked like an interesting game when it came out, and I heard good things about it. And they were right, it was awesome. Then there were OTHER final fantasys, and the rest is history. Can't we just like and respect ALL the games? --UntoldSarcasm (talk) 07:20, August 10, 2012 (UTC)

"Can't we just like and respect ALL the games?"
I support this wholeheartedly; I only wish that it was feasible. Sadly, many seem to enjoy hating the games more than they enjoy playing them. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 00:28, August 11, 2012 (UTC)
I don't think Final Fantasy is a series in which each game should be compared. It's hard to say that IV is crap compared to VII for example, because one is a steampunk sci-fi story and the other is a medieval fantasy with space travel. It's fine to dislike a certain game in a series, but not because it didn't meet the standards set by a different title. That's what I think, at least. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 23:41, August 11, 2012 (UTC)

Um...why was my comment deleted? There wasn't anything offensive in the comment unless someone decided me saying that Kuja was the only villain in the series that was not at any point defeated by the party was offending them somehow... Sutebenukun 10:55, August 9, 2012 (UTC)

It wasn't deleted; it was really, really long, so someone put it in the comments section. It's not far above this very message. Jimcloud 03:03, August 10, 2012 (UTC)
Yes, long comments may be moved to the comments section, as described in the rules. I've added a note to your vote saying that it is down here. :) http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 00:28, August 11, 2012 (UTC)

@Selkie: "He-Who-Doesn't-Deserve-To-Be-Named"? Okay, apparently you hate Kuja's pixelated guts and all, but isn't that a bit harsh even for a planet-destroyer? EdgarXTerra4ever 03:42, August 10, 2012 (UTC)

Well, apparently I have been ousted by someone in the committee, albeit for criticizing the committee's fight choice instead of use of obscene language. So I'm just going to answer your question. Yes, I do hate Kuja's pixelated guts (that's no secret). No, I don't think "He-Who-Doesn't-Deserve-To-Be-Named" is too harsh a moniker for a villain who destroys a planet. SelkieMaiden267 17:01, August 10, 2012 (UTC)
Joking around that Cloud and Light were either great or overrated isn't obscene. >_> C A T U S E 23:36, August 10, 2012 (UTC)
But you don't even have a legit reason for hating Kuja. I've read the posts above, you simply hate his Dissidia 'image', but you haven't actually played FFIX to know what he's really like, or why he is the way he is. I can understand if you dislike him slightly, but complaining on every single fight about how crap of a character he is, when you don't even have a valid scope of his character, is not cool. No, I'm not a Cloud/FFVII hater (just look at my name -.-). I'm just saying it's unfair to judge a character by how the compilations portray them. If you want to complain about how 'annoying' Kuja is in Dissidia, I can go on all day about how disgraceful the FFVII compilation portrayed Cloud (specifically in Advent Children). I mean, in the actual FFVII, I remembered he actually had feelings. Cloudn 23:50, August 10, 2012 (UTC)
You didn't take in anything that was said to you above, did you? I also note that you haven't ever actually said what it is that you don't like about Kuja in Dissidia (Not that that is sufficient to form a valid opinion of the character, as explained in detail above), other than the fact that you hate him so. Can you prove that this is anything but baseless blind hatred and rancour? http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 00:28, August 11, 2012 (UTC)
Maybe Selkie's a charter member of the "Heroes or Bust" voter camp. You know, the ones who always, always, ALWAYS votes for the heroes in any "hero vs. villain" matchup and cant't stand for a villain to be on top in Last Man Standing. Could be that the fact that it's Kuja is just an excuse for bashing. But what if it was Sephiroth or Seymour, or even Kefka, who was LMS defending champ?
And btw, KujaFFIX, are you sure that "jejune" is even a word? Because I tried it in a word game yesterday, and the game's engine didn't recognize it as a valid word... EdgarXTerra4ever 02:16, August 11, 2012 (UTC)
yeah it is C A T U S E 02:19, August 11, 2012 (UTC)
I strongly recommend playing the original, so you can have a more appropriate point of view of the character, and his story (the original one). "Ignorance itself is a crime" (Miluda to Ramza, Final Fantasy Tactics)JC Holy Knight 21:04, August 10, 2012 (UTC)

Heh, I don't even need to vote. It's pretty one-sided. Cloud's getting quite the beatdown here. --UntoldSarcasm (talk) 02:30, August 11, 2012 (UTC)

Week 207: Cloud Strife v. Lightning[edit source]

DNC Versus.png
29½ to 23
This week holds a very special contest between two of the fandom's most cherished*(hated) characters from the series two most beloved*(despised) games. Which strong-willed*(angst-ridden) former soldier*(SOLDIER?) will rise*(fall), claiming the title*(notoriety) of being the greatest*(most overrated) Final Fantasy character of all time?
29½ to 23

Votes for Cloud[edit source]

  1. I will follow in the spirit of the most glorious of fight description boxes: Cloud is awesome (terrible). Jimcloud 05:11, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Not even Lightning has been in as many games as Cloud... Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 05:14, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Cloud has always been my favorite.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 05:15, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  4. I'll make this short and sweet, if you vote against Cloud because he overrated well you don't have that right because Lightning is just as bad. Now if you vote for Light because you like her you have my respect so for those people have good day. ^_^  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 05:28, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  5. "I can rip through your darkness." (Dissidia; Cloud Strife to Cloud of Darkness) I could use just about any Cloud line, but this one seemed most appropriate. SelkieMaiden267 05:35, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  6. He was the original. Light was a cross between Cloud and Squall. And you know how I feel about FFVIII. C A T U S E 14:29, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Lightning's Itadaki artwork terrifies me. Her eyes, too far apart, bore holes into my brain, probing my innermost thoughts. The longer I stare at the artwork, the more I feel the need to pull my eyes away. But I cannot. Her fish-like, soulless eyes capture me, and my conviction and faith are shattered. The only thing left for me to do is cry. Oh, and I like Cloud as a character more. ScatheMote 14:57, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Cloud is a three dimensional character with a complete and important story arc tied into the game. Lightning is a side character with a few scenes tangential to the plot that make up her wonky character arc. --ClixPsi (talk) 15:46, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  9.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png16:23, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  10. What is this? Cloud vs Cloud? I don't get it. Not funny, guys. I'll vote for the one on the left then. --BlueHighwind 17:00, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  11. ==Trindadex== 17:09, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  12. This was really difficult. As much as I love Lightning (even if I only know her from DFF), I feel that this vote should go to Cloud. So sorry, Light. I still do love you. <///3 MissH <3 17:35, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Do I even need to explain?  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 19:39, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Can't have your cake and eat it too, SE. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 19:48, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  15. My God, we're actually doing this fight? I thought it was a taboo. Well, naturally, I vote for the awesome guy, not the "man-hating bitch*(according to Emperor Mateus)". - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 00:41, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Not Interested. Yiazmat slayerz (talk) 05:49, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Tetraninja321 11:51, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Even though I like Lightning, Cloud is a much better developed character and more interesting.---Purple_lightning14:03, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Cloud (from his original game) is much better a character than Lightning is (from her original game) The Rood Inverse (talk) 15:00, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Cloud is the best. Rodrigosanmartin (talk) 18:57, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  21. I like the original Cloud the best, although I think Lightning is/was meant to be "Cloud 2.0". After all, the template for Lightning was "female Cloud", and their names are even connected. Don't misunderstand, I like Lightning; but I'm voting for the original, not a copy with variations. --Time Master (talk) 19:10, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Lollipops and chainsaws. Unsane (talk) 20:30, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  23. I agree with most others, in that i dislike that despite "overcoming" his bleak facade and becoming his own person at the end of VII, hes still emo and depressing, but the original Cloud is still the g.o.a.t. :) --CarloGrimaldi (talk) 04:08, July 31, 2012 (UTC)
  24. I would have say this is a rough one. The only way I could about this objectively is to imagine them in combat. I think lightning is more polished as a fighter while cloud has blind luck. Other of other wise are on even ground. I would have to say some how in the end cloud win only because he brings the out the full potential of his weapon. While lightning has yet to fully bring out what a gunblade can truly achieve which is shown by squall. --Gainsboroughsephiroth (talk) 13:42, August 1, 2012 (UTC)
  25.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 22:46, August 1, 2012 (UTC)
  26. This one's the girl, right? --Leon95 17:15, August 3, 2012 (UTC)
  27. Cloud cannot be staggered and Lighting could never hold up to Cloud's Ultimaweapon or his limit breaks. Plus, Cloud can summon gods. --xbxgt_HATAZdropDEAD (talk) 9:38, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 11:06, July 30, 2012 (UTC) Cloud is overrated only because the FFVII compilation tweaked his personality to satisfy the fans. He never seemed like the 'emo-kid' type when I was playing the original FFVII
  2. 18:51, July 30, 2012 (UTC) -- 2:50, July 30,2012 (UTC) Cloud went crossdressing for Tifa. Beat that!
  3. You can't beat Cloud! 15:23, July 31, 2012 (UTC)
  4. 10:12, August 1, 2012 (UTC) Gotta love the hair ;)
  5. 22:38, August 2, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Lightning[edit source]

  1. Lightning taught me a lot during XIII.—Kaimi (999,999 CP/5 TP) 05:45, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Neither of them are the greatest character in FF history, but while I've never really liked Cloud, I do like Lightning. Also, I connect Blinded by Light to her, and that song is just pure <3. So, this vote shouldn't surprise anyone. MirrorshardSceada 09:39, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  3. She fought the gods and won. --Pzykosiz (talk) 12:13, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Though I do like Cloud, it's based on him in FF7, otherwise SE has wrapped him up far too much in his own traits and he's just Flanderized to be unrecognizable now. Lightning, though I haven't played FF13, I loved her in Dissidia, very badass and cool. Drake Clawfang (talk)
  5. Pretty much agree with Sceada and Drake. Crisis Core Cloud is my favourite incarnation of him, and VII is good, but the rest of the Compilation... eeeeh, no -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 16:12, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  6. ZazComet (talk) 16:50, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  7. SE is moving in the right direction with Lightning's character, and I liked her more reserved role in XIII-2. She has a deeper connection to other characters compared to Cloud, I think. Her musical theme perfectly reflects her character ^_^ 8bit 18:33, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  8. There is some serious anti-XIII propaganda going on here... This fight is mainly between a character that started off great and finished terribly, and a character that started off terribly and became great. I declare shenanigans on the Cloud voters. CylindrusAltum 21:41, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  9. I'm sorry - if there's one person I can't vote against, it's Light. Not that I don't like Cloud, it's like what people have already stated - he started off interesting and ended off generic. altariagirl280 6:00, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Yeah, seriously, Cloud has just been getting worse and worse as he's appeared in more spin offs. Lightning's set a low bar, but the modern Cloud sets it lower. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 06:08, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  11. KaiserPaladin 08:07, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  12. They're both cool but Lightning has a mean right hook :-)Squallisnotemo (talk) 11:32, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  13. My vote goes to Ms Badass Lightning. Fonzyboi (talk)
  14.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 21:36, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  15. I don't like lightning 100% because she is from FFXIII,but in general she is a fine character,otherwise cloud is just a normal character,he don't really deserve that greatness he have. ZeromusVX
  16. She's my favorite protagonist in the series. She's really the only one that I've just outright liked. Squall comes in a close second, but really, she's the only protagonist that I've connected to. MystRay 23:20, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  17. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 04:07, July 31, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Light's hot. Cloud was made into a pussy in all FFVII media after the original game. -wtdrm
  19. Whoo...okay, tough choice. Cloud is pretty cute, and his portrayal in Crisis Core was adorable, but his personality has been Flanderized beyond recognition after the original game so I go with Lightning, the Snark Knight extraordinaire with a badass weapon and can even defy gravity. --Marael (talk) 16:21, August 1, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Cloud was fine, but Lightning was awesome. Popkorn94 (talk)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Lightning is a character I could use in Dissidia while I always had problems with Cloud :\ Plus, I'm a Lightning fanboy <3. 11:35, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Army of One beats Omnislash. Legion of One beats Omnislash Version 5. 05:37, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Instead of moping, Lightning gets back up and fights. Took Cloud longer to do the same. (But don't get me wrong; I love both.) 12:12, July 30, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Lightning is both better in combat, and has the stronger personality -- 15:53, August 3, 2012 (UTC)
  5. 16:43, August 4, 2012 (UTC)
  6. 23:15, August 4, 2012 (UTC) Cloud is such a lousy, mopey, emo soldier!

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

I would please ask that hateful/flame/spam comments be kept to a minimum. This also includes who may or who may not be overrated. It's a DNC fight, guys.- +DeadlySlashSword+ 05:09, July 29, 2012 (UTC)

Wait, are we voting for the more overrated character, or is that just a joke...? Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 05:48, July 29, 2012 (UTC)

Good post Drake. The way Cloud was in FFVII has transformed into something odd, like a stereotype of himself, the nuances to his character lost along the way. I just wonder if Lightning is going along the same path. She currently is one of the bigger FF mascots, and the "badssness" is her signature trait. It started as her using it as a way to cope for hardships in her life, and I wonder if she will be robbed of the character development where she realises the extent this behaviour affects those around her or if it will just forever be "Lightning is badass and that's awesome". I suppose since that has become her image it would be hard to develop her to another direction and have her grow into a more mature way of dealing with hardship, lest fans will reject the change.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 13:12, July 29, 2012 (UTC)

Unfortunately that does seem to be the case, SE overexposed her way too much. Even casually looking at Lightning it's easy to see she was designed with intent to be popular and marketable - she's physically powerful, looks badass and beautiful, wields a morphing gunblade, commands an iconic Eidolon, and fits a very well-known stereotype of a strong, jaded woman who deep down is really tender and loving. I'm actually hoping that, as the fight description implies, there has been fan backlash to her, because SE has really overexposed her in a short amount of time and backlash would help prevent Lightning from sharing Cloud's fate. And yes, I realize the hypocrisy in noting she's a marketable stereotype and yet I like her. :p Doreiku Kuroofangu 13:35, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
I think it's not a flaw in itself to be marketable or even a stereotype...you can work with that. But there's a danger of being drowned out by all the "frillies", especially for someone whose natural character is subtle. There is a point in FFXIII where Lightning realises that when she hardened herself to the world she lost the connection she once had with her sister, culminating to a point she no longer understands her. Serah forgives Lightning of course and this doesn't do long-lasting damage. Everyone in FFXIII in general seems to forgive Lightning, because it is "understandable" what she does (but leads me to wonder does she learn anything from it). In FFXIII-2 she is again given a role where she must be strong and badass and her relationship with other characters is cordial but distant. If she again has the exact same role in the eventual FFXIII-3 I think it would be stagnation, although maybe she won't have a large role.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 14:03, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
EDIT CONFLICT:It seems pretty clear to me that they're trying to do to Lightning what they did to Cloud -- spawn a morass of moneymaking around them. It seemed to me like XIII was trying to attract a new, younger generation -- I can't help but note the large quantities of teenage girls that flock to Lightning, consciously or subconsciously, as an example of a real "strong woman" (erk) who doesn't take anything from anybody. And it's pretty clear they're trying to market her just like they did Cloud, by sticking him on everything they could think of -- there's the Compilation of Final Fantasy XIII, the way she was marketed as the central new figure of D012, the Parasite Eve thing, that PlayStation commercial, etc. etc. I like Lightning, but it bugs me that it seems like she was designed specifically for this, as opposed to being... you know, a character. :\ Jimcloud 14:08, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
Hey, it's a company, their #1 is moneymakin'. Even when the moneymakin' hurts the game itself, because their target audience, people who are new to FF, won't care. Didn't whatshisface say that FFXV will probably be an ARPG, since people other than old-timers just aren't buying JRPGs these days? C A T U S E 14:44, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
I think it is possible to create a character who is both "a cultural icon and a marketing vessel" and genuinely a well-written character (like...Harry Potter?). Putting out crap intentionally will eventually result in lost sales; works poorly for long term established franchises like FF.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 15:10, July 29, 2012 (UTC)
It's possible, but is it easy? not so... C A T U S E 16:04, July 29, 2012 (UTC)

I think I'll recuse myself from this match. I can feel the eyes of all haters of whomever I would have voted for on me. Besides, gives me a week to think of something snappy to say in my vote next week. King of Noobs 00:58, July 30, 2012 (UTC)

I think you just gave me my snappy line for next week, hehehe... King of Noobs 01:50, July 30, 2012 (UTC)

I can't do this. I just can't... I'm sorry. I like them both too much...

@BlueHighwind: No, I think "Cloud v. Cloud" would be more like Cloud (Strife) vs. Cloud (of Darkness). "You dare face me with a clouded heart?"--SelkieMaiden267 19:04, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

He meant Cloud Strife v. Cloud Strife. -_- And Cloud Strife v. Cloud of Darkness would be lame because it would be a landslide. C A T U S E 19:22, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

Week 206: Last Man Standing Round 15: Kuja v. Fang[edit source]

LMS Icon.png
VICTOR - 30 to 17
DEFEAT - 30 to 17
Kuja, having soundly defeated the seemingly infallible Zack, now faces his first challenger. Will Fang be able to turn the tables on Kuja, or will he stay the champion? Who will be the last man standing?

Votes for Kuja[edit source]

  1. He's a hero-hating black mage, just like me! C A T U S E 01:24, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  2. I wanted to say somthing else, but all I could come up with was WELL NOW 8bit 01:25, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  3. For me, this is no contest. Also, Kuja winning would further irritate certain jejune haters, which is always good. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 01:27, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Over-engineered codpiece. King of Noobs 01:31, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Fang destroyed half a planetoid. Kuja destroyed a full one (and after that existence itself I guess? It wasn't really his fault stuff got kinda weird after that happened.)  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 01:37, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Absolutely the better character. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 02:34, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  7. I like Kuja; I have complete apathy towards Fang. ScatheMote 02:35, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  8. --Pzykosiz (talk) 04:04, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Tetraninja321 04:31, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Free bird (talk) 05:06, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  11. --ClixPsi (talk) 05:23, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  12.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 05:32, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  13. This shouldn't even be a contest. Fang has nothing on Kuja, and I think a lot of people are voting for her because they hate Kuja (God knows why) Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 06:22, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Kuja is maniacal! More than I can say for Fang, anyways. And it's an enjoyable kind of maniacal. Luacas (talk) 09:35, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  15. LC 10:21, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Balthierfan (talk) 11:34, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  17. This isn't really a choice for me. I mean, seriously, who is Oerba Yun Fang? Dogurasu (talk) 12:15, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Why should the world exist without me...? Unsane (talk) 20:45, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Kuja earned my respect. One of the more human (despite not being human) villians out there - he's only afraid of death. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 22:57, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  20. He's just a ridiculously awesome villain and character, what more is there to say? --NeoExdeath (talk) 23:11, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  21. Easy enough decision for me. MystRay 01:03, July 24, 2012 (UTC)
  22. He is prettier. >_> Rosenarm 20:38, July 24, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Best villain versus overrated character? I'll go with Kujie-coo. -wtdrm
  24. I wanted to vote for Fang, as she needs the vote more, but... I have come to realise that I like Kuja more nontheless. And if the genome managed to take down Zack, then why not pay him respect for the feat? MirrorshardSceada 21:44, July 25, 2012 (UTC)
  25. Best villain, hands down. Vercery 22:42, July 25, 2012 (UTC)
  26.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 01:08, July 26, 2012 (UTC)
  27. There is only one Final Fantasy character that will unite all the internet fem haters onto one website.....only one who can bend them against his will......and he does not share POWER!!!! Adelbert
  28. Well...he destroyed a planet.I bet Fang can't do that.ZeromusVX

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 07:39, July 25, 2012 (UTC)Kuja is one of my MOST favorite villains of all time! I've never played FF13 so I'm definitely voting for him!
  2. 08:44, July 26, 2012 (UTC) Poetry!!!!!!

Votes for Fang[edit source]

  1. I'd do it. --BlueHighwind 01:24, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Sorry, Kuja, in this fight between girly man and manly girl, the manly girl wins. Just how it is. Jimcloud 01:25, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  3.  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 01:30, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Kick his ass, Fang! SelkieMaiden267 01:32, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  5. ==Trindadex== 01:39, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  6.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 01:52, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  7. God, I hate Kuja! And Fang is my favourite female in the whole series! Why is Kuja given so much attention when he's no hotter than dross? Back to the slag heap with him! CylindrusAltum 13:50, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Shockstorm (talk) 03:54, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Don't know both since haven't played both games of origin, but Fang got my respect. MissHimitsu (talk) 03:57, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  10.  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png10:17, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Tear the sky in his eyes and himself as well, Fang!—Kaimi (999,999 CP/5 TP) 14:47, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  12. The one thing that shines in an otherwise giant pile of crap. --Leon95 16:51, July 24, 2012 (UTC)
  13. ZazComet (talk) 00:46, July 25, 2012 (UTC)
  14. As much as I dislike FF13, I dislike Kuja even more. Fang was a great character in a terrible game, Kuja was a terrible character in a great game. nuff' said. --Time Master (talk) 17:41, July 25, 2012 (UTC)
  15. LegendCrystarium Crystal Lightning.pngAqua 02:33, July 29, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. You gotta be kidding me. 03:52, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  2. I will not vote a man who dress like a lady. 11:47, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  3. 20:18, July 23, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Y u no recognize Fang's awesomeness?! NOOOOO!!! 03:09, July 24, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

@ L'cieBeast: Don't want to overstep my boundaries, but could you not use words like "gay fag" to describe a character? It's not as though Kuja is real, but the description is still kind of offensive. If you're going to vote against him because of how he looks, there's no need to use that kind of language. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 04:15, July 24, 2012 (UTC)

I've removed the comment in question. We don't condone hatred in the DNC or on the wiki. The person is welcome to repost his vote if he is able to do so cordially. ScatheMote 04:28, July 24, 2012 (UTC)
Since you went and removed it, I gave them a yellow card, soooo...no they can't revote this week, or vote next week. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 06:14, July 24, 2012 (UTC)
I'd forgotten that those existed. Better idea then what I had. ScatheMote 06:27, July 24, 2012 (UTC)
What is it about Kuja? Two weeks ago we had a nut (as you know, seeing as you reported him) who said that voting for Kuja was "ultra gay", then a discussion in the Peanut Gallery about how people who vote for Kuja are "hero-hating black mages". Last week a few people voted for Fang because it would be easier for her to beat Kuja than Vanille would. Now this? Maybe it's because I live in California (this stereotype is one of the few that's even half-true) but I've learned not to judge people by their clothing. C A T U S E 04:53, July 24, 2012 (UTC)
My theory is that the offenders are probably young teenage boys who haven't played IX and are intolerant of characters (or even real people) like Kuja based purely on appearance. Yes, Kuja has a thong - get over it. Ignorance, basically. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 05:15, July 24, 2012 (UTC)
My Spidey-sense is tingling. Did I here "Ignorant young teenage boys"? Uh oh, the pedo bear has escaped. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 05:18, July 24, 2012 (UTC)
I agree with the theory presented by Mateus; in addition, a certain amount of homophobia, ignorant as it is, would also seem to be present. That in particular isn't even close to correct - considering that one of Kuja's defining characteristics is that he was never able to develop emotionally due to being created as an adult, he is verisimilarly asexual. Furthermore, the only character who he ever even mentions as attractive is Garnet.
I also suspect that certain voters dislike being made to feel so insecure about their own sexuality. ;) http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 19:27, July 25, 2012 (UTC)

>People implying that only homophobes are annoyed by crossdressing or highly effeminate behavior. Also, gay =/= effeminate. Always fun to watch people analyze and condemn others' prejudices to make up for their own. Signed, an "ignorant" redneck gay guy --Shockstorm (talk) 19:47, July 25, 2012 (UTC)

Who was implying that? "I've learned not to judge people by their clothing" was my response to Fang votes 1, 7, Anon1, Anon2, and possibly 4, the rest of it was blowing hot air at l'Cie and the vandal. Mateus was also responding to Fang votes 1, 7, Anon1, Anon2, and possibly 4. Ark was just snarking (as he always does) at l'Cie and the vandal + anyone who felt that way about Kuja but wasn't open about it (the "jejune haters" in Kuja vote 3). C A T U S E 20:20, July 25, 2012 (UTC)
Quite. I didn't imply that 'only homophobes are annoyed by crossdressing or highly effeminate behavior'. I did imply that some people do seem to view homosexuality and effeminacy/androgyny/epicenism as one and the same; as correctly pointed out, they are not the same thing. http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 20:27, July 25, 2012 (UTC)
One's androgynous, one's implied to be gay. It's interesting how the one with the flamboyant appearance is getting all the ire.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 21:57, July 25, 2012 (UTC)
I'm going to have to politely ask everyone to drop the subject, mmkay? - +DeadlySlashSword+ 22:02, July 25, 2012 (UTC)

I don't know if I should point it out here or send a PM to someone in the committee, but I did notice that a user who calls himself NeoExdeath has voted twice in the "Votes for Kuja" section (votes 20 and 27). Not to appear biased due to the fact that I cast my own vote for Fang this time, but I'm pretty sure that voting twice in the same fight is against the rules no matter who the combatants are. SelkieMaiden267 20:56, July 28, 2012 (UTC)

Oh, I hadn't noticed. It could have been that they voted once and then forgot about it and voted again without thinking, there were a good three days in between the votes. I don't know, so I'm not going to persecute them personally. If Scathe or DSS feel differently then they may feel free to put a warning or a yellow card on the person's page. If they do it again, though, definite yellow card. Jimcloud 21:05, July 28, 2012 (UTC)

Week 205: Fang v. Vanille[edit source]

FFXIII - Sprite-Fang.png
DNC Versus.png
FFXIII - Sprite-Vanille.png
23½ to 14½
Ever since these two have become l'Cie, they've only had each other to rely on, and they're as close as friends could be. However, these friends will become bitter rivals as this fateful battle begins in the DNC. When the chaos subsides, which of these ladies will emerge victorious?
23½ to 14½

Votes for Fang[edit source]

  1. For me, personally, Vanille was one of the most annoying characters of the "perky girl" archetype, just edging out Eiko for second place. (Rinoa, obviously, takes first.) Fang, on the other hand, was awesome, powerful, one of the most effective characters in the entire party, and was definitely not afraid to admit it. Any group without Fang is a poorly made one in XIII, let's be real here. Jimcloud 13:16, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  2. There's just something about Fang's attitude that appeals to me. King of Noobs 14:20, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I love how Yahtzee hated FFXIII so much he didn't even play it long enough to know about Fang. He did appropriately label Vanille as 'Kooky Spice' though. I also heavily agree with Jimcloud. Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 14:26, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Vanille is alright, though I find it hard to tolerate using her in battle (she's like a female tennis player, only worse). Whereas Fang is just plain awesome in just about every way, character and fighter both -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 14:37, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Fang <3Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 14:54, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I'm not anti-Vanille, but yeah, Fang is just a better character.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 16:05, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  7. From what I know about Fang, she's a real badass. And it's going to take some badassery to stand up to You-Know-Who. SelkieMaiden267 16:24, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Hmm... not as many creepy fanboys & fangirls. Also, is a dragoon. And not a perky girl. C A T U S E 18:16, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Tetraninja321 18:57, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Yum yum - Henryacores^ 19:14, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  11. As delicious as Vanilla is, I prefer it when its having sex with Fang. --BlueHighwind 19:30, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Tough one. Both are my favourite characters in XIII, but I do love Fang an ickle bit more. Miyuron (talk) 19:51, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Fang's beauty is unmatched. She's much prettier than Kuja I'm afraid, so if anyone can beat him.... CylindrusAltum 07:45, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Fang is part of the most flexible pre-9-level-crystarium team of Fang-Lightning-Hope. Also wields Kain's Lance and one of he few (if not the only) possibly-canon lesbian. Win. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 00:01, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Didn't take people's BS and was the strongest in the party. Also, her Eidolon didn't involve tentacle play or moaning. --Shockstorm (talk) 01:45, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Apart from the fact that she makes a kick ass team with Lightning and Hope, all I have to say is: "Goodnight, Sunshine!" Need I say more? Altariagirl280#Altariagirl280 (talk) 02:09, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
  17.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 03:57, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Oerba Yun Fang. Why? One word: Dragoon. Let's do the math: Dragoon translates into either badass!, or, sexy!. Case, closed. Unsane (talk) 15:18, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Fang was in my main party (when I could choose), and her Dragoon skills and Highwind attack were quite useful. she also had an attitude that I liked. Thus, she is a good character in AND out of battle. On the other hand, Vanille's fake "cheery" persona made me dislike her before I even knew it was an act. Also, Bahamut > Hecatoncheir. --Time Master (talk) 23:13, July 17, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Vanille is an annoying girl... and Fang is more useful in battle I think --Trindadex 14:45, July 19, 2012 (UTC)
  21. Eh. ScatheMote 14:53, July 19, 2012 (UTC)
  22. I prefer my lesbians to have bearable voices. --Leon95 16:43, July 21, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. (Agrees with vote number 7 on the non-Anonymous panel.) Because. Just because... 16:27, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Fang is best as a commando. Vanille is best as a saboteour. I'll take the higher damage output. 17:30, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Fang is the only FFXIII female character I don't hate. She's awesome. 11:04, July 19, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Vanille[edit source]

  1. Vanille, will you marry me?—Kaimi >♂ FFXIII - Sprite-AtkVanille.png - FFXIII - Sprite-ShockVanille.png - Discussion - FFXIII - Sprite-CrysVanille.png 12:42, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Vanille is awesome! (I'm sorry, Fang!)  Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png12:48, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  3. --ClixPsi (talk) 15:59, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Fang does nothing for me at all. I love Vanille. -wtdrm
  5. Vanille you are perfect!!User:Soraroxas95 1:50, july 15,2012
  6.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 21:42, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  7. --Popkorn94 (talk) 23:45, July 15, 2012
  8. I prefer Vanille as a character over Fang.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 22:40, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  9. I think some of the Fang voters didn't pay enough attention to the game to realise Vanille's perky girl attitude was all just an act... Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 23:44, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Vanille needs this vote more for two reasons: 1) I find I have more in common with her than I do with Fang (though I'm a Fang-fan as well). 2) Hecatoncheir!!!  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 02:18, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Vanille just has such an upbeat attitude to life that it's addictive --Pzykosiz (talk) 01:21, July 17, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Vanille is my muse. <3 Mierna 01:53, July 18, 2012 (UTC)
  13. MMLN メーマウリアン 09:59, July 19, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Aaaaa.jpgTheNemesisx 03:43, July 20, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 14:34, July 20, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

I did it! I managed to update the fight on time, and I even managed to do it without including the words "lesbian subtext"! Wait... DANGIT! Jimcloud 12:39, July 15, 2012 (UTC)

Looks like the wrong labels were put on the last match, though. It has Zack winning 19-35, which doesn't look right or make mathematical sense. King of Noobs 14:21, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
What? Noooo, don't be silly, if you'll just refresh the page I think you'll find that it was Kuja who won the whole time and it certainly did not read Zack as winning beforehand. No sirree, not at all. Jimcloud 14:34, July 15, 2012 (UTC)

Abstain. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 15:59, July 15, 2012 (UTC)

@Mateus: I know that Vanille's perky girl act is just an act. So was Eiko's. I don't see your point, it doesn't make me like her any more. Jimcloud 01:40, July 16, 2012 (UTC)

Maybe people here just don't like perky girls for some reason, even if the perkiness is just a persona. Popular vote does tend to favor badasses (with a few notable exceptions). Just an observation. SelkieMaiden267 01:52, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
What the Japanese think is cute ("doll-like" girls and all that) many Westerners just find creepy. I think Vanille is creepy as hell. But Eiko's great, and Rinoa too. ;) The common trope is to cast the spoiled rich girl as the villain, I like that it goes against the grain a bit in FFVIII.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 02:05, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
Maybe that explains why Terra Branford kicked ass in FFVI once she became a Returner, but Square Enix turned her into a damsel-in-distress in Dissidia and kept her that way...that was one of a few parts that I didn't like about that game... SelkieMaiden267 02:20, July 16, 2012 (UTC)

@Jimcloud: Ah, alrighty then. It's just that I see a lot of people give her flak for being upbeat and happy without even knowing she's pretending. That sort of hate should be targeted towards characters who actually deserve it... like Selphie, or Penelo. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 03:11, July 16, 2012 (UTC)

Ugh, Selphie. Nobody else can suggest that we blow up a train with a giant missile launcher in the center of a very busy town while jumping up and down and acting like she had way too much coffee or something. :/ But at least she had something to do with the plot, unlike Penelo.C A T U S E 03:15, July 16, 2012 (UTC)
I think it's implied Selphie's super happy act is also a kind of coping mechanism, not so unlike with Vanille. Penelo I didn't find very happy or upbeat, she's mainly just worrying over Vaan the whole story. Not that she's super relevant but I like the bits where she bonds with Larsa.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 03:20, July 16, 2012 (UTC)

I don't find Rinoa annoying, nor Rikku, or Penelo. Eiko is tolerable, and Selphie is pushing the limit... but how do any of the aforementioned characters compare to the annoying that is Vanille? Vanille not only has the most annoying voice (paired with the most annoying accent) but everything she says is irritating. Not to mention that she suffers from the same thing that every other character of the story suffers from, which is whining non-stop.

Maybe it's just because there's a lack of VAs, but is Rinoa really a "perky-girl (what does that even mean?)"? Also I don't see how Penelo is either. As far as I recall she barely says everything and only really communicates with Vaan, and not in an annoying way. 15:04, July 19, 2012 (UTC)

I think you could say Rinoa is a perky girl, but she undergoes some development during the story; after waking up from her coma she acts more serious (has to grow up and face the reality kinda thing). But like her behaviour when you first meet her at the party and she is being flirty I think fits with "perky girl" stereotype.
Vanille's voice is just pretty fail, because they have a grown woman do a high-pitched voice that doesn't sound at all real. Like I think Penelo has a pretty good voice, but I understand she is also squeaky in the Japanese version.Keltainentoukokuu (talk) 15:40, July 19, 2012 (UTC)

To be honest, I do not think Rinoa is a "Perky Girl." There are some characters in the series I cant stand, like Yuffie or Rikku. However, I think both characters in this battle are pretty good, I use Fang in my primary party because she has the highest strength stat, obviously. Vanille, however is useful for death and easy to make a quick win on a battle. I honestly can not decide on who for this battle. Munk451 (talk) 12:14, July 21, 2012 (UTC)

Week 204: Last Man Standing Round 14: Zack Fair v. Kuja[edit source]

Zack fair.jpg
LMS Icon.png
Kuja CG.png
DEFEAT - 19 to 35
VICTORY - 19 to 35
Zack shares a few similarities with his fourth Last Man Standing challenger; both had close ties to the protagonist of their respective central stories, and both in the end do their best to go out on a high note. Who will emerge victorious, the sword-swinger or the spell-slinger? Who will be the last man standing?

Votes for Zack[edit source]

  1. Kuja is a douchebag. I hate douchebags. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 04:35, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  2. "Boy oh boy. The price of freedom is steep."  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 04:42, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Don't want to see Zack lose, having come this far. Besides which, well, the quote that sums up my opinion is the most ironic line to use here, but: "I can't STAND the untalented." (Dissidia; Kuja to Kefka) SelkieMaiden267 04:48, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  4.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 05:37, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  5.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 07:12, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  6. AtmaCrisis 08:27, July 8, 2012 (UTC) :)
  7. Kuja triumphed over Golbez? Magic Mike is going down. CylindrusAltum 19:05, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  8. MatHighwind 11:32, July 8, 2012 (UTC) I love Kuja, he's my favourite villain. But after playing Crisis Core and being through the whole Zack's hardship, my vote goes to him. Sorry, thong man.
  9. Well, Kuja is great and all, but on the other hand, Zack is just Zack :\ I've got to give him this one, though I wouldn't mind so much if Kuja won this one. Jimcloud 14:46, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  10.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 15:00, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  11. So far, I almost had to feel guilty for aiding in landslides when voting for Zack. I'm glad to see that's not the case in this fight. MirrorshardSceada 22:10, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  12. I've never liked Kuja, and I feel like he's been declining since Dissidia. FFIX was a good game, but Kuja is most definitely not a good villain (or character). Plus, I'd really hate to see Zack lose at this point, (and to a character I dislike as much as Kuja) Epic SOLDIER > Annoying Shakespearean Genome, with a superiority complex. --Time Master 04:17, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
  13. KaiserPaladin 06:07, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Zack shall never be forgotten. MissHimitsu (talk) 03:28, July 10, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Shockstorm (talk) 17:49, July 11, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Cyruny 18:03, July 12, 2012 (CET)
  17. ZazComet (talk) 04:41, July 13, 2012 (UTC)
  18. This is a surprise. I figured Zack be coming out on top, but Kuja is a worthy canidate to top Zack. Yes Zack has Fanboys, but let's not be hypocritical here, Kuja has some too. Zack may have more, but Kuja has some pretty extreme fanboys. Razordash03:26, July 15, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Zack will not lose to a guy in a thong! Yunie X Dissicon ff10 Yun1.png12:18, July 15, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Ugh, I hate Kuja! 10:04, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Go Zack! 12:31, July 15, 2012 (UCT)

Votes for Kuja[edit source]

  1. GERONIMO--er, I mean, ULTIMA!C A T U S E 04:34, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  2. The power of the man-thong compels you, the power of the man-thong compels you! Drake Clawfang (talk) 04:36, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  3. The man-thong power compelled me. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 05:28, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  4. The fact that he can blow up a planet just goes to show that he could obliterate an army of Shinra Soldiers.Aaaaa.jpgTheNemesisx 07:41, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Zack only exists because of screaming fanboys. Kuja may be bat-s*** crazy, but at least he had reasons behind what he did. Not a lot of reasons, but they were there. Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 10:08, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I want to vote for Zack, I really do. He's up there with Sazh and Vivi as the characters I can't vote against. But Kuja is amazing as well, and I think he's going to need this vote more. Especially as I can see some default hate for him on the other side already -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 11:45, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Hexed 11:46, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  8. With Golbez gone... I won't let it happen. I won't... I won't let this contest exist without Kuja!! Dogurasu 12:34, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  9. ... http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 13:08, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  10. All hail the man-thong! King of Noobs 19:13, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  11. --ClixPsi 20:45, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  12. MMLN メーマウリアン 22:00, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  13.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 22:14, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  14. I'd still do it. --BlueHighwind 22:33, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  15. WELL NOW 8bit 04:30, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Planet's blown up by Zack - 0 --Pzykosiz 04:32, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
  17. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 05:28, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
  18. I really don't care either way, but I feel like spiting the vandal that hit yesterday. -- Some Color Mage ~ (Talk) 06:30, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Zack Fair! Your reign of terror ends here!Tetraninja321 20:58, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Balthierfan (talk) 14:10, July 10, 2012 (UTC)
  21. MystRay 15:26, July 10, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Kuja is a phenomenal antagonist! He brings a poetic and elegant nature to the main villain role more than anybody else plus with his extraordinary Trance powers as displayed in the single greatest FF FMV scene on the Playstation, he's the one that'll put an end to Zack's undefeated streak! Free bird (talk) 02:50, July 11, 2012 (UTC)
  23. LC 10:01, July 11, 2012 (UTC)
  24. Finally someone who's a real threat for Zack. Miyuron (talk) 10:41, July 11, 2012 (UTC)
  25. MrSpiffy 18:41, July 11, 2012 (UTC)
  26. Destroyed a planet. Then almost another. Top that. Vercery 19:07, July 11, 2012 (UTC)
  27. I want to see Kuja win this one. I'd like to, if nothing else, see someone outside of FFVII do well. But I'm a huge fan of Kuja as it is. One of my favorite FF villains ever, and even one of my favorite characters as a whole.#Mirron91 (talk) 20:56, July 12, 2012 (UTC)
  28. His trance finally conveinced me. Rezana7 1:12, July 14, 2012
  29. Zack is a secondary protagonist for a prequel where the story is mashed to make him badass when in reality he got shot and died. Kuja survived mega flare...then destroyed a world...then life itself. --NeoExdeath (talk) 02:45, July 14, 2012 (UTC)
  30. See Vote #15. By the way, haven't been here in quite a while. Pikmin Master (talk) 20:15, July 14, 2012 (UTC)
  31. If Zack could die by being gunned down by 3 ShinRa soldiers, Kuja could vaporize Zack with a single Flare Star. Why are we even having this arguement? *Not surprised at the landslide* Adelbert July 14, 2012

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Kuja all the way! 14:33, July 8, 2012 (UTC) 14:32, July 8, 2012(UTC)
  2. This was hard. So hard, I had to play Force Your Way to make some brain juice flow. But still, Kuja. Why? Dark Messenger. That's why. 22:44, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Without a doubt I'm standing behind Kuja on this one. Girly appearance aside, he's an awesome antaganist that it not simply one-dimensional. You can see him as a legitimate threat, and he completely wipes out one world while causing the deaths, both directly and indirectly, of thousands of people in another world. Zach, is just there. Nothing really speacial about him. So Kuja all the way. 21:27, July 10, 2012 (UTC)
  4. His excellence frightens even Zack Fair!
  5. Kuja should be the victor here, simple as that for me. # 22:15, July 11, 2012 (UTC)
  6. 19:43, July 11, 2012 (UTC)
  7. 10:37, July 13, 2012 (UTC)
  8. This one's hard since I'm quite fond of both characters, but I have to say Kuja wins by a small amount. 21:42, July 14, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Let's put it this way - in the original Final Fantasy VII (before Crisis Core revamped it), Zack was killed by three Shin-Ra soldiers. Kuja, on the other hand, got hit directly by Megaflare from Bahamut (the very same who destroyed Alexandria and Brahne's fleet), and merely laughed... Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 05:13, July 9, 2012 (UTC)

Maybe Zack won't be retiring after a fifth glorious win after all. Or maybe he would be winning if some hero-hating black mages hadn't cast their votes for Kuja? I don't know. Guess I must have overestimated the number of VII fanboys/girls in the DNC. SelkieMaiden267 (talk) 14:16, July 9, 2012 (UTC)

Or maybe, just maybe, Zack and Cloud aren't as great as they're made out to be. >;3 Cat (meowhunt) 19:26, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
That's not it. Granted, Cloud is much better in VII while Zack is much better in the Compilation (well... just Crisis Core). JBed (talk) 19:32, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
Whatever. >:( I just hope that if the thonged freak does win this one, some challenger manages to dethrone him soon enough. SelkieMaiden267 (talk) 20:46, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
Now, now, guys, no hard feelings, mkay? In the grand scheme of things, this fight bears especially little importance, yeah? No need to make such a fuss :) Jimcloud 21:11, July 9, 2012 (UTC)
Sorry, but Kuja is one of those characters I absolutely MUST vote against. We all have them, and "series" fights like Last Man Standing, Magicite Madness, etc. tend to bring out more must-vote-for and must-vote-against voters, no matter who just so happens to be fighting. SelkieMaiden267 05:11, July 10, 2012 (UTC)
Nope, just seems to be you. I would please ask you from now on to not take any of these fights, LMS or regular, so seriously, hm? - +DeadlySlashSword+ 05:55, July 10, 2012 (UTC)
If it helps, sometimes when I'm indifferent to challengers I'll vote for who's more/less likely to beat the champion. I'm evil like that. C A T U S E 06:02, July 10, 2012 (UTC)
I is not hero hating black mage ;_; 8bit 17:27, July 10, 2012 (UTC)
But you are a black mage, no? And 8bit, you need to update your sig code.C A T U S E 20:32, July 10, 2012 (UTC)
One cannot accurately judge a character by their portrayal in Dissidia, as a few voters seem to be doing (as usual). As for some of the votes... of course, I accept that some people may dislike a character and I respect their right to their own opinion, but this blind rancour is most displeasing.
Time Master: Have you ever played FFIX? Quite a few of Kuja's actions are defined by his inferiority complex, particularly in relation to his brother.
SelkieMaiden267: That sort of puerile name-calling is really quite fantastically jejune; getting this worked up over a fan contest between fictional characters is rather pathetic. If you must continue to blindly hate characters like this, you might try keeping it to yourself. :) http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/KujaFFIX/2ea674f6.pngKujaBox.PNG 19:09, July 13, 2012 (UTC)
This is a really intense match... not every day a vandal shows up, claims that voting for Kuja is "ultra gay", and then blanks Kuja's vote section and sticks a deletion template on it. It's not that surprising, really, since there are so many Zack fanboys and so many Kuja fanboys.
Also, I <3 hero-hating black mages. C A T U S E 20:31, July 13, 2012 (UTC)
If voting for Kuja is "ultra gay," then I for one am all for it. If it is not, well, I'll vote Kuja anyway. In any case, the vandal (whomever he, she, or it may be) may have some personal issues to contend with, and may see this place as similar to his, her, or its conflicting emotions. On the one side, we have the typical male hero - physically strong, capable of just about anything (with Materia) but preferring to use absolute strength, and quite visibly straight (Aerith the love interest). On the other, we have the male villain - powerful mage, complex emotion and cunning, sexuality in definite question. (For those of us that care, anyway.) What might the vandal think if the hero loses? But, meh, take all this not with a grain of salt but with a whole salt lick; I'm here for the contest. Popcorn, anybody? Dogurasu (talk) 12:46, July 14, 2012 (UTC)
OK, who keeps doing this? Some vandal struck Kuja's votes again, and added two fake IPs that were voting for Zack. Yipes. C A T U S E 17:33, July 14, 2012 (UTC)

Week 203: Golbez v. Kuja[edit source]

DNC Versus.png
Kuja Render.png
22½ to 26
These two antagonists have relationships of a more... personal nature with their respective main protagonists. No, not like that! Though these two worked together on the side of Chaos in Dissidia, they'll be facing off this week in a battle of epic proportions! I expect CPU lasers, Flares, and Holies will be flying around like nobody's business within the hour. Watch your head.
22½ to 26

Votes for Golbez[edit source]

  1. "You are too weak to control anything." (Dissidia, Emperor to Kuja) Not so much a pro-Golbez as an anti-Kuja. SelkieMaiden267 03:50, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  2. オメガ Mk.XII Dissicon ff12 Vaan1.png 03:58, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  3. From D012 to TAY to remakes of FF4, every time Golbez appears he becomes a more complex and interesting character, not to mention more badass. Drake Clawfang (talk)
  4. Golbez's appearance in both Dissidias is marvelous, while I think Kuja falls a bit flat in the first game. I think the scene on the Moon where Golbez walks away from Cecil, especially with his amazing voice actor, was superb and was a great improvement upon their relationship in IV. "You are far too kind to be a knight." 8bit 04:49, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  5. This was indeed a tough one...  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 05:59, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  6.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 06:04, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  7. LegendCrystarium Crystal Lightning.pngAqua 06:28, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Gotta respect the Darth Vader armour.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 11:34, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  9. I like how he can become a nice guy as well as a (insert insult here). Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 12:38, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Tough choice, indeed, but at this particular moment in time for me, "Double Trouble-chan" just barely outpaces the Codpiece Mage. Dogurasu 12:59, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  11. How is Kuja the best villain in the series? (I just want to know) SidVI Dissicon ff7 Tifa2.png 14:32, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Golbez did not come to treat with a worm like Kuja. Now bring him the crystal!.Aaaaa.jpgTheNemesisx 14:38, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Golbez was a great character in ff4, and became even better in TAY and both Dissdias. Not only that, but I've never liked Kuja and found him to be weak villain (as a character), with an inflated ego, who blew up a planet for attention. He was even worse in Dissidia. If Golbez killed Kuja, he would be doing everyone (except the Kuja fanboys/fangirls) a favor. --Time Master 00:00, July 3, 2012 (UTC)
  14. Lots of reasons, but the one I'm gonna give is Ted Woolsey. "Justice is not the only right in this world. Some day, you'll see..." User:GenBolt 05:22, July 3, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Kuja and Golbez are equals to me, except for the fact that Kuja does have a record of being the only villain to actually 'destroy' an entire planet. Killing the party is still up for debate however, since Necron isn't the Lifa tree that everyone once thought it was, absorbing the party's souls. Just putin out my thoughts. Razordash06:46, July 3, 2012 (UTC)
  16. Golbez sits at the apex of awesomeness. Kuja reminds me of Courtney Love. I thought the answer was obvious..... CylindrusAltum 10:02, July 3, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Zabat321 11:21, July 5, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Golbez can go to the moon! Can Kuja go to the moon?C A T U S E 04:01, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
  19. "Guide my inner shadow, light and dark above. Transcend the stars!" Fëasindë Peth 18:02, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Shockstorm 20:04, July 7, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Even during DFF, you can tell... 16:34, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  2. 19:28, July 4, 2012 (UTC)
  3. I like both...but Golbez..I just love his character~ --
  4. Golbez all the way... 16:05, July 6, 2012 (UTC)
  5. 10:55, July 5, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Kuja[edit source]

  1. I'd do it. Would you? --BlueHighwind 03:35, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  2. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 03:41, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  3. The codpiece compels me... King of Noobs 03:43, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Tough choice, really is. But any man who can pull off a codpiece that well gets my vote. MateusNamelink.png Dissicon ff2 Emp1.png 04:08, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  5. I think Kuja is the best villain in the series. But I wouldn't do it... sorry Kuja. You're just a bit...you know, messed up and evil. But here's a vote for being a good villain.Keltainentoukokuu 04:14, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  6. --ClixPsi 04:25, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Hmm... The virginity is strong in this one. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 05:25, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Hard indeed but, but I'm going with Kuja because Dark Messenger.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 06:21, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Kuja is the best villain in the series. -wtdrm
  10. Kuja is one of my all time faves. --Sencilia 10:02, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  11. LC 10:37, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Balthierfan 13:11, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  13. "Dark Messenger" is my favorite battle song from the series. MrSpiffy 11:17, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  14. As much as i love Golbez im sorry sir your epic shoulder plates cant compete against the Fabulousness that is Kuja Judge Magister Pyarox 23:31, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Golbez is a good villain. But Kuja is just my favorite villain in the series. SetzerLeonhart 04:05, July 3, 2012 (UTC)
  16. The guy destroyed an eantire planet. Not even Kefka matched this feat --Pzykosiz 05:43, July 3, 2012 (UTC)
  17. Tetraninja321 10:30, July 3, 2012 (UTC)
  18.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 18:31, July 3, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Kuja all day. No one in FF is as pretty, can make men and women alike uncomfortable with his hips that don't lie. One of the best villains of the series. G-baby is a dork and a glorified pawn. He's a great manipulator, clever schemer, takes Mega Flares to the face like a boss and NEVER lost to the heroes. Great character who developed all throughout the game. Dissidia ruined him.--AnonyMan 06:08, July 4, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Not an easy decision, but I'll choose the villain from my second favourite Final Fantasy ever. Miyuron 19:22, July 4, 2012 (UTC)
  21. ScatheMote 19:33, July 4, 2012 (UTC)
  22. Evil Messenger is one of the best character themes i can think of, behind the Turks themeSquallisnotemo 10:06, July 5, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Genuine character development >>>>>>>> mind control. Golbez is cool an' all, but Kuja remains one of the best antagonists in the series by a mile -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 18:08, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
  24. Easily the best villain in the series. Never been a big fan of Golbez. MystRay 19:25, July 7, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Kuja's poetry makes me happy! :D198.53.39.249 09:14, July 3, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Kuja is my favorite antagonist in any Final Fantasy game...of course he'd win! :3 06:18, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
  3. He first introduced a young 9 year-old me to the murky world of androgynous villainy. Who else can claim that? # 11:41, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
  4. Kuja is truly EVIL. Why? He killed Vivi (and the entire party for that matter) with a single Ultima! That's EVIL. 14:58, July 7, 2012 (UTC)

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

I definitely did not lose track of the date playing Pokemon Conquest. That would be a silly thought, and only a silly person would entertain such a thought. Jimcloud 03:34, July 2, 2012 (UTC)

And you surely did not have to be angrily poked by Scathe and myself in the means of procuring an update. :3 - +DeadlySlashSword+ 03:43, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
Speaking of losing track of things...well, I was going to point out that there were now two fights on the Nomination Page that were not removed from the shortlist even after they had made it into the DNC...but I checked back and saw that someone in the committee took care of it. Good to see that. :) Guess I'll be waiting to see who's getting an ass-kicking from Zack next... SelkieMaiden267 04:10, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
You really think Zack can beat Kuja without any effort? For certain?C A T U S E 18:07, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
Face it, Cat, it's pretty much a given that if anyone from the VII Compilation becomes the Last Man Standing champion, that character will make it all the way to the "5th Win" retirement mark. (That's probably why voters favored Delita Heiral awhile back, to make abso-posi-you'd-better-believe-it sure that Sephiroth never got a chance to even try.) SelkieMaiden267 03:33, July 8, 2012 (UTC)

Not to be rude, but is the fight between Zack and Hojo still considered undecided? You know, despite the huge bloody sword embedded in the scientist's votes? Dogurasu 13:01, July 2, 2012 (UTC)

Oh, yes, I forgot to change the text. I was rushing a little bit to finish creating the new fight before Sunday ended, so I forgot to decide it, let me do that now... Jimcloud 13:10, July 2, 2012 (UTC)

Golbez v. Kuja hadn't been done yet? I thought this was nominated like three years ago... must check. JBed 13:38, July 2, 2012 (UTC)

It was the longest-running shortlist nomination after Balthier v. Zack, which was done about a month ago (as the LMS will tell you), so I wouldn't be surprised if it was nominated three years ago and has just been sitting there ever since. Jimcloud 13:54, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
It was first suggested 3 years and 87 days ago. Balthier and Zack were suggested ~4 years ago to this day (i.e.: towards start of July '08). JBed 14:21, July 2, 2012 (UTC)

@SidVI: Well, he blew up a planet with his bare hands, he killed the party near the end of the game, he's (in my opinion) the most human villain with emotions and motives deeper than "I'm evil" (looking at you, Exdeath), and he looks great in a thong. Emperor-PSPField.pngMATEUS 01:56, July 3, 2012 (UTC)

"Golbez can go to the moon! Can Kuja go to the moon?" Catuse, please. FFIX spoilers: Kuja goes to a whole other planet. And plunges it into war single-handedly through masterful manipulation. And then goes back to his home planet and blows it up. Kuja's a professional; going to the moon is for novices :3 -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 18:18, July 7, 2012 (UTC)

And professionals have standards </tf2> - +DeadlySlashSword+ 18:25, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
FFIX spoilers: Ah, but one planet was inside the other, so it doesn't count. And Memoria doesn't count either, it looks like it's in outer space but the whole thing makes no sense anyways.C A T U S E 19:45, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
And in the end, going to the moon is a poor reason for voting for someone. How many times have I seen a vote in an arena saying "This guy did/can do this thing, did/can the other guy?" and it makes no sense. Because you're comparing two different people who have completely different traits and you just pick out one tiny and irrelevant thing. Why would Kuja go to the moon? JBed 19:52, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
I can't speak for Jim and Scathe, but as long as it's not deliberate votestacking for LMS, I couldn't give less of a shit concerning rationale. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 19:58, July 7, 2012 (UTC)
Oh, of course it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. But I always cringe every time I read that type of vote. JBed 20:14, July 7, 2012 (UTC)

Y'know, I never thought much of Kuja. Maybe I just felt he was overshadowed by Garland's awesomeness so I never took much notice. I <3 Garland. JBed 20:17, July 7, 2012 (UTC)

I think a cool way to think of Kuja is that he doesn't really know how to be "human", as he has been created as an adult since the start never having to grow up from childhood. He looks to thinks like art to construct himself an identity (desert palace where Kuja lives is full of art and he talks in poetic kinda way and uses kind of "shakespearean" metaphors), but it's all rather shallow and when it's stripped away at the end you get to see what his true self is like. Vivi is similar to Kuja in how he comes to the world, but comes to grips with his existence in a different way. With the whole continuation of memory theme, Vivi comes to the conclusion that just having lived is enough because you having existed contributes to the greater thing; this is also paralleled when Kuja has passed and Mikoto thinks about Kuja how he was the first genome who braved to go against their "destiny" by trying to have his own identity and own path in life, rather than just being a vessel for others, and all genomes can follow his example in spirit.Keltainentoukokuu 04:54, July 8, 2012 (UTC)
I thought much the same, but interpreted his love of art and theater and such as him trying to make up for his inferiority complex by putting on an air of sophistication, intelligence and culture. Doreiku Kuroofangu 05:28, July 8, 2012 (UTC)

Week 202: Last Man Standing Round 13: Zack v. Hojo[edit source]

LMS Icon.png
VICTORY - 24 to 7
Professor Hojo
DEFEAT - 24 to 7
With Zack very soundly tromping Zell during the week 200 special, he now faces his next challenge: Hojo. The mad scientist used Zack to further his ambitions, but Hojo deemed him a failure. Will Zack exceed Hojo's hopes and defeat him, or will the scientist's calculations turn out accurate? Who will be the last man standing?

Votes for Zack[edit source]

  1. I can't possibly vote against Zack here, not when he has despicable old Hojo as his opponent. SelkieMaiden267 01:20, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  2. EC!?! D: You're voting for Hojo? I counter your vote, and crit you for 9,999. - BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 01:23, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Guess who Hojo experimented on and didn't go insane as a result? Yes, that's right, Zack. Jimcloud 01:25, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  4.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 01:28, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Free bird 01:37, June 25, 2012 (UTC) Gotta go with Zack! He's on a role and I can't see him losing this one!
  6.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 01:38, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Zack greatly exceeded the parameters of Hojo's experiment. Even better, he succeeded despite being labeled a "failure". Zack could easily best the scientist, even as "Heretic Hojo" --Time Master 02:55, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  8. KaiserPaladin 09:11, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  9. Cloud should've been the one to die on that cliffside. MateusNamelink.png Dissicon ff2 Emp1.png 09:54, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  10. オメガ Mk.XII Dissicon ff12 Vaan1.png 10:11, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  11. Duh. Drake Clawfang (talk)
  12. At this point, I don't think my votes gonna matter --Pzykosiz 10:57, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Uh.. this is a no brainer.. SetzerLeonhart 12:53, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  14.  Armageddon11! Dissicon ff12 Gab2.png 13:38, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  15. MissHimitsu 15:35, June 25, 2012 (UTC) Ehhh... no reasons needed? ^^
  16. Really? Miyuron 17:21, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  17. While I have to agree with DSS on the problems caused/solved ratio, I still can not vote against Zack. I just can't. MirrorshardSceada 22:25, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  18. Hojo's got nothing on Zack XD AtmaCrisis 06:42, June 26, 2012 (UTC)
  19. Pity we can't re write history and have Hojo die prior to Crisis Core.Aaaaa.jpgTheNemesisx 03:14, June 29, 2012 (UTC)
  20. Zack's chibi hair is amazingly ridiculous. ScatheMote 19:34, June 29, 2012 (UTC)
  21. LegendCrystarium Crystal Lightning.pngAqua 23:47, July 1, 2012 (UTC)
  22.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 03:09, July 2, 2012 (UTC)
  23. Vengeance shall be upon Hojo!  CloudyKrystal Dissicon ff7 Clo2.png 05:59, July 2, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. Zack VS Hojo? Hurray for LANDSLIDE! 15:37, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  2. I was SO upset when Zack died. One of the BEST characters EVER!!! 20:29, June 29, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Hojo[edit source]

  1. Carbuncle.pngEpicCarbunkl 01:20, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Aww, look at the lil' FFVII overworld polygons! They're so adorable! <3 <3 <3 --BlueHighwind 01:48, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Hojo is the reason Zack is as powerful as he was. No Hojo, no Zack. So Hojo wins by default.C A T U S E 02:17, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  4. --ClixPsi 02:48, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  5. I like to think that Hojo caused more problems than Zack solved. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 16:47, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
  6. If you weren't so like Cloud, I would vote for... well, it doesn't make much difference anyway... Master Lamington 05:23, June 26, 2012 (UTC)
  7. The fanboys, they gather! *Hugs the underdog* Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 20:06, June 29, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

This one's gonna be another one-sided victory for the unconquerable SOLDIER Zack Fair. Free bird 01:39, June 25, 2012 (UTC)

Awww, look at the cwute widdle chibis :3 JBed 05:28, June 26, 2012 (UTC)

In no universe is Hojo cute @_@ MateusNamelink.png Dissicon ff2 Emp1.png 05:31, June 26, 2012 (UTC)

@Nemesis: I'd like that myself - I hate, hate, hate hate HATE Hojo! Glad to see Zack kicking ass (like I predicted he would). SelkieMaiden267 19:30, June 29, 2012 (UTC)

Week 201: Hojo v. Hollander[edit source]

DNC Versus.png
17 to 12½
Both of this week's combatants would love to get their hands on our current Last Man Standing Champion, Zack Fair. These two scientists and rivals, the creators of Project S and Project G respectively, are arguably the ultimate cause of strife in the world of Final Fantasy VII. Whose science will reign supreme?
17 to 12½

Votes for Hojo[edit source]

  1. Only because Hojo cause more pain and suffering, to be honest I don't care which one wins Zack just going to kill them.  NeoZEROX Dissicon ff6 Ter4.png 06:56, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  2. オメガ Mk.XII Dissicon ff12 Vaan1.png 08:43, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  3. He's a smartass. And he was in the picture much longer than Hollander was. And that moment with him on the beach...hilarious. Tia-LewiseRydia - Young battle.png 12:46, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  4. ...Tetraninja321 12:54, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  5. Hollander.. yeah, no, Hollander just can't compare to Hojo, really. Jimcloud 15:00, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  6. I don't consider Hollander canon, so this is a pretty one-sided fight. Plus, Genesis is an extremely annoying character. While Sephiroth's personality and drive has been destroyed by the Compilation, he was originally a decent villain, and Hojo was responsible for all of that.--ClixPsi 15:56, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  7. Combo.C A T U S E 16:41, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  8. Of all the sick, twisted, and demented scientists out there, Hojo is one of my favorites.  < Kamikaze Pardee > 17:09, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  9. I utterly despise Hojo, but I guess that's what makes him one of the best villains in the series. TheOxBellows 20:57, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  10. I vote for the archetypal mad scientist, who will do anything for the sake of his research. Bonus points for cheating death in DoC. Also, his superior intellect and malice compared to Hollander, is truly shown with the success of Project S, and the subsequent failure of Project G. --Time Master 03:00, June 18, 2012 (UTC)
  11. I was going to vote Hollander because ultimately more Project G subjects survived than Project S subjects (3 - 1 if you count Weiss), but then I realize Hollander has no good images to use in the DNC. - +DeadlySlashSword+ 17:20, June 19, 2012 (UTC)
  12. Gotta vote for Hojo even if I hate him.. He just seems more well conected to the story.. Hollander didn't really leave a strong impression... SetzerLeonhart 02:25, June 21, 2012 (UTC)
  13. Is there any doubt? This asshole is the cause of the biggest disasters in the FF7 Universe. Fuhito(or Fujito? don't recall the spelling) is a wannabe. Hollander failed his experiments. This one is the only one to be actually successful in shitting with the world, not once but multiple times. The vote goes to him. --BGMaxie 15:30, June 21, 2012 (UTC)
  14. I hate this guy so much and who would have thought he would have nailed someone like Lucrecia.Aaaaa.jpgTheNemesisx 15:24, June 22, 2012 (UTC)
  15. Hollander is a lame copycat. He copied most of his character, ineffectively, from Hojo. And he copied hammerspace armaments from Dr. Cid -- Sorceror Nobody Flan.PNG 13:15, June 24, 2012 (UTC)
  16.  The SirLaguna Dissicon ff8 Lag1.png 14:41, June 24, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 14:58, June 17, 2012 (UTC) Vote for the scientist who actually succeeds at his crazy experiments
  2. Prof. Hojo is maniac. And he wanders with Weiss... Well, that's all. XD 12:08, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

Votes for Hollander[edit source]

  1. Hollander put up much more of a fight in Crisis Core than anyone else, even the Final Boss. BlitzballArt.pngTidus357 09:11, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  2. Because I hated Hojo to his very core. ESPECIALLY seeing him in a swimsuit at Costa Del Sol... ugh... MateusNamelink.png Dissicon ff2 Emp1.png 10:33, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  3. Has a personality more fit for a nutty doctor than Hojo (who just laughs and says "intelligent" stuff), actually looks like a person who could get married (Hojo and Lucrecia, wtf?). ZaFlareStar 15:21, June 17th 2012, GMT+3
  4. Normally, I'd vote for the one I love to hate the most, then I saw that beard... King of Noobs 13:21, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  5. This fight needs more beard.CardboardBoxMan 18:45, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  6. Purely for the fact that he can put together a mini-nuke from materials in a bag for an imprompt attack during his boss fight. First time i saw it, i burst out laughing. Balthierfan 21:41, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
  7. MrSpiffy71810 18:01, June 17, 2012, (UTC)
  8. Beard swayed me. ScatheMote 02:05, June 18, 2012 (UTC)
  9. There's someting about Hojo I don't like. That's right EVERYTHING!!!!! --Pzykosiz 03:06, June 18, 2012 (UTC)
  10. Hollander gets my vote for his hyperspace arsenal of giant missiles in his waist pouch. Drake Clawfang (talk)
  11. I simply dislike Hojo--Xabryn 02:52, June 21, 2012 (UTC)
  12. I actually like this guy more. Surprise, surprise. MissHimitsu 07:16, June 24, 2012 (UTC)

Anonymous Votes[edit source]

  1. 12:03, June 17, 2012 (UTC) I can't stand Hojo. And besides, said scientist will never get to reign supreme, seeing as Zack (and Cloud, and pretty much everyone else) will most likely kill him off anyway later on. ^_-

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Like I said about Delita v. Sephiroth (when Celes awaited the winner of that fight), I don't care who wins this one; Zack will kick the ass of the so-called winner into two weeks from next Tuesday. SelkieMaiden267 19:08, June 17, 2012 (UTC)

It might just be me, but Hollander's beard and hairdo makes me think of Jeff Bridges... MateusNamelink.png Dissicon ff2 Emp1.png 11:16, June 19, 2012 (UTC)



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