This is an archive, for posterity. Voting is closed.


Week 60: Balthier v. Cloud[edit source]


47½ to 37
Who's the prettiest man?

Votes for Balthier[edit source]

  1. Rydiaofmist: Balthier is by far hotter than Cloud, in both looks and personality. He's smooth, charming, and witty. Cloud is a good hero, but waaaaaay too screwed up.
  2. dudutsai: Not Cloud... Balthier.
  3. OmgItsFrenchie: As much as I love Chocobo Head I'll have to go with Balthier. What can I say? He has the looks, the accent and he's by far the coolest character in the series :D
  4. Crimsonshadow619: Cloud's got the raw power, but Balthier has the brains and the ability to use them. Also, the gun gives him a bit of a range advantage
  5. SCM: If you read what I posted in the last match's peanut gallery, you'd realize that this is a NO DUH!!!
  6. Blykus: My vote goes to the leading man; who else?
  7. Mymindislost: WOOOOO AWESOME. ^_^ I think we all know who I'm going for in this one. :P
  8. First off, he has a Viera as a partner and he essentially has Ashe on a leash. Hexed
  9. Hiddensilver:I haven't even played FFXII (just RW) but I have to go with Balthier. He's got the good looks, and his intelligence is just HOT! Cloud gets depressed, goes bonkers way too often, and is TOO pretty. (I prefer my pretty men to look like men, thank you very much).
  10. Gaming-king:Iam going with Balthier ok
  11. SS: Hard.. cloud is awesome but balthier can change weapons(advantage).
  12. What Final Fantasy character can you spend all day quoting lines from? Balthier. Not Cloud, only the leading man Sky Pirate. This is not a game, this is a slaughter. --BlueHighwind
  13. There are FAR too many reasons to vote for Balthier over Cloud that there’s no WAY I could fit them all in here. So let’s analyze a few: 1) He’s a sky pirate. The way I see it, a sky pirate beats a depressed SOLDIER any day. 2) Jus’ look at him. Go on, do it. 3) His voice is Bond-worthy. 4) He’s not a depressed, lackadaisical emo. 5) Cloud is seriously overrated. 6) FFVII is SERIOUSLY overrated. 7) He’s got that hot Viera chick. Cloud’s just got a girl with jugs the size of your head. 8) He uses guns. Way more original than “GIANT SWORD LAWL”. 9) Balthier owns his own airship. Cloud just rides on one. 10) Most Important: How could I not vote for him? He is the leading man, after all! --Rabid Biscuit
  14. Crazyswordsman: Balthier would first win in a match of logic, and then in a match to the death. I vote for the leading man who keeps his cool over the one who can't control himself.
  15. cuz he's better in every concievable way, except for cross-dressing, cloud wins that.Cloudofdarkness 14:19, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
  16. Silent Meiousei: Balthier is more cooler than Cloud. He hasn't got some tragic whining problems from past. He's just a handsome, cool guy...who doesn't reflect for self-analysis...
  17. Drake Clawfang: Balthier sounds cool, but I'm mostly voting against Cloud. He reminds me of Cyan and the two of them spend the game moping about things that aren't their fault and getting all emo. Plus, Balthier is man-pretty, and man-pretty is pretty cool for a man.
  18. Dickens Windshot: I think Balthier and Final Fantasy XII is best than Cloud and Final Fantasy VII. Balthier is smart and has style, but Cloud is just depressed. I vote on the sky pirate and the leading man!
  19. ChiefKakashi: Lets make this as one-sided as possible!
  20. Henryacores: I'm not a Balthier fan, but Cloud is Gay. (I will surely get a test1/2/3/banned for this(>>), but I won't change this. Cloud is the only gay ass I hate in the world. Fran kicks ass though.
  21. Adam mcduck: Balthier isn't necessarily my favourite character (although he is cool), Cloud is just my least favourite character from VII.
  22. Cloud is overrated and has a sword that's 20x too large. Balthier is a pirate with a gun. He's also the leading man in a game where he's not necessarily supposed to be the real leading man. Guess who wins? Zero Exillerius 21:24, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
  23. Falbub: Voting for the sexy brit here. I was never a big fan of emo main characters, so yeah.
  24. Pablo618: I'm going for the leading man, who else?
  25. Alcaeus: Balthier isn't pretty, he's sexy. Cloud isn't pretty, he's a pussy.
  26. Aleria: Balthier. No reason, just...Balthier is cool.
  27. Jammi568: Because a) Balthier is manlier, what with the voice and the ability to attract any woman he wants, and b) he can feel some other emotion other than emoism
  28. tomtheroadkill: I've never really liked Cloud that much. And Balthier certainly has a bigger ego than Cloud!
  29. Alexander Namingway: I don't hate FFVII and I think giant swords are awesome. It's just that Cloud has less personality than a brick. Balthier has uproarious wit, character depth, and Fran. A few lines from Balthier put a smile on my face, a few of Clouds lines from AC put me to sleep.
  30. Yellowmoogle: I hate Cloud because, what kind of person has to warp his own past to be cool. Besides Balthier is way way better than anyone.
  31. BritBoy: Balthier had that effortless coolness, Cloud whined too much for my taste, especially in Advent Children
  32. Cactuar83:Cloud you spikey-headed jerk! Balthier would kick your ass!
  33. Datura: I'm playing through both VII and XII at the min and i must say, Balthier rocks the HARDEST!
  34. Mateus_the_Corrupt: When I saw Cloud, he was some sort of *sigh* nothing, never use a long-ranged attack. For Balthier, he could use his gun for long-ranged attack. So don't pick Cloud! Choose Balthier to be your vote!
  35. User:Mizuno Mahou: I am picking Balthier simply because he's added a lot to Final Fantasy XII. He was simply everything that Cloud was not. Balthier was smooth-talking, optimistic, funny, upbeat, and Balthier was actually an interesting character. Cloud is simply everyone's favorite because of his out-of-place (not in Final Fantasy VII) oversized spiked hair and sword.
  36. User:Traibian: Cloud is really overrated. Balthier is way better
  37. Ivalicia: I like Cloud a lot, but Balthier is much 'prettier.'
  38. PapaBear: Balthier is the main man,But Cloud does rock.Balthier seems as an achievable real life character were as
  39. Sorceress Heartilly: Balthier has normal hair and wears a pair of dangly ear rings (Balthiers metro style>>>Clouds macho leather look)
  40. Xmd5a: Balthier is THE leading man after all. And, you know what they say about THE leading man? He NEVER dies. So, logically, Balthier CANNOT lose.

Anonymous votes[edit source]

  1. Balthier doesn't just have brains, he's got good looks and clothes to go with them.
  2. Balthier could probably moon-walk better than Cloud.
  3. Balthier is the sexiest Final Fantasy character ever. His manner, demeanor, attitude... dead sexy.
  4. Im going to have to go with Balthier on this one. Partly to spite cloud, and the rest because Balthier is just plain awesome.
  5. Pitty vote, plus I hate Cloud.
  6. Cloud cant exist, His swords are as big as he is! That just puts a thorn in my side so I vote for Balthier.
  7. Troy: Would have to say Balthier, because of the James Bond like demeanor. And I think we know how Bond did with the ladies (or in this case Viera).
  8. Balthier of course, like his attitude.
  9. Sephiroth: Baltheir is way preetier .
  10. Definitely Balthier; he's not a whiny little wannabe like Cloud is.
  11. Rainacide: I'll go with Balthier, as cool & as much as I'm a fan of Cloud. Everyone likes him. But Balthier has some catchy lines, something Cloud doesn't have. I'm pretty much sick of silent protagonist or those emo bitch ones. Only silent protagonist I actually like is Serge from Chrono Cross. But to the main point, Balthier - can use a shitload of weapons, has a busty Viera chick and is the LEADING MAN!
  12. EmuMaster: Okay, poeple who are familiar with me shouldn't have to be told that I hate Cloud or why. Since I vote in all of these, I assume you all know me. =P Oh, and for the love of god, if Cloud actually wins, I am so done with you people -_-
  13. Cloud is an impossable.
  14. I say Balthier all the way.
  15. A man with clothes like that, a bunny partner like that, and is just that hot, you can't help but admire. I know I do. He actually does justice to his Viera partner. Cloud could be prettier than Tifa, for heavens sake. And for those who have said that a pirate with a gun is not very creative, well, the only thing creative about Cloud is his chocobo hair and ginormous sword. He has the personality of a rock. It's non-freakin'-existant. The only thing I like about Cloud is that he can cross-dress. How that's possible with hair like that I will never know. Balthier on the other hand is suave, cool and way too awesome. And his gold vest and tight black pants? A bucket of win. Balthier rules! By the way, Falconier111, in case you never noticed, in FFXII killing Imperials with a dagger, a sword or even a bow took longer time than it would killing them with a gun. One shot from Balthier and the Imperial was dead. I don't know about you, but that's pretty damn strong to me. Besides, Auron can pull of the angsty giant sword wielding look way better than Cloud ever will or even wishes he could. So there.
  16. How can Cloud beat the leading man? I mean, the leading man rules all.

Votes for Cloud[edit source]

  1. Shyny:I don't know what everyone has with Balthier. I don't understand how any of FFXII character can stand a chance against those of FFVII. None of them has any development and i can't see anything original on Balthier. His past, his James Bond like acting, as well many says Buster Swords is weird but definitely much more original than a gun.
  2. JARIITX:All I can say is speak softly and carry a big sword, so I'm going with Cloud.
  3. I dunno..flamboyant and me never mix well.--N/A
  4. BSW Cloud for sure.. cloud has got the moves, the hair, the style, The Sword, the sheer power, The Personallity... CLOUD HAS IT!!!!
  5. Varehemsko:Hopefully this won't just turn into a 'who's the better character' poll. That is if people read the goddamn question! Anyway enough ranting. Balthier, wearing a dress? I know he likes his clean shirts and all, but Cloud just seems to edge it. He looks about as at home in a dress as anyone would in his place. But with one difference: a fat lech like Don Corneo actually BELIEVES Cloud is a woman.
  6. Otherarrow: Cloud is better than Ffamran because Cloud is actully the main charater. And he thinks he's Zack, who is so much better and prettier than that Han Solo clone.
  7. Bob the geomancer i've only played revenant wings wings balthier, and he sucks
  8. Xadren: Cloud is the best character I've ever seen and when I say "Cloud" I mean the FF7's Cloud. He was the first character to have a similar success, he's got a big sword, he's silent but at the same time a great warrior. A simple man who has a great will. Go Cloud!
  9. james.himbo: True to form, I'm voting for the Final Fantasy VII character. But if there was ever a battle that made me almost pick the non-VII character, it was this one.
  10. (I am going to get SO much flack for this) Buster Sword, sorry, but i'm forced to vote for it. It's prettier than either of the charaters, therefore, based on looks, buster sword wins. RedMage
  11. AuronKaizer: Yeah, I vote for BlueHighWind (in this case illustrated by a numbskull like Cloud) as the most overrated bastard of these two.
  12. CanineStarSirius: I like Cloud a lot... His crossdressing part was hilarious. And I love the buster sword. And Omnislash Limit Break. Love it.Anti-gravity hair gel for the win. And Cloud (Balthier fans, don't kill me), in my humble opinion, is hotter. :3
  13. Superaeon: Is cloud seriusly losing to blathier?!?!? and any one who says gun give advantage, watch advent children, particuarly the scene where cloud faces off with yazoo and loz at the same time. Sword beats the gun!!
  14. User:MYVizmMYVizm: I'm voting for Cloud. Why explain? He's awesome ^^
  15. This contest is boring as fuck.Is there any fights that make us think?Seifer Gunblade 23:26, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
  16. Drake:Yawn.
  17. PhoenixDew: Hard to pick, cause they are both purty, but I think Cloud, especially AC Cloud one ups Balthier on the prettiness scale. I guess I like the whole emo thing.
  18. Meh, I vote for Cloud. If anything to counter the annoying, "I hate FFVII, therefore I will vote against anything that is FFVII related" vote(s).Oranejo 02:28, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
  19. ShadowLaguna: Here's to the spikey haired, awesome character who is one of my favourite fictional characters of all time. Plus, he was the first FF character I liked!
  20. 8bit_BlackMage: Sort of a pity vote. I dunno, when I look at the close-up image of Balthier, I note his earrings, assorted bangles, and.....sweater? Cloud looks like more of a Final Fantasy character. Please don't chew my head off, I have played neither of these games and am going on first impressions.
  21. Sora G. Strife 11:23, 15 March 2008 (UTC): Well, a huge sword that can actually block bullets and can probably crush a building in one shot? Balthier may be way cooler, but in a fight to the death, a person trained specially to dodge bullets (in his imagination, at least) can OWN.
  22. Kyoku Sefirosu Cloud can't even be compared to Balthier, end of story
  23. Etch: Cloud is the man, what else can i say. Balthier may be suave but there will never be another character as complex as cloud, and thats what makes him more appealing.
  24. Vampyro entertaiment 14:54, 17 March 2008 (UTC) CLOUD!!! if someone can defeat sephiroht then anyone else is just apiece of cake!!!
  25. Zolo6 Cloud totally has the ability to beat him as seen in Advent Children Cloud is still strong without Materia.Balthier without the Lisence board he's nothing but a man who speaks Shakesspear with a gun which Cloud block his bullets.HA ha !!!
  26. MCMLXXXIV: I shall vote for all the wrong reasons because it seems to be in style.
  27. Cheesewow: Pure pity vote. I would much rather vote for Balthier, but he already has like a 20 vote lead. so pity vote it is
  28. TacticAngel

Anonymous votes[edit source]


  1. big ass sword lets see balthier surive omnieslash.
  2.  ??????: Balthier has that "James Bond" thing going for him, very charming. "I'm the leading man, who else?" He also looks good in formal dress. When I see Cloud, though, I just want to hug him. His spiky hair, that incidently earns him his nickname, looks very cute on him. He makes a uniform work and is femenine-looking enough to look like a girl in a dress. I don't think Balthier would dare to dress as a lady and he would probably not look much like a girl in it. Based on looks alone, as the question indicated, Cloud Strife gets my vote.
  3. Yumiko: Go Cloud! I dont know why people like Balthier so much. As I said before VII is better than XII. VII already has Before Crisis, Advent Children, Dirge of Cerberus, and the soon to be North American release of Crisis Core. And maybe a remake of the original game. Besides Revenant Wings I dont think Square is going to make another game/movie for XII. Also why does everyone hate Cloud! It makes me sad...T_T
  4. This is actually a hard choice. I choose the one with the sword. The First Tsurugi is better than any gun. that, and right now, he's losing :(
  5. Cloud is amazing and he's way cooler than Balthier. Just check his sword, it's huge and wicked awesome, especially the First Tsurugi. Plus he is the hero of the best Final Fantasy.
  6. Secret Asian Man: Two of the hottest girls follow Cloud in the game. Who follows Balthier? A rabbit and Vaan. And if I was gay, Cloud would be the first one to turn me on, then Squall would be second. That makes Cloud prettier than Balthier. Also i just hated FFXII because of the lack of everything needed in a game and a story.
  7. i actually have to step in for 1nce, cloud strife is the bomb he gotta win
  8. I know it's who is prettiest but FF7 was way better then the sub par FF12.
  9. Although Cloud can be a little emo, at least he goes for human girls. Furries just freak me out
  10. Cloud is the best out of any FF charecter
  11. My vote goes for Cloud :) He is way better than balthier, and FFVII is way better than FFXII. That's my opinion.
  12. usually when pit against Final Fantasy 7 characters i always vote for the second option, but in this case I will have to go with Cloud. While Balthier has got the brains, charm, and wit, What makes me like a character is power (usually.) Cloud went through the SOLDIER process, which is the only reason I like him as a main character probably. Balthier just has a wimpy gun and he doesnt use it in cool ways like Nooj. So my vote goes for Cloud.
  13. i love them both but my vote is for Cloud.
  14. cloud for sure. while i think balthier is badass, does he wield an enormous sword AND manage to keep his hair looking fantastic? not quite.
  15. Falconier111: Which is cooler? A nattily-dressed pirate with a pistol who has funny lines he says with a British accent and fights a generic Evil Empire? Or a genetically-modified super-soldier rebel with a huge-ass sword fighting the evil corporation that created him? I'll go with the second one. Besides, he fights Sephiroth. That's enough for me. To those who say Cloud is "emotional" or "whiny" - that's because Cloud's life is screwed up, which adds to his mystique. Besides, remember the scene in FFVII where Sephiroth kills Aerith? Pretty emotional, that. Also, Balthier sucks as a character in FFXII. I use Fran whenever I can, because she attacks faster and more powerfully than him.
  16. anon <3s cloud!
  17. -Anonomous-What the hell is wrong with the people who are voting for Balthier...sure he's cool but have they even PLAYED ff7 or WATCHED ff7:advent children? So what he's got a gun but i doubt he'd even be able too hit Cloud...don't beleive me the movie and play the game...then you'll reconsider...
  18. TacticsBlackMage- i agree w/ the guy b4 me and ive played both 2 im sure eventually he could hit him but it'd be a lucky shot if he did and for you people talkin about there looks and picking from that, stay on subject!its fighting not looks!

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Actually sorry tacticsblackmage it is the prettiest although if it was fighting cloud would definetily win.

This is gonna be fun to watch. =D TheSwordofDoubt 03:56, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Ditto. Oath to Order 03:57, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Hooray sexy man fight! ^_^ I didn't think this one would ever happen, and I was contemplating doing it myself. Hooray once more! --Mymindislost 05:53, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Hope people decide to read the question. Should make things a little more even for Balthier. Bless him he's just not quite feminine-pretty. Varehemsko 06:44, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Anyone that thinks that they can resist Balthier, has not met the man. He could talk you into doing anything, to anyone. That is the power of Balthier. --BlueHighwind 12:12, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
Balthier is man-pretty, that's the masculine kind of pretty that it's ok for a man to be. But Cloud is pretty-pretty, not man pretty, and that's pretty bad. Drake Clawfang 17:09, 13 March 2008 (UTC)


Damn I should buy ff12... -FakeFreedom
How are guns more original then giant swords? There is only one other character in fiction that I know of that uses a sword the size of the buster sword, and he came after Cloud. I could go on forever with people (real-life or otherwise) that use guns. Oath to Order 17:27, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Okay, you guys really have to stop with the gay bashing. I have had to remove two votes so far due to their offensive nature. I don't give a shit what problems you may have with gay people, nor do I care what your pastor told you about what God thinks (he's wrong by the way). Here's a fun fact for you all: those who fear homosexuals, are homosexual. They fear the gayness on the inside. --BlueHighwind 19:23, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Okay, I apologize on behalf of Henryacores for pointing out your sexual preference. Won't happen again. Or...? --Auron Kaizer 19:26, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
And to think the one who did this censorship was the one who started the gay bashing... [^_^]/ 19:29, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, when he was alive, CSM was a pretty mean guy with hate in his heart. --Auron Kaizer 19:31, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
The hypocracy of democracy, indeed. I've changed my ways, now I stand on the other side of the issue. Then again, I only said those things to piss you guys off. I was a bad boy back in 2007, wasn't I? --BlueHighwind 19:32, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
I certainly don't see any gay bashing on Henry's remark tho. He did mention that "Cloud is the only gay ass I hate in the world." Meaning he's okay with other gay asses. Is their opinion, let it fly. [^_^]/ 19:41, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
But then again, his only reason given for hating Cloud is because he is a "gay ass". He should not have even mentioned it if he had anything better to say. Plus I just hate gay bashing because it is cheap, lazy thinking. I don't want us to become yet another internet fan site where you can't go five minutes with somebody being called a "fag". This is a wiki, not XBox Live. --BlueHighwind 19:48, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
When people call something gay, I just tell them it take one to know one. -- ChiefKakashi 20:30, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
Take my advice, just let it go. --Alcaeus
Alcaeus, I have nothing to sorry to you because you're not a gay ass. You're just gay, and there's nothing with it. If i did hurt you in any way, then I'm sorry. BH, stop being an hypocrite and making up things where they don't exist. -Henryacores
Well, make a stupid contest, get a stupid answer. --Auron Kaizer 19:53, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
That's logic I can live with. We have a logical compromise. It also explains that weird BH Fanboy comparing me to Cloud. Some people are just "out there". --BlueHighwind 19:56, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
Most of these votes are for the wrong reason... they didn't read the question. Gay bashing is inevitable with a question like that though. -FakeFreedom
I would like to remind you, FakeFreedom, that not everyone on this wiki is a straight male, so I fail to see how gay bashing would be "inevitable." Besides, it's not like anyone's forcing anyone else to vote in the DNC. If someone doesn't have an opinion on the matter or doesn't want to vote, they don't have to. --Mymindislost 23:24, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Sounds like this had already become a one-sided fight in favor of Balthier. I'm actually shocked that Cloud's popularity has decreased over the years. Oh well, there's always hope that the next fight is much closer and more exciting. JARIITX 01:28, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

*Points and laughs at the Cloud votes in a mocking tone* --Crazyswordsman 03:17, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

*Points and laughs even harder at the Cloud votes* SCM

Also, this will be the last time I intervene (I did this only because MMIL was pissed that the girls weren't getting enough of what they wanted). From now on I will be voting on fights on the talk page, since you guys know better than I do. --Crazyswordsman 03:17, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Note: Also, the gay guys. Can I be the official FFWiki Fag Hag? :P --Mymindislost 04:47, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
You and I both know that we actually have LGBT members here, so gay jokes are even less funny and more childish than they are normally. --Crazyswordsman 13:30, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
I wouldn't be so sure, CSM. Clearly, the voted battles are as likely to be one-sided than the canned ones (and they're generally pretty repetitive). I like an active talk page, but clearly some of the affirmed suggestions there are never going to see the light of day. --TacticAngel 05:07, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
I'm down, MMIL. I'm in dire need of a cyber-hag. =] Although I have a bisexual friend who SWEARS that it's impossible for bisexuals to be fag hags. It's whatever. I tried to explain that when all your friends are gay...that's a dead giveaway that you're a fag hag! --james.himbo 15:53, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

To the anon user who noted VII has more games than XII: that just means Square tried extra hard to squeeze money out of VII with lousy spin-offs. That XII only has one spin-off is a testament to them learning their lesson with VII and X-2 and not overdoing it. From what I've seen here most VII fans agree the spin-offs suck, so I'm not speaking from my ass here. Drake Clawfang 17:48, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Yumiko: And why did Square try harder with VII? It's because everybody loved it. I've noticed on this site that alot of people hate VII and it's sequals. Can anyone give a good reason why VII and its sequals "suck". All you people can provide is Cloud is a fag or because it just sucks. I seriously hate the people who hate FFVII. >:(
Well, I love FFVII, but I hate what happened to it in the sequels. In AC Cloud's personality did a 180 from what he was at the ending of VII (went from being a strong leader to feeling sorry for himself and abandoning people that needed him). Any mystique of VII's ending was gone, people who supposedly died in FFVII sprang back up (Shinra,Sephiroth), and the badass in Cid and Barret was diminished by the fish-net shirt(Barret) and jacket tied around the waist like a soccer mom.(Cid) Visually it was stunning, but that was about all I liked about it. Personally I would have prefered the spin-offs to be character prequels like with Crisis Core. Instead of DoC being a sequel of sorts, it could have focused on Vincent's life as a Turk.Oranejo 04:05, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
Ditto Drake2. But have in mind that Crisis Core rocks...and that's about it. Henryacores
Well, XII has two spin-offs, if you count Tactics A2, which several of it's characters appear in, and XII is a sort of spin-off of a spin-off, Tactics. Or, a spin-off of a spin-off's spin-off, Tactics Advance. This would make RV a spin-off's spin-off's spin-off's spin-off. Also, the question on the top, that's just a fun way to start the battle. It's not what you have to base your vote off of. Plus, there are no real rules at the DNC, well, not that really are about the question at the top. Sometimes there isn't even a question. -- The Drake who isn't blue and doesn't have an odd-sounding surname when you actually stop to think about it
Keep in mind that FFT is actually a spinoff of Tactics Ogre. The FFXII offshoots aren't much more quality than the FFVII, which I have enjoyed even where they were not of the same quality. Crisis Core, though, looks like a winner. Expect Zack v. Cloud. --TacticAngel 00:27, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
Expect Zack owning Cloud. The best of Crisis Core is that Cloud barely shows up...I hope.Otherwise, I'll just bash at my PSP, yelling at his fucking dumbassness. (In case that you didn't get it I really do hate him).-Henryacores 08:46, 15 March 2008 (UTC)Don't worry, he doesn't.

Hahahahahaha Superaeon's vote. Just for the record, I don't hate FFVII and I don't love Balthier. But Cloud is just not better. dudutsai I want Edge vs. Shadow now...-- ChiefKakashi 20:59, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Yumiko: There should be a fight between Sephrioth, Angeal, and Genesis. That would be intesting.
No it wouldn't. Sephiroth wins. --BlueHighwind 13:22, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
Yumiko: You could do it after Crisis Core releases in NA. I know some people havent gotten it yet.
But Crisis Core is not only going to be a crappy FF7 spinoff game, it's for the equally crappy PSP. --Alcaeus

G Gamer: In reference to some of the comments that I see around the Colosseum, I just wanted to say that, despite the fact that I like some Final Fantasy games better than others, I would never say that I "hate" one of them. I find it hard to believe that people could use such a strong word when referring to one of the absolute best series of video game ever created.

Well every FF generally has something that is unique about it, and some people may like it, while others may not. For instance some people like the Junction System and the love story from FF8, but I hate both (and a lot of other things from 8) so therefore I hate FF8. --Alcaeus
Still, do you actually HATE it? I mean, do you feel a deep rage inside you every time you see that game, do you hunt it down and slaughter its family? Or do you just think it's balls? I think hate is a word that is used far too much, including by me.RedMage
Actually, Red Mage, that about sums it up for me. FF8 and 7, actually. ~EmuMaster
I've only recently realized what a horrible game FF8 is. It's story is confusing, it's characters are idiotic and it's gameplay is so terrible, I have no words for it. Yes, hate is a strong word, but I gladly use it to describe my feelings for FF8. Now, I just need to finish that walkthrough I stupidly started. I've already given up on my FF5 walkthrough, I don't want to give up on two walkthroughs in a row...sigh. --Alcaeus

It's the end of the week and it's 39 and a half to 25 and a half. You know Cloud will never win. Can someone change it now? Oath to Order 02:00, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

RedMage I could try, but it would involve signing in as several different user names, which i don't think is very fair.

Yeah, it looks like Balthier has this one wrapped up. I voted for Cloud, but I really liked Balthier in I am happy either way with this one. What I want to really see is a matchup involving Delita, but I do not really think he stands a chance against any of the other main series characters.Oranejo 19:08, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

A few of these votes make me smile. Take Kyoku Sefirosu's for example. Number 22 for Cloud? He's EXACTLY right, Cloud can't be compared to Balthier...but he picked the wrong side to say that on. Rabid Biscuit 13:06, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Come on, I mean come on. Do you anon voters even READ the title of this fight??? IT IS ABOUT HOW PRETTY THEY ARE!!!!! NOT ABOUT FIGHTING SKILLS! For God's sake read the freaking instructions before you vote you idiots!! There, I've said my piece. RedMage

You're just too superficial. Characters are more than looks you know. --BlueHighwind 00:19, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
In defense, this match was stated to be a very superficial and fanservice laden one before it went up. I agree with your statement but that doesn't apply so much right now.AnonyMan 02:13, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
Then again, looks still aren't everything, even when it somes to fanservice. Baltheir's personality is far sexier then Cloud's looks. --BlueHighwind 02:16, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
That may be true, It's still Vote "Who you think is prettiest". We all know Cloud has a terrible personality, voting based on all-around appeal wouldn't have been fair.AnonyMan 02:22, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

This was one sided from the start! OmgItsFrenchie

Week 59: Kuja v. Kefka[edit source]

FF6 Kefkaart.jpg

45 to 26½
FF6 Kefkaart.jpg
K-Villains... arch villains you might say, but in any case... there they are.

Votes for Kuja[edit source]

  1. He's prettier and is VERY brave to wear that thong/cod-piece. And he's a better villian. :P -Alcaeus
  2. SmegHead: I would usually vote for Kefka, but I quite like Kuja as a villain. He has great development as the game progresses, and his reasons for destroying the world are a tad more dramatic than Kefkas: if I can't live, why should anything else?.
  3. Falbub: Kuja is what originally got me hooked on Final Fantasy. I saw some cutscenes of him on youtube and thought "This is freaking awesome!" So I started playing FF and loved it. Plus, you guys are allowed to vote for the hotter girl, so I'm allowed to vote for the hotter guy. What can I say? I like bishies.
  4. Resa91: I can't decide! I love both of these guys. I love both of Final Fantasy VI and IX. This is so hard, but my vote goes for Kuja (because I think he is about to lose. Kefka is so popular villain). Uwee hee hee! :D
  5. Otherarrow: Eh, I enjoyed Kuja and his backstory a bit more.
  6. Rabid Biscuit: Kuja. All the way. He's just the best. I say he's the best villain of the entire Final Fantasy series. He had a great backstory, a perfect personality, and, while his man-thong is rather disturbing, he generally looked pretty cool too. Now, don't get me wrong, Kefka's freakin' awesome. But Kuja is freakin' awesomer. BTW, did I mention that IX is my favorite FF?
  7. Adam Mcduck: Kefka wasn't the worst villain, he just annoyed me. He killed loads of people for no reason whatsoever, I don't like that type of character. I prefer villains who kill to achieve something or actually have a motive behind it (as insane as it might be). Plus, i just think Kuja is a cooler character.
  8. Pablo618: Kuja is awesome and powerful
  9. AnonyMan: Kuja, very underrated and easily the greatest FF villain. Good story and development, with awesome musical pieces to boot. Yes, his appearance and attire is so terrible he almost makes Sephiroth look cool but it works for a vain and slightly narcissistic guy like him. Trance made him look cooler at least, better than Kef's weird, ugly forms. Now I don't hate Kefka but, he did all that crap for basically no reason, Kuja at least had some motives. And at the end of the day, Kefka fanboys are just as annoying as Suckaroth's.
  10. Pikmin Master: Kuja was harder to beat.
  11. Nirvana: I've played all through IX and not VI so what what I've seen of Kefka, I prefer Kuja.
  12. User:booff7:I don't know what it was I liked about Kuja, no idea whatsoever, but for some reason he is actually one of my favorite villains of the series. Kefka didn't really have a reason to be evil either, he's still cool, it just made him a little less beleivable because he was evil for no reason presented in the game. The other thing about Kuja is that he is the only villain in the series who didn't get his own hands dirty killing all the people he wanted to but manipulated the people of Gaia to kill themselves off for him just so he could strike out at the perfect opportunity. Overall, I found Kuja to be more original than Kefka, not to say I didn't like Kefka but I liked Kuja more.
  13. PhoenixDew: I think Kuja was awesome, and I never really cared for Kefka, cause he was all clowney and stuff. I also liked that Kuja was real and had a change of heart at the last minute. The only downside is he isn't quite the main villain, since Necron gets the last battle... But Kuja proved his villain-ness when he summoned Bahamut to wreak havoc upon Queen Brahne's Fleet and then Alexandria.
  14. Kyoku Sefirosu:I love Kefka, but his time is passing, and he is starting to get overrated, Kuja in this case is an underdog, but at the same time I really find him an awesome villain and a powerful one at that, and it seems alot of the Pro-Kefka fans who are voting for him are picking on Kuja based on his appearnce which is a load of bull. I hope you guys realize Kefka is a transvestite too!!! Lol, anyways, as much as I love Kefka, I have to go with Kuja here, he doesn't get the credit he deserves
  15. Drake:Yay, yet another one-sided fight here at the DNC! It's clear that Kefka is going to win, but at least this match hasn't been done before anywhere, so I'm happy. You know why I'm voying for Kuja, he's from what just might be the best game in the entire series while Kefka is a clown and from the second worst (fifth if you count spin-offs).
  16. Varehemsko:Is there anything more arrogant than trying to destroy everything because it will exist without you when you die? Well if there is, then it wouldn't be Kuja doing it. I mean, at least arrogance is a better reason for destruction than just for the hell of it. Besides, clowns are just silly. I prefer Dark Messenger to Dancing Mad too, especially since Kuja has other themes besides.
  17. Xadren: Even if I like Kefka, I think Kuja has a better prot on his shoulder. He's poetic and absolutely heartless, but he also redeems himself at the end of the story. So, although I'm sure Kefka will win...GO KUJA!
  18. Ctaylor503: How many Kefka voters haven't played IX, I wonder? Doesn't Kuja just sound more evil? He was created for the purpose of death and destruction, and arguably excelled at them.
  19. Kurenai Samurai: Kuja is poetic, sinister, flamboyant, destructive, and amazing. What does Kefka have..? An annoying laugh. Yes, Kuja is fantastic. After playing FFIX, Kuja became my favorite video game villain. -nod-
  20. Darkling692: Kefka is a great villain, but Kuja is a little bit better. Both destroy a world, both have cool transformations, but Kuja is more related to the main character giving him a little more depth.
  21. Sorceress Heartilly: Out of these two FF's I've only played IX but I've studied Kefka and while he is an interesting charcater with very stylish clothes kuja is more likeable to me; it takes more balls to wear tat man-thong and ladies thigh boots, besides effeminate men are much more cooler to me. Kuja is a mage with total mage abilities, Kefka is just a coward and runs away a lot.
  22. Alexander Namingway: FLARE STAR! ULTIMA! This andrygonous megalomaniac holds a lot of sentimental value as the first final fantasy villian I ever thwarted
  23. Staff's Bizzaro: This is simply to commend Kuja for being brave enough to walk around dressed like that.

Anonymous votes[edit source]

  1. EmuMaster: This was actually a tough choice for me. I love Kefka. He pwns. On the other hand, I think Kuja develops more as a character, honestly. He also has the benefit of being in my favourite Final Fantasy to date and, and I KNOW I'll get flamed for this, he has the better theme music, in my opinion. Dancing Mad is Nobuo's greatest work, but it's only barely fitting for Kefka, while Dark Messenger isn't really as good, it's just better for a fighting scene. Kuja's plan is ultimately better as well. Kefka wanted to destroy the world, but to what end, really? Kuja wanted to destroy it out of fear of Zidane. I'm starting to ramble, so in short, Kuja is a BAMF who is secure enough in his masculinity to wear whatever feels comfortable, and to him that's apparently a metal thong. Power to you, man.
  2. hellifrit: KUJA ROCKS !!!! he is good loking ans id EVIL!!!! kefka is just strange
  3. Kuja: He's the angel of death.
  4. Rinoa : Kuja kicked ass he was so powerful sephiroth tried to destroy the planet, kuja did it, throughout the game you never once beat Kuja and he also saves you in the end, trance Kuja>a psychotic clown kefka was cool but kuja all the way :)
  5. Hiltigarrs: Kuja blates. Kefka was some 2d, hollow pychotic villian that I never could take seriously. Well, except for when he kills an entire castle with poison. Evil. Kuja on the other hand - an evil menace as well as genius. He blackmails you to do his own dirty work? AND gets away with it? He gets a queen to destroy most important cities in the world and then destroys an entire planet by himself? Has his own pet dragon?? B A M F!!
  6. Rainacide: I have to go with Kuja. He is underrated but really he's actually a good villain. He had bitches do his dirty work for him & even had the main cast of FFIX do his dirty work for him. He was so filty he dressed like a girl & made alot of the players of FFIX thought he was a girl. Not only that...he destroyed Terra by himself, has his own pet dragon. Looks like a Super Saiyan 4 in his Trance form...and single-handedly manhandles your party about 3 times.
  7. Yumiko: It's so hard to choose! They are both super awesome but I choose Kuja. Kefka went insane and destroyed everything and became a god but he didn't have much reason for it. (Not that he needs a reason to destroy a world.) Kuja destroyed because he resented that he was mortal and would someday die so he chose to kill everything so it would die with him. So Kuja had a reason. But basiclly this is a vote for the losing side. I think that both Kefka and Kuja are both equaly powerfull and yes, it is creepy that Kuja wears such um... "girly?" clothes.
  8. Johnny - Well Kuja is a Goddess-like God, nothing else needed ;]
  9. FFIXFAN - I vote for Kuja, a fan of FFIX & a fan of someone that can wear some female clothes & wipe out your whole entire party in an instant ;]
  10. Nova Dragon - Kuja owns, double crosses people, uses a bit of mentality to take over the world, even tho Kefka has Godlike powers, Kuja destroyed an entire planet with one spell. Now that is ownage.

Votes for Kefka[edit source]

  1. Rydiaofmist: I'm definitely going to have to vote for Kefka. He's such an great evil villain and way more badass than Kuja.
  2. Drake Clawfang: Haven't touched IX in a while, but I vote for Kefka. I'm sure Kuja is a good villain too, but while they both look weird, Kefka isn't androgynous. Kefka creeps me out, Kuja creeps me out.
  3. I'll vote for the one without the gender problems.Oath to Order 06:11, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
  4. SCM: Kefka's biggest crime was destroying the world. Kuja's biggest crime was being a crossdresser.
  5. Crazyswordsman: I don't hate Kuja. I just like Kefka better. He IS Kefka after all.
  6. Gaming-King:I'am just going to vote for Kefka.
  7. Hexed: The evil laugh, and that plus half the time he's pulling the finger on ya.
  8. MK Clown>drag queen
  9. BlueHighwind: Kuja, despite the best of intentions was just a wanna-be villain. This guy is actually entertaining and fun to be around. He goes with his heart, instead of just spouting out rip-off Shakespearean dialogue. And I love all versions of the Joker.
  10. Roman King: Kuja would get destroyed.
  11. Triforcel: I have yet to play IX, but Kefka is just rggh! You wanna throttle that guy all the time.
  12. ChiefKakashi: Because I know he's a man.
  13. Hiddensilver: While Kuja proved that you don't have to be straight to amass monumental power and nearly destroy the world, he actually had motive. Kefka not only destroyed the world, he destroyed the world because it was his inclination. That just reeks of pure evil.
  14. Henryacores: Kuja wears THONGS! Kefka is a clown. Clowns are better villans than thong users overall, and Kefka doesn't escape the rule.
  15. Zario: DANCING MAD!!!!!!!!!!!
  16. Blykus: I think both of them are great villains, but I like Kefka just that much more. Besides, Kuja didn't accomplish half of what Mister Palazzo did.
  18. Superaeon: Ima go with the guy who pretty much ended the world, plus hes a clown. GODDAMN CLOWNS ARE CREEPY!!!!!
  19. Sjoerd777:Had a hard time on this one.Kuja is just plain cool, however Kefka is better as a villian.He reformed the world, became a god, got his own cult, and is still 53 cards short of a deck.Plus:Dancing Mad. Kefka wins.
  20. JARIITX:Gotta go with Kefka. When it comes to antagonists, I prefer someone who looks like a member of ICP rather than a gender-confused genome.
  21. Aramis: Nothing can beat the sound of hundreds of voices screaming in Unisone. Enough said.
  22. Dancing Mad. Need I say more? Yes, probably, so I will. He is also the only villian in Final Fantasy to complete his ultimate goal. (enlighten me if I am wrong here)RedMage
  23. VitoRyu: I would list all the reasons Kefka was better than ANY FF villain, but sadly I'd never stop writing.
  24. dudutsai: Kuja had some good lines, but Kefka had so many more. As a villain, Kefka was a lot more straightforward and was easier to understand for my 5th grade self.
  25. Super Sephiroth: My 3rd favourite villain
  26. Chocolancer: Even though IX is my favorite game, I always thought Kuja was a Sephiroth wannabe (with all that talk of destroying the world and getting all the power). But Kefka was an original villain! He's evil, achieved godliness, is a wacko, and has a manic laugh sound effect of his own!
  27. tomtheroadkill: I don't vote for the cross-dresser whose sex we don't even know for certain (presumably male?)! I vote for Kefka. He's a nutcase!
  28. BlitzSage: Kuja's good, but he can't beat the Psycho Clown.
  29. Ivalicia: Kuja is a good villain, but he's not competition for Kefka.
  30. Mizuno Mahou: Kefka is a humorous villain and a better villain overall. Kuja just felt like he was one of those cookie cutter villains who wanted to control the world just because he felt like it. Much as I liked IX, I felt that Kuja was a somewhat boring villain. I even liked Garland better from that game.
  31. Skoot85:Kefka is pure evil. He has pushed the lines of the status of a villian. Kuja just does not come off as evil as Kefka. He seems too human while kefka is Pure EVIL!
  32. FakeFreedom: One sided fight here... Kefka is the best example of a heartless villain. Kuja is nothing but a kid mad at the world because they didn't accept his sexual orientation. (Wasn't he also just like a clone of Zidane too? They both look pretty homosexual to me.)
  33. Thanos6 05:24, 9 March 2008 (UTC): Anyone who votes for Kuja is a chapter from a self-help booklet.
  34. Fyrmer: I liked Kuja, but Kefka will always be the greatest FF villain ever in my book. He's psychotic, nihilistic, he thinks nothing of commiting acts of genocide, yet he still gets annoyed about a little sand on his boots. Hilarious.
  35. Otens: Why even bother with this fight? We know who will win.
  36. Dark Paladin: Most villains in the Final Fantasy series tried to destroy the world or achieve godlike status. Kefka did both and he was just a clown.
  37. MCMLXXXIV: I won't tell you what I really think about Kuja, but Kefka gets my vote.
  38. SiK0: I definitely have to pick Kefka. Such a creepy evil clown man.

Anonymous votes[edit source]

  1. I hate hate hate hate Hate Hate Hate HATEHATEHATEHATEHATEHATE!!!!!! Kuja!
  2. Troy: Probably my two favorite FF games. FFVI has a special place in my heart and Kefka, in my opinion is the best villain in the series.
  3. Kefka is one of the best villains in the series. Not many villains can claim they did what he did. Not only did he thwart the heroes once or twice, he was a REGULAR human who literally became a god, absorbing the power of the three warring gods. I mean seriously, if a villain wants to become a god he's usually thwarted right before, but not in this case. AND he wrecked the entire world. As a villain, Kefka is incredible.
  4. Kefka leaves a more lasting impression.
  5. I agree that Kuja is an underrated villian,and FFIX is underrated as well. But Kefka is one of, if not the greatest villians in history. His dialogue is amazing and his story(his rise to power) is very well told. He is the most unique FF villian in the series and one of the main reasons FFVI is considered one of the best in the series. Also, storywise, Kefka was if I'm not mistaken the only villian to achieve his goal of world domination, and he became god-like. Kefka gets my vote.
  6. I don't dislike Kuja, but I'd have to vote for Kefka.
  7. Let's face it: Kefka is simply the great-granddaddy of the evil laugh.
  8. Wow this is the first time im voting for someone on this side. Anyway Kuja in his regular form...really isnt that cool to me. Trance Kuja could have competed though...But Kefka has humor, not to mention magitek implants, which in my opinion is way cooler. Oh yea, Kefka is the ORIGINAL angel of death, he became a god. Kuja just went into a trance, not to say taht isnt cool but...( I also would like to point out, Kuja's votes are mostly fan girls, like the last battle with Tifa with Fanboys.)
  9. WHO THE HECK IS KUJA!!!???(not to sound stupid)but kefka is like a "fallen angle" dude right?
  10. Steel Sentry: Always bet on Kefka. Always. He is just that awesome.
  11. The best villan ever! Better than all the other game, movie, etc villans combined. KEFKA RULES!
  12. Im not a big fans of ether of these 2 but kefka is definatly better.
  13. Random Anonymous Person: I loved IX, but Kuja didn't do that much for me. Kefka, on the other hand, made his game.
  14. As much as I love Kuja, Kefka is the better villian. He achieved his evil goal longer than the other bad guys in the series. However, if it was a one on one match, Kuja may very well give Kefka a run for his money.

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Aww. I like Amano's picture of Kuja better than that Dissidia picture. And it didn't take long for the comments about Kuja's sexuality to start... --Alcaeus

I wasn't questioning its sexuality. I was questioning its gender. Or lack there of. Oath to Order 06:17, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
Maybe it's just the way I'm reading it. Kuja is a guy. --Alcaeus
Yes, yes he is. Kuja is a guy. A very pretty guy. Drake Clawfang
Yes, poor guy. I think this might be a one-sided fight...but it's probably to early to tell. That Draw vs Materia turned out too be a pretty good fight even though Draw is an abomination. --Alcaeus

EmuMaster- I know I've voted for the losing side here, but I voted for the guy who deserves it more. Oh, and to those of you questioning his sexuality, note: Kuja's the manliest man in Final Fantasy, save for Auron himself. And you just don't beat Auron.

TA, the next fight is Balther vs. Cloud. It wasn't my decision, it's the ladies' light. --Crazyswordsman 07:10, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

CSM, you mean this isn't a democracy? (Gasp!) Besides, this fight is going to be ridiculously lopsided. It kind of throws out any rationale behind it. (Not that we ever voted anyway and not

that we are bound by opinions anyway.) TacticAngel 07:34, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

I want to be fair to MMIL. --Crazyswordsman 07:36, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
You needn't explain it to me. I don't actually have any serious intention of going purely off of user votes. --TacticAngel 07:45, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
I actually think it'll be quite interesting. All the users choosing Balthier and the anons choosing their beloved Cloud... --Crazyswordsman 08:03, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
Well, I know I'm voting for the Leading Man. Who else? SCM 09:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
AnonyMan: If it's Balthier/Cloud next week, I'm going with Balth as well.Although I'm not a real fan of Balthier, I get a feeling that the scales won't ridiculously tip in Cloud's favor in that match.
Actually, I think the fight would lop-sided the other way. But I think it would only be fair to have it if it's in response to the last fight. -- ChiefKakashi 21:00, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Props on whoever suggested this fight. It's a good one. I was actually thinking about this about a week ago. Rabid Biscuit 14:07, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

I would also like to add that Kefka is one of the easiest bosses in FF history. Only Yu Yevon is easier (And that's because you can't die). Even Ultimecia is able to attack me more than once. And I was the one who suggested this. --Alcaeus

It's true, Kefka as a boss, sucked. Kaiser Dragon, now *there's* a boss! Drake Clawfang
No the Emperor from FFII is way easier. Two swings with the Blood Sword (an Item that Final Boss made the very dumb descion to keep right outside his door), and he's gone for good. --BlueHighwind 20:06, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
Drake, did you forget Heartless Angel? Or were you too overleveled when you went through the final dungeon? :P It is true the Kefka's first 3 incarnations (those tiers of weird non-related-to-Kefka-in-any-way-at-all entities) were complete pushovers. 8bit BlackMage 22:54, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
fastest way to kill Kefka: Spam Ultima. Oath to Order 22:55, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

I would like to mention that all of the arguments talking about how Kefka pretty much blew up the world, therefore, he is better, are basically moot. Kuja pretty much did the same thing. I mean, he was about to destroy the friggin' source of all life. Not to mention that he blew up an entire planet (Terra). So I'd say they're pretty well tied there, don'tcha think? --Rabid Biscuit 21:50, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

I'd say there's some truth in your words Biscuit. He accessed an weird area which house(and was prepared to destroy) the source of all existence, people need to give him more props. Only thing Kefka has over him is the fact for how powerful he got, he was about to kick the bucket soon.AnonyMan 01:52, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

It seems that everyone on this site thinks that pretty boys with long hair are all sexless or actually women. What's up with that. I had very long hair last year, my skin is very fair, and I've been classified as a pretty boy before. Granted, I don't walk around wearing that, but come on, people using this comment "Kuja looks like a chick. At least Kefka isn't androgonus!" as their justification for a vote has to really go take some classes and get a nice boost to intelligence, or just actually give your vote some thought! I don't care if you like Kefka better than Kuja, but at least have a decent reason why! -- Drake

Tell me about it. He's actually a good character, and definitely not androgynous. I don't think preference should ever be based entirely upon masculinity, because honestly, neither one is exactly a super manly-man. --RB

Drake1, you are so wrong. It takes way more than long hair to be classafied as androgonus. Take Sephiroth. He has long hair, but he's a manly man. Kuja wears a "man" bikini (no room for boobs), and has a girly face. Those are just a few things that make him effeminate. -- ChiefKakashi 02:40, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
I'm not trying to go off base here, but I don't think Sephiroth is a shining example of a manly-look. Wearing a coat with a Katana doesn't make you more masculine, he still has a girly babyface. Which only gets worse as time passes new technology to "enhance" his appearance.––AnonyMan 02:49, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
Yes, but you can immediately tell he's a man. -- ChiefKakashi 02:51, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
Maybe so, but if you put him(or Any of FF's andorgynous "pretty" boys for that matter) in Kuja's attire you'll get as many scratching their heads over it as they were with Kuja himself. -- AnonyMan 02:56, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
Agreed. Sephiroth is, while obviously male, not a particularly good example of Final Fantasy's brimming masculinity. Now someone like Auron...sure, he's not a villain, but...he's a man's man. --RB
I'd have to disagree with AnonyMan, or anyone else who thinks Sephiroth isn't a "manly-man". Sure his face won't say much about it, but I mean just look at him when he is incased in mako, or any of the time he is without his coat. I'd say thats enough proof there. -- Kyoku Sefirosu (UTC)

I just want to make this conversation as awkward as possible. ;) The bigger the guy's penis, the more masculine he is. --Alcaeus

Well, you sure made it awkward. SCM
What the fuck are you talking about? Barret is hung like an elf! (I can make things awkward too, don't try me) --BlueHighwind 13:06, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

@Alcaeus: You remind me of one of my friends. Also, where did Barret come from BH? RedMage

Well barret is about the manliest character in FF. and since when did he have a little dick? come on hes black.--

FakeFreedom Well, this turned out to be a pretty boring fight. -- ChiefKakashi 18:45, 9 March 2008 (UTC) Yeah, no flame wars. No threats. No excessive yelling. Oath to Order 18:50, 9 March 2008 (UTC) Balthier probably got a big penis because hes the leading man and leading mens need big penis to lead and ladies follow him because he got a big penis.who they gonna have sex with?Vann?Basch?Hell no!Moogle king 20:12, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Oh...God...I hope you don't get a test for that comment...Now things are awkward... -- ChiefKakashi 20:23, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

I win,but i don't feel good.....Moogle king 20:26, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Everyone who supported this fight voted for Kefka...Meh, I didn't think this fight would be THIS one-sided. Guess I was wrong. Anyway, according to some pictures I've seen on the internet, EVERY FF guy has a big dick. Of course, Tidus and Vaan have vaginas. Minwu has the biggest dick since he's Arabian. ;) --Alcaeus

Vaan isn't on the same level as Tidus. Unlike Tidus's, he's cool I don't get why so many people hate on Vaan? He's the only other good protagonist in the series.AnonyMan 05:15, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

Can it be Balthier vs. Cloud tiem nao? Rabid Biscuit 21:51, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

That fight is going to be even more one-sided than this fight. Then again, according to my Playstation Magazine Cloud received the most votes for greatest character, with Tifa and Sephiroth close behind. Aeris, Zack and Vincent were also apparently close calls. And this was a poll for the greatest character in the ENTIRE series, not just FF7. --Alcaeus
In retrospect I was mistaken. Against any other FFXII character, Baltheir would deasily dominate, that's definitely not going to be the case here. Cloud's sadly going to murder him. Who knows by some twist of fate Cloud won't amass a crapload of votes.AnonyMan 21:55, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
Bah. Cloud will probably get almost all the anon votes, but Balthier will probably get most of the user votes. --ChiefKakashi 22:01, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
I dunno, I think Balthier has a pretty good chance. I mean, sure, the newbish anons will be all Cloud-mongering, but...anyone with a brain can see that Balthier is a better character. --Rabid Biscuit 01:55, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Yumiko: Why is everyone against Cloud... T_T. It seems that the newer generation of games (and characters) get the votes because the graphics are better. Well I think that the story for vii is better than xii. ^^

Actually, I like Cloud. I really don't get why people hate him so much. I just think Balthier's better. -- ChiefKakashi 01:32, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Yay for homophobic remarks. FakeFreedom even had the balls to call Kuja and Zidane homosexuals. The cross-dresser and gender-confused comments are also homophobic. Comment if you think I'm being too sensitive. --Alcaeus

A little. Plenty of strait guys cross-dress too. And how are gender-confused comments homophobic? -- ChiefKakashi 01:58, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
[1] Still, cross-dressing is generally associated with the gay community. --Alcaeus
I don't. -- ChiefKakashi 02:12, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
hey that's my opinion. Zidane, great character he is, just doesn't come off as being very manly to me. same applies for vaan. I thought Zidane was a girl for a moment when I started playing ffix.-FakeFreedom

Week 58: Rydia v. Tifa[edit source]

Tifa Hot-.jpg

43½ v. 32½
Tifa Hot-.jpg
Pure, unadulterated fan service.

Votes for Rydia[edit source]

  1. SmegHead: I refuse to comment on who is hotter out of the two, since the debate as I see it is who would win in a straight-up battle. Suffice it to say, I vote Rydia, since all her magic and summoning is learned natually and Tifa has to rely on little marbles for her power.
  2. Aramis: FFVII isn't even THAT great... besides, Rydia is hot too. And she didn't even need oversized boobs to prove that...
  3. Roman King: I got to go with Rydia on this one.
  4. Diablocon: Rydia! Unlike some people, I realise that a woman's chest size isn't the only thing that can make them sexy. Also, she has Mist Dragon.
  5. Falbub: Voting for a fellow summoner here. Tifa's cool, but Rydia's cooler.
  6. Arausio: Rydia isn't pointless fan service thats why(come on why be attracted to either of them they are just streams of code)
  7. dudutsai: I don't really like Rydia as much as SOME people do, but I never liked Tifa at all. Also, HIMBO's vote makes me sad.
  8. Bahamut = Pwnage Order
  9. Pikmin Master: I'm going for the green one. Knowing the contestants and how many people are fans of said contestants, there's no way the Mercy Rule will be applied. Plus, Tifa was annoyance after she entered Cloud's mind. Rydia was an interesting character to me, having a hate for fire as a child. If I were to judge by appearance, I'd just leave...
  10. Drake Clawfang:Just for the record, I've had a Rydia vs. Tifa poll for a couple weeks now on my user page, and Rydia is winning so far. Anyway, no offense to Tifa, she's cute, but Rydia is Rydia, and no FF character is hotter than Rydia.
  11. Bartz235: As DrakeClawfang said Rydia is Rydia. She's just all around awesome. Tifa sucks in battle without her "little marbles" and by using those "little marbles" she loses HP. Rydia would've probably been the "sex symbol" of FF but a lot more people played FFVII before IV and most probably haven't even played IV(Most as in the world not wiki users). I mean Tifa isn't bad at all, and this was a really REALLY hard decision but I got go with Rydia. Also as dudutsai said Himbo's vote dissapoints me. That's really pathetic.
  12. Zario: She is more cooler, and has Summoning and Black Mage abilities. She is also hotter too.
  13. Blykus: This was definitely a hard decision to make, but my vote goes for the old school.
  14. The Hexed: It's because of the image on Clawfang's userpage...
  15. Crazyswordsman: What did you expect? Me to vote for Tifa? Sorry, but I have taste in women. And Tifa can't do anything naturally. For everyone who brought up summoning and magic from Tifa, she can't use it naturally. She has to be artificially enhanced with magic through materia, unlike Rydia, who uses it naturally.
  16. PhoenixDew: This was a tough decision, but I have to vote for Rydia for her creative look and fashion. How many other heroines wear green? None! But white is all the rage. Plus I tend to side with Summoners/mages. Character-wise, it is hard for Rydia to compete with Tifa just because FF VII had more story, i.e. more dialogue. But what there was for Rydia was classic, and the moment she returns is suspenseful and dynamic. Gotta love Rydia!
  17. AnonyMan: Rydia, not as boring or overestimated. And what's with people criticizing Rydia's abilities? Other than sparingly used Limit breaks everyone can be the same, Tifa's not even that good of a bralwer. Let Zell be in a movie, actually scratch that...he'd get the AC Reno treament, even though he's better(and Reno was cooler in AC)
  18. Faethin: Ten minute break. I like Tifa. I love Rydia.
  19. LDBAMC: I like Final Fantasy IV. A lot. I like Rydia. A lot. Perhaps even more so. While it's true that she can't survive anything more than a goblin sneezing at her, she's pretty much totally kickass in everything else. Seriously, a black mage/summoner with green hair? That's a winner at first sight for me.
  20. bob this is possibly the hardst competitions ever but i like rydia better because she has a better plot in my opinion
  21. Otherarrow: Tough vote. Both are good characters, but Rydia is a summoner/black mage which is better than any monk.
  22. 8bit_BlackMage: After mulling it over, I've decided to go with Rydia. Very very very close call for me, but in the end I had to choose the summoner over the monk.
  23. Kaiser Dragon: Hmm, a girl who is innocent and has the natural power to summon a legion of hell beasts and other such creatures under her complete control, or the idiotic cheap harlot with a BILLION STDs and implants whom I hate with the white hot intensity of a thousand suns? No contest for me. Rydia.
  24. MK WTF DRAKE!?!?! RYDIA IS A FULL GROWN WOMAN!!! Times passes faster in the land of summons so even though she was only gone for a while, she was able to grow up normal. Kinda like with DBZ and that time compression room thing. Summoner/Black mage > Monk. Tifa is the WORST MONK in FF.
  25. Phoenix Rising: Rydia is the the best summoner to ever appear in any FF game, while Tifa is a mediocre fighter, at best. Rydia winds this, hands down.

Anonymous votes[edit source]

  1. LuvLuv G - Hmmmm....Black Summoner, or Monk with Overdrives......I'd say Black Summoner hands down. I'm also partial to magic users, and not some big-titted freak who can't even beat a dundering musclehead.
  2. Green Ninja - G's right. She is like what is unofficially called a "Black Summoner" and would win. She has the actual trust of the summons she's obtained. Tifa just picked up the Materia after fighting bosses or found it laying around. That's my bit, take it or leave it.
  3. EmuMaster: Well, my penis says Rydia, my usefullness meter says Rydia, my character-development center says Rydia and my pure, unadulterated BAMF compass says... Rydia. She has some of the best character development in a Final Fantasy game to date, especially as far as non-central hero roles go. She can nuke everything in a five mile radius or pick them off with weaker but no less useful spells to conserve mp. She uses WHIPS, for god's sake, and doesn't look like a whore while using them or anything, which seems to be a common theme in female whip-users.
  4. Rydia is as SEXY AS HELL, as hot a Tifa is I just love Rydia. If she was real I would sleep with her in a heartbeat... now i'm starting to sound like Drake clawfang arent I? well good, I love you Rydia.
  5. Random Anonymous Person: Rydia is marginally cooler than Tifa. Also, I do prefer IV to VII.
  6. Hyo-Rydia she's just amazingly better, though I admit Tifa is BIG competition. This is a good match but Rydia better win!!
  7. mdarkcecil - No contest, Rydia has magic and summons, Tifa's just got her fists. Plus, I think FF7 is over-rated.
  8. My vote goes to the old school. I'm going to leave abilities and things OUT of this because really you could be pitting Rydia against "recruitable peon from Final Fantasy Tactics" and you'd run up against the same wall of "well, they can learn anything due to the character creation/customization system." Rydia has more "bite" as a character and could probably talk Tifa down before the fight even started. This girl doesn't take anybody's shit and wouldn't sit idly by if, say, Cecil started acting strange.
  9. Wow this is close. Gotta give my love to Rydia! Tifa isnt nearly as cool and badass as people say. Everything she did revolved around Cloud, Cloud, Cloud.
  10. Rydia's better than Tifa and Summoners are better than Monks plus Tifa isn't one of my favorite characters in the series unlike Rydia my 5th favorite FF character.
  11. This was a tough one for me...But I'll have to go with Rydia. I use her far more then I used Tifa in Final Fantasy VII. Looks has nothing to do with this battle I agree, but I can't help but find Rydia more attractive.
  12. Definitely Rydia. She doesn't need Cecil or any other guy (*cough* Cloud *cough*) to kick some serious ass.
  13. I'd have to go with Rydia. Tifa's overrated and honestly, most people like her just because she has big jugs and a short skirt. Don't lie, you people know who you are. Rydia was awesome even in the days when she was just a portrait; now she's even better. Besides, Rydia set the stage not only for summoners, but for green hair as well. What did Tifa do, honestly?
  14. Summoner beats monk easily!
  15. Goes down to my which FF I like better so Rydia!'

Votes for Tifa[edit source]

  1. Huh? Probably is the Rose window. I always liked rose window designs.--N/A
  2. Duh...Who else?! Tifa is Tifa. Not only she can do everything Rydia does, but she's also hotter and a better character overall. Henryacores
  3. Tifa can use all of Rydia's Magic, and she has more physical power, and she's a better Summoner with "Knights of the Round". Plus I have to go with the one that's cuter. --BlueHighwind 13:00, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
  4. I'm not a huge fan of either one, but I have more experience with Tifa than with Rydia. Kind of a no-brainer, actually. --Rabid Biscuit
  5. I gotta go with Tifa. VII was the first game (Final Fantasy or otherwise) that I really got into and obsessed with, so any battle with a character from VII is going to a battle in which I give my support to whatever is from VII. Plus, I don't really understand the obsession with Rydia. She's like seven and all you pervs think she's the hottest thing. If she's seven, she shouldn't have boobs! Tifa is twenty, and therefore deserving of her mammoth chesticles. --HIMBO
  6. Adam Mcduck: I've never liked Rydia that much. The DS Rydia looks OK, but still not great. Tifa is a better character (better history, etc), can use all Rydia's spells and is physically strong too.
  7. Rydia never got to ride a motorbike RedMage
  8. Chief: How could I be so late?
  9. MYVizm 19:21, 28 February 2008 (UTC): Tifa's just flat out better in my opinion.
  10. Darkling692 I vote for the biger Boobs!!!
  11. Moogle_kingi vote for tifa because she can pummel rydia with her chest and have a wet tshirt contest too at the same time!boobs over mind.
  12. FakeFreedomTifa cause she can fight without any help.
  13. Acropolis Failure to vote for Tifa makes you a Communist. And the Tifa/Loz scene in A.C. is incredible.
  14. Triforcel I'm gonna go with the one without green hair.
  15. Alcaeus: I'm voting for the one with the bigger breasts (it's also a pity vote since she's losing).
  16. Some Color Mage: My mind is conflicted. ARGHHH! But cause I've played VII and not IV (subject to change when I can get my hands on the DS version), Tifa it is.
  17. Gaming-King: I'am go with Tifa because she is so much better then Rydia because Tifa have more attack power she can use magic and Summoner and that why she better then Rydia by the way who votes for a person with green hair
  18. Superaeon35: Tifa gunna open up a can whupass on the green girl!
  19. BigSlurp: Actually there are a number of comments in this poll that sadden me. On both sides. Both are cute, so what. So to dwell on that too much is silly. I also dislike the comments cutting on Materia. Its not any character's fault from FFVII that Materia is how they chose to do 90% of the magic. I imaginge that if Rydia were in that game, she'd have to use Materia too, and would be more akin to Yuffie, in other words, useless. I thought Rydia was a decent character, and maybe it was the fact that she was in an easier game, but I never got Rydia's hit power maxed out. I had Tifa hitting max power like 3/4 the way into the game. So I am going with Tifa this time around.
  20. Masamune: Recently I've tried to be somewhat less of a FFVII fanboy, but I still can't bring myself to vote against Tifa. Plus, I think there are more FFVII haters & FFIV lovers than vice versa, so I'll vote for the underdog.
  21. Kyoku Sefirosu: Because Tifa is a great character overall, she is supportive caring and pretty much an overall good person. I'm not saying Rydia isn't either, but Tifa is Tifa, end of story
  22. The jumper 10:30, 1 March 2008 (UTC) I'm persuaded that a world without boobs is a spoil world... And I prefer 32 bit boobs.
  23. Terra Homing: Tifa cause she can fight without any help.
  24. Xadren: Tifa because I love her attitude, her strength, her love for Cloud. She is a complete character, in all her point of view.
  25. Drake: Okay, who put up this fight because if it wasn't TA, I want to kick his ass! This has been done as an argument or a poll too many times! I'd like to see a new fight soon, possible involving a character who isn't spoken about in a talk template, more than four user pages, and never included in the same poll. How about a real fight next week, like Delita versus (I don't know who would be a goodmatchup for him, only Ramza I guess) uh, Vossler, both plotters? Nope, Delita is much more honorable than Vossler. Next week we should just have a big poll to decided who will face Delita in two weeks! Also, Tifa's storline is much more developed than Rydia's (who is my favorite character in IV after Kain) and she isn't a child stuck in an adult body! Not that has anything to do with my vote, I just wanted to say it to piss off Clawfang. Anywho, she also has a much bigger personality, and due to a longer game there is much more time to get to know her character and for it to really develop. Rydia has the scene where she attacks you, she wakes up in the inn, when she gets attacked by leviathan, when she returns, and when going to the Land Of Summons. That's it. You actually get to play as Tifa. THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE WAY THE CHARACTER'S LOOK!
  26. SS:A good fight. finally, something worth voting in.
  27. Zordrac: What the f*ck is wrong with you people? This type of bullshit has got to stop!
  28. Sephiroth: This was tough for me, it came down to which one was my fave FF
  29. Ivalicia: It says this is a fan service poll. Rydia seems like hitting your adopted daughter...
  30. gokus789: I vote for Tifa mostly because I love huge boobs and she's what I want my girlfriend to look like. Also she's cool and a great fighter
  31. ShadowLaguna: I just seem to like Tifa more.
  32. tomtheroadkill: Don't get me wrong. I like Rydia, but I like Tifa more.
  33. MCMLXXXIV: What Tom said.
  34. Etch: gotta go with tifa, never played ffiv so i wouldnt know
  35. Ctaylor503: If you had said Tifa vs Terra, I might've had a hard time making a decision.
  36. TacticAngel: I can't get past the annoying little girl.

Anonymous votes[edit source]

  1. humm Tifa!!
  2. Rydia is great and as sexy as hell, but so is Tifa. This is a really hard battle because they are both so great, but i'm going to have to go with Tifa on this one, she is like the Final Fantasy sex symbol. Great job who thought of this battle it's been the best in a long time since a lot of boring ones and was really hard and not very one sided at all, great job:).
  3. While Rydia is hot, and I like the color green; I'm gonna have to vote for Tifa. Mostly because she's just as hot as Rydia, but also because I prefer physical strength above magic; and let's face it there's nothing hotter than a sexy woman beating up on things. Since someone asked for a better image, there's one here, Tifa. It's from KH2 though. Just go to the render section.
  4. Troy: I think that Tifa would win. Magic users are usually weak against physical attacks and that is Tifa's speciality. Also Tifa can use all types of magic through the use of materia.
  5. Magic & Strength. Why choose one when you can choose both. so what if the magic comes from magic marbles? She can beat people down with her fists and no weapons, plus any other magicTifa all the way! plus, she is hotter than hell!
  6. If you vote for Rydia just because she's hot, You might be a pedophile.
  7. Rainacide - My vote goes to...Tifa, she can beat a motherfucker's ass with her hands, legs, head & whatever else she can think of. She got them big ol' titties. & she can use magic. Rydia is cool and all but she's only magic-wise, not physical-wise too.
  8. I will go with Tifa, sice she is a great physical fighter, and if you equip materia on her, you can have her as a great Black Mage or Summoner...I recognize that it is a game feature (Final Fantasy VII) advantage but that's life...Besides she is much hotter than Rydia.
  9. Tifa!
  10. The world needs more female Physical fighters.
  11. Yumiko: Usually I would vote for the mage but since both can use magic that wont make sense. Tifa's class is like a monk and I always had a knack for monks. :) (Whys is people voting for who's hotter. This sites member's are composed of males but still... sheesh)
  12. She can kick your ass. Adn she doesnt need any lame pansey magic to do so.
  13. Coin flip. Turned up tails. Tifa won.
  14. Tifa is way hotter.
  15. Tifa made me like console RPGs. If it weren't for Tifa I wouldn't even be looking at FF related stuff today. And childhood friend archetype FTW.
  16. TIFA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! rydia has got nothing on tifa.....tifa and all the final fantsy 7 characters could own anyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! FF7 forever!!!!!!!!!

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

The Hexed: I refuse to vote. Damn conflicting sides of my head.

Notice how like half of these votes are in to describe how much more sexier the one girl is over the other...Wow you guys, wow, but I think that's a bit offset because the tag line DOES say pure unadulterated fan service so I can take the fact that they have the authority to do that AzureDrake 16:23, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

@Diablo: Have you noticed that everyone who has voted for Tifa has voted for more than her cupsize?--ChiefKakashi 19:17, 28 February 2008 (UTC) Can we get a better picture for Tifa? Let's be fair, Rydia's picture very much overshadows Tifa at the moment. Drake Clawfang

Also, to Himbo, and to anyone else, Rydia is NOT seven years old. Time passes quicker in the realm of the monsters, and Rydia aged at an accelerated rate. It's like the theory of relativity. Rydia was seven, then she went to another world where time passes quicker and came back as a woman that I personally put around 19-20 or so. It's not complicated, people. Drake Clawfang
Thanks for clearing that up, Drake. Her being 20-ish makes it slightly less creepy that the majority of males here are drooling over her, especially since the majority of males here are like 15, lol =] --Himbo 21:18, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
NP Himbo, it's just that another user who shall remain nameless keeps saying she's a kid and it pisses me off. And CSM also makes a good point I thought of, but to be fair CSM, from the sounds of it none of the VII cast can use magic naturally, so it kinda chalks up to a plotline difference. I agree with you though. Drake Clawfang
*coughDMDcough* Oath to Order 00:36, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
Too close to call for me. I may be new here, but this is one battle I can't judge since both have identical sex appeal and (with materia for Tifa) identical abilities as far as magic and summons go. JARIITX 00:01, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Oooooo, it's neck and neck at 16! We finally get a close fight! Drake Clawfang

I will be upset if Tifa loses, but this would be an honorable loss.--ChiefKakashi

AnonyMan: Darn, I wish it would have been Delita vs Ramza, they're actually interesting. Tifa and Rydia together are barely cooler than Tidus.

BlueHighwind: Unless they're "together" together. In which case no male or female would be able to avert their eyes.
BH, that is the most lovely picture since your Tifa-Aeris christmas pic :D. No offense to Tifa, she *is* hot, I just think Rydia is hotter. Drake Clawfang

BlueHighwind: Huh, Tifa is a winning. Did not see that one coming.

Alcaeus: This fight is going to end on time, right? If no one knows yet, I have the sexiest guy fight on my userpage. I'm pretty sure that no one cares though, since everyone completely ignored the idea because they are too busy masturbating to Tifa/Rydia porn.

Sorry Alcaeus, but we're mostly heterosexual males here. Too bad too, we really need more women. --BlueHighwind 20:05, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
I agree with Alcaeus! If he and I and the, like, three girls on the Wiki can vote on who the better female is (which is obviously mostly decided on who you think is hotter), then why can't y'all vote on who is the more attractive male? It doesn't mean you want to bone them. I just don't understand why if girls and gay men can appreciate and comment on the beauty of other women, why can't straight men do the same for males? --Himbo
I only didn't vote in Alcaeus's poll because it left out Sepiroth. I'm not one who suffers homosexual panics. Only gay guys who can't except themselves do that. --BlueHighwind 21:15, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, I just took a look at it, and it didn't seem very comprehensive. There were a few guys I would have liked seeing in there. But I voted for the hottest out of the available options (Balthier, duhhh) --Himbo
I realized that when I created it that I didn't include a lot of guys. I must admit that I picked the guys that I'm most attracted to (and then added Locke there for absolutely no reason). Hmmm. Maybe I'll remove the current polls and just create a poll with every FF guy. --Alcaeus

I can't believe people are still saying Tifa does these things better than Rydia does after I posted my rebuttal to that argument. --Crazyswordsman 19:19, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Because your argument doesn't address the main issue. Tifa can use better Spells then Rydia, you haven't proven that wrong. Materia or not, she still can use better spells then Rydia. When does Rydia use "Knights of the Round"? Never. --BlueHighwind 20:03, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
Okay, seriously, VII aside, what kind of name for a summon is "Knights of the Round"? Yes, the spell itself is cool and does massive damage, but what kind of summon is that? Bahamut, there's a summon everyone gets. And Tifa being able to summon KotR? Well technically, I believe due to Materia *everyone* can learn KotR, thereby limiting Tifa's specialness in being able to do so. In order for a character's actions to be cool, it has to be something no other character in their game can do. Rydia summons, that's what she does alone, and yes, she uses black but no that's not unique to her. Tifa has her limit breaks. So in a battle of abilities, it's Rydia's summons versus Tifa's limit breaks. Also, seems the vote is tied again. Drake Clawfang
But Rydia still has to buy most of her Magic. She doesn't learn it naturally either. --BlueHighwind 21:15, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
What are you talking about BH? Rydia learns all her spells via levelling up except Fire, Sylph, Asura, Leviathan and Bahamut. It's in FFV that you have to buy spells. Diablocon 21:28, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
See kiddies, never assume anything. Espicially do not infer anything based upon long term trends and observations (you buy Magic in all the other old games). What kind of an idiot would do that? Even if I was wrong, those are all the best Spells. What's a Summoner without Bahamut? --BlueHighwind 21:33, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
Rydia doesn't "buy" Asura, Leviathan, or Bahamut, she kicks their asses and they bestow their powers unto her. Hey, if you count up all the votes, including anons, it's tied up (currently). I still really don't know who to vote for. I've never seen Tifa in 3-D form till now. Can't decide >< 8bit BlackMage 22:44, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
And BH is the one making the assumptions here. Still, take away any of Tifa's enhancements and Rydia still wins. --Crazyswordsman 23:00, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
Put Rydia down to when you first get her, and Tifa wins. That's a meaningless question. In this hypothetical battle, both are as strong as they can possibly be in both their respective games. Otherwise it is not fair for either character. --BlueHighwind 23:03, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
I'm just going to say this argument is getting repetitive and stupid. Oath to Order 23:08, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
Everything on this website is like that. I just like arguing things. --BlueHighwind 23:10, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
That was...random. Yes, Tifa would win in that situation. But we're talking about adult Rydia, who knows all these awesome abilities NATURALLY. Oh, and did I mention Tifa can only use these summons very --Crazyswordsman 23:16, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
An Adroid may be nothing with its metal parts, but he can stick kick your ass. Tifa is still more powerful, how she gained that strength is irrelevent. --BlueHighwind 00:36, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Who chose to put this fight up by the way? Damn fine choice that man, damn fine. Also, doesn't abriviating Knights of the Round down to KotR remind anyone else of KotoR? Or am I the lone warsy on the wikki? RedMage

Thank me. This fight was my idea :) And yes, KotR is a lot like KotOR.--ChiefKakashi 01:16, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Jenerix525 This is my response to ChiefKakashi's earlier statement ("Have you noticed that everyone who has voted for Tifa has voted for more than her cupsize?"). It was probably made before these votes, but still, they just arrived a little late.

Darkling692 I vote for the biger Boobs!!!

Moogle_kingi vote for tifa because she can pummel rydia with her chest and have a wet tshirt contest too at the same time!boobs over mind.

Alcaeus: I'm voting for the one with the bigger breasts (it's also a pity vote since she's losing).

The jumper 10:30, 1 March 2008 (UTC) I'm persuaded that a world without boobs is a spoil world... And I prefer 32 bit boobs.

Notice that the entirity of their argument seems to be: "Tifa has (bigger/more-graphically-detailed/bigger/gigantic) boobs!"

You jealous?RedMage
Do not underestimate the power of breasts. Men will agree to anything - no matter how outrageous - to see them: "My best freind that I've know since kindergarten is an asshole", "I'm interested in your thoughts and what you have to say", "I'm willing to make a commitment", "Its over between me and my ex-girlfreind", "Will you marry me?" etc. All bullshit. In fact our entire society is based upon impressing the opposite sex enough so that you can feel some boobies. --BlueHighwind 16:08, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
My comment was more of a joke. Anyway, I prefer Rydia over Tifa even though I voted for Tifa. --Alcaeus
Yes, I made that comment, 5 minutes later, we get...those votes.-_---ChiefKakashi 04:06, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

The lead now has tipped to Tifa, with 30 1/2 votes over Rydia's 27. It's still a very close match, and anyone can take home the trophy of "most voted for by a bunch of losers." Let's watch and see how this concludes! -- Drake

Why the bitterness Drake? Do you not like women? Or do you just have something against people who care about something you care little about? or did you just have a crap day? RedMage
I just think that this match has been done enough already, I don't care about whether like Tifa or Rydia anymore! This is worst than an Amano versus Nomura argument on the forums! Why must we do the same thing all the time. CSM has to think about moving up that May project to March, this is getting annoying, everything's so repetitive. -- Drake
Drake, maybe you've been around for too long, or combed through the forums too frequently. I don't remember any recent huge argument between Tifa and Rydia, the fight's shaped up to be one of the most nail biting DNC competitions we've ever had, and you didn't even vote on the talk page, much less reject the Tifa vs. Rydia idea! 8bit BlackMage 21:13, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
Not exactly... We've had a number of ties, and it looks like Rydia lost by a dozen or so. TacticAngel

Well, this was inevitable. Go on, happy fantasies. I won't vote to ruin your fun. Just please archive this page when you're done with this page. TheSwordofDoubt 07:53, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Don't be a fuddy-duddy. This is actually the best fight we've had in a LONG TIME! Even I voted. -- Alcaeus
TSOD, why have you been so grumpy lately? Anyway, I wanted to see Tifa in a fight, but I also didn't want it to be some lame-ass one-sided beat down.--ChiefKakashi 23:43, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
Do I really sound grumpy? I was just wishing you guys a good fight. And please archive it. TheSwordofDoubt 03:38, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

(in reaction to anonymous vote 12 for Rydia) Ouch. RedMage

I've removed it. I can only put up with so many stupid votes for either side. Anyone else who shouts curses in all caps will have their votes removed as well. --BlueHighwind 22:58, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, this is a new thing. I've been here for quite a while, although I don't have many of the Final Fantasies, making it kinda worthless for me to make an account here. However, I've seen most, of not all of the Dragon's Neck Colosseum battles, and this is one of the most....odd ones I've seen in all of my visits here to the Final Fantasy Wiki. Click on the pictures and you'll see what I mean. I know it's Pure, Unadultrated Fan Service, but come on!

I think it's bloody hilarious how worked up you folks are getting over which fictional person in a video game series. I mean, FF is great, but... GREEN-HAIRED girl in a weird bathing suit who pulls dragons out of thin air versus woman who uses marbles to cast magic and is unaffected by gravity in AC? It r SRS BIZNEZ. XD Eowynjedi 05:04, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

Reality Check plz.--N/A

*gasp* Y-You m-m-m-m-mean...F-Final Fantasy...Isn't REAL?!? NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!! -- ChiefKakashi 17:32, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

craigrules14 i cant choose, WHY!!??!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!

Pikmin Master: I'll like to see Kaze next time. I have several opponents for him.

Wait. Tifa's winning? NOOOOOO!!

Wow. I accepted on the weekend Tifa would probably win, but this just snowballed into a +10 vote for her. I can accept Rydia losing, if she has to lose to anyone in a hottness contest it should be Tifa, but not by this large a margin! Drake Clawfang

Week 57: Materia v. Draw[edit source]


36 to 20
This week its time for something different; two of the more controversial magic systems. Do you like magic in marbles or do you not like it at all!?

Votes for Materia[edit source]

  1. Crazyswordsman: The one that doesn't suck gets my vote.
  2. BlueHighwind: Draw sucks in every way possible. My characters in FFVII were the greatest team I've ever made. No competition.
  3. Chief: Because I can.
  4. North Ace: Probably because "Draw" is friggin' cheap after you master it; no level grinding.
  5. Some Color Mage: I hate Draw. Besides, I like the double-edged sword thing. Adds more strategy.
  6. Aramis: Well, haven't finished either of those games... Started playing FFVII though... Not as good as FFXII, FFVI, or FFIV, but whatever.
  7. Alcaeus: If I wrote how many times I have to Draw > Stock 100 spells in my FF8 walkthrough, there would be 5 pages dedicated to just one battle. Why do I have to perform such a goddamn mediocre task just to increase my characters' attributes? Not only that, whenever I use a spell that is junctioned to an attribute, the attribute is then lowered (i.e. if Curaga is junctioned to HP, then using Curaga would lower the character's Max HP). While I dislike Materia, it is the obvious choice when being compared to the draw system. I hate these one-sided fights, BH please put the Ramza vs. Delita fight up next. PLEASE!
  8. Triforcel: I found materia to be somewhat usefull to use. Especially the Master materia. Draw on the other hand was one of the reasons I got so fed up with VIII that I didn't finish it.
  9. Otherarrow: Magic rocks are tons better than....whatever the Drawn stuff is supposed to be.
  10. Roman King: Draw sucks.
  11. Mizuno Mahou: Materia is loads better than the whole Junction/Draw system from VIII. That's saying a lot because Materia is inferior to most other ability systems in Final Fantasy.
  12. Super Sephiroth: Oh fuck
  13. dudutsai: Didn't like either of them... but Draw sucks soooo much more. Also, this isn't one sided, yet. It might yet become one and it possibly should be, but it's not.
  14. RedMage: I want to make this abosolutely clear: I AM VOTING FOR THIS BECAUSE I THINK IT'S THE BETTER MAGIC SYSTEM. Not because i am FFVII fanboy or any of the other various things that voting for something vaguely related to VII instantaniously make me in some people's eyes.
  15. Masamune: The reason I couldn't play FFVIII for more than the first few hours was the Draw System. That and wooden characters, a generally confused plot line and an exhaustingly repetitive battle system...but mostly the Draw system. And even though there are better magic systems in Final Fantasy, I didn't mind Materia that much. Plus it contributed to the story.
  16. MYVizm: i liked materia much better than the draw system. that one confused me ^^
  17. Rabid Biscuit: I hated FFVIII. Draw was one of the reasons. VII wasn't my favorite either, but Materia meant that anyone could learn practically anything, and that's pretty cool.
  18. Pikmin Master: I don't like either. But I hate Draw more, looking at Spoony's video.
  19. Chocolancer: ooooohh...shiny materia <drools>, even though its immensely time-consuming to level up materia, they're shiny, effective, and switchable to any character so they can use any magic that the materia allows, and its a better alternative to the "learn" magic system
  20. Alexander Namingway: as much as I respect the draw system I'm going to have to go with materia on this one. I simply allowed for much more versatility and fun combos, especially since you could switch summons around. Looking at the other side, this doesn't look like a one sided fight so far. HOWEVER, please try to make the next fights a bit more of a toss up. I didn't even bother voting last time since I knew it was going to be such a landslide victory for Shiva.
  21. Gaming-King:Draw sucks man, Materia all the wayand its a BETTER MAGIC SYSTEM .
  22. Adam mcduck: Draw was annoying as you could draw 9 magic in one turn and then 1 the next and then all you get is 1 until you end up killing your foe. It can take ages to get magic. Materia is also more storylined I guess - it is a part of the story and it itself has a history.
  23. Bluesilver: i hated draw and it is the main reason that i don't really play FFVIII and i think that the materia system was quite good itself.
  24. Darkling692: I hated FF VIII for a lot of reasons, Draw was one of those reasons. Materia on the other hand is not that bad. At least I liked the feeling that I was collecting some kind of jewels.
  26. tomtheroadkill: Despite the fact there was some good magic in FF8 using Draw, Materia still wins it for me!
  27. Xadren: I vote Materia because I like the way I must organize it and the way I can link different types of Materia in order to have the best effects. Beside in FF8 I always looked at how much spells I was a torture!
  28. Drake: I can't stand how people say that the reason Draw is better is because it's "better for your gaming skills/rep (okay, this really shouldn't be in quotes because I'm putting together a few of them) by drawing 100 spells than leveling up materia." First of all, this is untrue. I was able to have Squall get 99 Thundagas by the end of Disc 2. I was able to get the same number of Firagas with Zell by halfway through the same disc! I never mastered any materia in Final Fantasy VII except for Chocobo Lure and Restore. And I've played it over five times. And the way materia made some stats go up and some go down gave more dept and strategy to the battle system. It was fun to have to think about whether that Bolt 3 was worth the HP reduction of 20%. In VIII you just wait till you have a hundred of one spell then turn it into another spell. Boring.
  29. FakeFreedom:Materia was fun to junction and make different combinations to buff your characters. Drawing 11 or more times out of every monster to get 100 of every spell you needed wasn't my idea of fun. it was terrible and should of never been used, don't ever tell me you enjoyed wasting your life away watching the draw animation over and over.
  30. Shiningrayofdestruction:I'll have to go with the one that doesn't make me want to fling my PS2 into a vat of sulferic acid. Draw is the most annoying thing ever spawned by mankind, so I'm definitely going with materia.
  31. TacticAngel

Anonymous votes[edit source]

  1. Draw does suck
  2. much better than draw
  3. at least materia makes sense
  4. Because I don't want to spend all of my time trying to figure out a magic system. it's ridiculous because that ISN'T THE POINT OF THE GAME! It's alot more simple, and can be used for anything than just magic alone, like increasing status, summoning, hell even luring Chocobos. Also I saw where someone mentioned that with Draw you can use enemy attacks.... you can also do that with Materia all in all I don't want a game where the main focus is pretty much the magic system, that's insanely stupid. ofcourse there are downsides like lowering stats by a little and it kind of removes classes like Black, White, Red, and Blue Mages, but hey FFVII is pretty much best by popular vote
  5. Rainacide - As much as I love both games & both systems of magic, I would have to say Materia. I didn't like the idea that Magic came in stock rather than using MP for consumption. I did love the idea with all the abilities & customizing you could do with the Draw system but Materia wins because you...CUSTOMIZE even more with Materia and the battles are more interesting with Materia. Even though Materia's being reborn may sound funny, it's cool because you can give any character your new or used Materia & get the abilities learned from it. But there is a thing I hated about Materia, the stat reductions. & the fact that the Magic is never learned to the character permanently. If Materia did have that, it would have been a 1 sided fight.
  6. OMFG another BORING BATTLE AGAIN! what a waste of time... ...anyway Materia will have to get my vote cause it is a really good magic system and is very customisable. And btw we could of at least seen a less one sided battle like excalibur vs masamune.
  7. The entire system of FF8 was completely broken, and Draw was really a big part of that. I beat the game at level 20 and that was practically without trying. Materia on the other hand could be customized to create a variety of interesting effects, such as Counter+Steal or Chocobo Lure+Encounter Up.
  8. Unlike the others Im not going to shoot the draw system down. It was pretty cool and interesting, but it has several flaws. the most annoying flaw was the magic was NOT permanent!! I liked how you could use, magic to enhance your stats and all too, but the flaw with that is that you can no longer use that magic, and all the spells taht enhanced stats were good spells for battle too..
  9. Draw sucks, materia was bearable
  10. Yumiko: Draw was the reason I only reason I played VIII only once. It took way to long. Materia you can just equip and cast.
  11. Draw is horible and a waste of time but materia is awesome its so good to use.. i would pick materia over draw any day...

Votes for Draw[edit source]

  1. It's more original. The Hexed
  2. I'll go with the one that's going to lose. Oath to Order
  3. BH, draw sucks beacuse YOU can't play games with a system that pulls a harder work of the Human mind. Draw is much more original than Materia, and though it's game consists on putting your characters on critical to spam limit breaks, the Draw system is a much better add to the game, which makes it lighter and softer to play. It's easyness is so great that it reaches stupidity. - The Azorean One
  4. AnonyMan: Dang, I see another extremely one-sided fight coming along. Draw's unique and interesting, but like a lot of VIII's gameplay mechaincs has some flaws. Materia's basic and fine too, but my vote is pretty much personal prefernces to the games themselves, I'd have to flip a coin to flip a coin to deicde if I'd play VII again.
  5. Mymindislost: Meh. I like Draw. :/
  6. AzureDrake: I don't like the fact that they just took the magic system in FFVI and just gave it a spherical coat of paint. But anywhos, pity vote 'cuz this is OBVIOUSLY going to be outrun by FFVII.
  7. Netherith: Numerous reasons: 100 magic Drawn commands more respect in a persons gaming skills then a leveled up Materia overall. Potentially the Draw ability can be more awesome then Materia (nothing says 'owned' then using the enemy's own magic against them). It requires more ability in tactics, patience and foresight to use Draw effectively then it is to use Materia effectively. No Drawn magic is wasted, whilst Materia can be thrown away or simply lost. Never understood how a Materia gave birth to another materia (well, magically I do understand but Drawn magic makes more sense).
  8. Halpo: I love everything about FF8 better than FF7. The draw system was just one fantastic way to help your characters, and I'd go into detail but the last guy did a much better job at that than me :P Just a side note, someone mentioned magicite being better because it gave stat bonuses, spells, and summons all at once. I'd like to point out if you use the draw system properly it does all the same things.
  9. SmegHead: At least FFVIII had the balls to try a new style of gameplay. Just rename Materia to Crystal or Magicite and bask in the unoriginality.
  10. Does anyone care at all?: I don't give a shit about any comparisons between these games and I think the comparisons themselves are just plain retarded. One-sided fights suck.
  11. User: Sjoerd777:Draw.Why? Cause i hate FF7
  12. PhoenixDew: Draw may have its 'draw-backs', lol, but I found it more enjoyable, I hated how materia screwed up your stats! -5% hp? WHY??!?!
  13. bob the geomancer: it was on of the few things i liked about the game
  14. Faethin: I tend to avoid DNC, but what the heck. Draw gets my vote. I intensely disliked the fact that Materia lowered your stats because... because... actually, why did it do it? It doesn't seem to make sense. And I loved to draw and cast Apocalypse on Ultimecia. Netherith's right, that's very the example next to the definition of "owned" in the dictionary.
  15. Hiddensilver: Draw gets my vote, mostly because of the Card Mod ability. Much as I love level grinding, the fact that you could develop your characters through a card game that required a bit more thought than just mashing "attack" over and over was a welcome addition to those hours and hours of gaming.
  16. Ivalicia: Materia was also tedious, if you remember, since it multiplied like crazy after becoming mastered, creating dozens of worthless little level 1 materias.
  17. The Original MK: Ok, Materia wasn't that bad. I hated how I had to have each character learn the magic in FFVI from magicite; With Materia, I could just equip and cast. That being said, leveling up Materia is a bitch. The magic system in FFVIII just seems more original or realistic(?) and you don't have to grind just to get new magic, you got new magic when you got far enough in the story. I only wished that you could buy also spells as well in FFVIII... Maybe then it won't have such a bad rep.

Anonymous votes[edit source]

  1. Draw provides an infinite amount of opportunity for intellectual thought, meta discussion and fits in beautifully with the gameplay system. It's innovative, and while it may have its flaws, at least it isn't some recycled version of the magic system in, I don't know, basically every other FF game that came before it. Draw requires brains to use, that's what makes it brilliant.
  2. EmuMaster: Ugh. The one that isn't in Final Fantasy 7. Though I hate both of them.
  3. Exodus: Draw. Materia is SOOOOOO tedious!
  4. Troy: While I felt that Materia was a better system, I'm giving my vote to Draw because it was unique. FF8 is one of those games that I tried to play years ago, didn't care for it, but need to go back and give it another try since I'm older and perhaps a little better gamer since then.
  5. For some reason, the materia system annoyed me. It just did. Draw for me.
  6. I vote for draw mainly because I don't like to use magic alot, so to stock the magic and then junction it to raise stats such as strength and speed is a good idea to me.

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Let put this in the nicest way possible. STOP PICKING FIGHTS THAT ARE ONE SIDED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Really. I know meteria will win this fight. Just like I know pitting Terra with Rinoa will end with Terra winning. Just like I know Locke would win if he and Squall would fight. Please, next time pick a fight that might have a chance of being evenly matched. Oath to Order 01:32, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

Next week, I'm doing Ramza vs. Delita. That should prove to be interesting. Who will win? The goody-two-shoes aristocrat, or the ambitious usurper? --BlueHighwind 01:34, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
Wasn't that used already? - Henryacores
I have a better idea. Why don't we choose the fights the same way we choose featured articles? Some users nominate fights and people vote on them. Better yet, why don't we do that but also change it every week. Make it a "weekly" fight instead of an "update whenever I feel like it" fight? Oath to Order 01:56, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
Are you going to vote, or just whine, Oath? And Henry, its never been done, I just checked. --BlueHighwind 01:58, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
I want Tifa vs. Rydia next week. I came up with that before all these other ideas. (I think) A lot of other people liked it, so I think it should be done next week.--ChiefKakashi 02:03, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
AnonyMan: I like the Ramza/Delita idea better seems like less a chance of it being one-sided like I imagine Tifa/Rhydia being. I know Del's pretty popular, but Ramza while not anything special or cool(Not saying he's a bad either) I see alot of love for him. I'd like to see how that turns out
This doesn't seem as lopsided so far as a lot of popular fights. Its my understanding that both systems are reviled by some and loved by others. I also wouldn't count on democracy working here very well. <3 TacticAngel

Strongly nominate Ramza vs. Delita, Ivalice characters gets too little spotlight; but shouldn't it be in the talkpage?--N.Angeal

How does Draw take more thought? Its tedious busywork. --BlueHighwind 02:07, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

Patience is a virtue my friend --Henryacores
Patience is for losers. I got things to do. --BlueHighwind 02:11, 24 February 2008 (UTC
Meh...You spend days writing walkthroughs and you say patience is for losers? I consider that self-attack - Henryacores
What the Hell is your problem, man? I was just debating a video game. You had to start attacking me. Jesus. What a freak. --BlueHighwind 02:17, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
BH, a.k.a. The Touchy One--ChiefKakashi 02:40, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

To be perfectly honest magicite was a much better system than both of these. It gave stat bonuses, spells, and summons all at once

......We waited....a week and a half....for this!?!??!!??!?! And can anyone update the DNC at will now? I would have done it quite some time ago if I knew it was allowed. 8bit BlackMage 02:35, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
I agree. There were a lot of better ones than this.--ChiefKakashi 02:40, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
Unwritten rule as stated by Crazyswords: Only members of the Wiki Staff can update the DNC. TA gets first dibs out of respect. Then comes Crazyswords, then any other Admin or Mod. I think I may be the only one to actually use that power though. --BlueHighwind 02:56, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

I'm getting tired of these boring fights, just end this battle right now and get on with the Ramza vs. Delita fight. - Alcaeus

Here's a little something I'm sure everyone's seen. It's annoying, but shows the Draw system at its "finest." - Alcaeus

"This is all I have to say to the fanboys of FFVIII. Watch this video, and FUCK YOU!" A living prophit, that Spoony One is. Man, I wish I had that kind of tech for my FFVIII Review. --BlueHighwind 04:47, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
That's a very clear and sharp video, no pixelation at all. People whine to much. -- Netherith 05:33, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
But where's you retort? The Spoony One brings up good points. How can you vote for Draw if you cannot defeat those points with logic, my fellow Mod? --BlueHighwind 06:06, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
Even though I love Spoony and enjoyed his series on FFVIII, he does carry on a bit about the draw system. An experienced FFVII player would not sit there at the first encountered enemy and just draw for an hour. When on the first disc, I usually draw 2 times at most from each enemy I encounter: Draw, Attack, Draw, Attack, enemy defeated, move on. SmegHead 09:45, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

Why is Halpo numbered 1? AzureDrake 05:52, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

Prooblum resolved, now who wants cake? AzureDrake 06:31, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

I just remembered another reason to hate the Draw/Junction system, it makes your characters invincible. Now add the fact that Squall's Limit already dishes out extreme amounts of damage, max STR means that all of the monsters/bosses can be killed in only a few hits. What's the fun in that? - AlcaeusTheWizard 06:56, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

I'll try to make mine and Oath's message as clear as possible. STOP THE DAMN ONE-SIDED FIGHTS!!!!!!!!!!!!! They are just stupid, lame and childish IMO. And I don't care whatever you say about wanting to continue, just please stop them and end it now and for all. Seriously. Thank you, and have an emo free day. TheSwordofDoubt 11:26, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

Since the score is currently 12 to 11, I'd hardly call this a one-sided fight. Unless all the FFVII fanboy anons come out of the woodwork, this is shaping to be a close contest. And the DNC is supposed to just be a fun community activity to welcome new contributors to the wiki, it's not going to ruin your life to have this up for a week. You and Oath need to grow up a little. SmegHead 11:58, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
Why does everyone on this wiki hate FFVII? Every debate that even mentions FFVII instantly gets a million supporters to the other side just out of spite. You don't care about the issue. You're not thinking. You're just voting to beat one single game. And no fights with FFVII in them are ever one-sided. You know why? Its because of the FFVII haters. Which there are far too many on this wiki. I have nothing but respect for Crazyswords in this vote. He voted for the better system. I also support Neherith, he voted for what he believed in. But as for the rest of you. You're a bunch of dense, prejudiced, idiots. Get over it. FFVII is liked better than the other games. So what? --BlueHighwind 14:56, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
Just in case that was directed at me BH, I don't dislike FFVII, it is a great game. But I honestly enjoy FFVIII more, and admire the leaps it took to originality. SmegHead 23:25, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
And if that was at me, I don't hate FF VII either. How can I? I've never played it. But neither do I love it. All I can do is respect it from afar, because I will never be able to play it. TheSwordofDoubt 14:40, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

So far so good....--Nellolipop

Nelo where did that come from -.- "Nellolopop" lol AzureDrake 15:17, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

Superaeon35: Actually ive never played either of these games through. (on my first time ever on ff7, god bless the psp hackers, and tryin to get ff8) till then i cant vote.

I'm surprised at how "close" this fight is. It's not like last fight where Shiva got 20 votes in half a second and Mateus got maybe 2 in a few days. This one might be worth watching, though it's quickly becoming less balanced.--ChiefKakashi 04:05, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

I'm not that surprised. There are a few things that I do when choosing a fight, most of which I think are taken from CSM's cue; ensure the participants do not appear often, try not to do something thats been done before, try not to do something too self-indulgent, and lastly the fairness. Its often hard to judge the last one. Most of the suggestions on the talk page are one or more of these problems. In short, I will take your demand under advisement, as Col. Tighe said. --TacticAngel 11:33, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
This, however, is the exception. Most of the fights have been one-sided crapfests.--ChiefKakashi 19:45, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
For reference, see: Week 56, Week 55, Week 54, Week 53... 8bit BlackMage 23:34, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
Hey, you have nobody to blame but yourselves. You are the voting public after all. Its your desicion about how one-sided these fights are. So quit whining. I have to say that Cecil deserved more votes in my Paladin fight, but I guess the old school FF crowd just wasn't up to voting that week. --BlueHighwind 23:40, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
To that end, Agrias beat Ashe. I wonder how Agrias v. Beatrix would come out. As far as 8bit, OoO, and tSoD, find something else to do or something else to complain about. Nothing's changing.--TacticAngel 00:30, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
BH, you don't make sense. We didn't choose the fights, so how is it the voting public's fault for voting in a poll whose identity is out of their control? Anyway, the nomination system has changed, and I would love to see an Agrias vs. Beatrix fight. 8bit BlackMage 00:51, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
It has? I didn't vote on it. --TacticAngel 04:01, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

@8-bit: I though we chose the fights. Agrias vs Beatrix sounds good, someone suggest it, if they've not already (shitty conection won't let me load the suggestions page just now) also, what's with all the emnity towards BH? At least he actually puts fights up for us instead of deciding to do something more personaly benefitial RedMage

Week 56: Shiva vs. Mateus[edit source]



54 v.13½

The ice deity who started it all and the latest. Which one will freeze-up and which one will burn bright?

Votes for Shiva[edit source]

  1. User:Cabz2018: SHIVA WOULD KICK MATEUS' ASS....there is no doubt in my mind that shiva would win, but i have to say what IDIOT decided to turn her into a motorcycle? BTW does anyone else think her form in FF10 waz tha best one? all the other one's kinda sucked....Diamond Dust forever!!!!!!!
  2. BlueHighwind: TA, I thought you were holding back the next fight because you had some awesome new amazing fight. Instead you bring us this, where everybody will vote for Shiva. Why Shiva? Because Summons in FFXII are worthless, and Shiva is tied with Bahamut as my favorite Summon.
  3. Roman King: Come on, Shiva is the original. Mateus is just a rip off of Shiva with Emperor Palamecia's name.
  4. Mymindislost: My love of Shiva has been well documented in numerous places on this wiki. ;)
  5. Drake Clawfang:Shiva is an original, I don't know or care who the other one is. Plus, Shiva got hot in 3D :D.
  6. Some Color Mage: YAY DIAMOND DUST! Seriously, I prefer the regula summons over XII's.
  7. Chief: I love Shiva. Power and beauty (a stange, blue-skinned beauty) in one package. Damn the fool who decided that it was a good idea to make her a motorcycle.
  8. The Hexed: Blame it on FFX.
  9. Dark Cloud Shiva beats any summon besides Bahumut, so mateus isnt even close.
  10. Crazyswordsman: I miss Shiva. And it's a guy. For the last time, SHIVA IS MALE.
  11. AnonyMan: They both aren't really cool, but Shiva was in FFIX(even if she was under the control of the lesser of the two summoners). I don't hate Mateus, Shiva's just got more nostalgia and I've only summoned twice in FFXII, it's the only esper linked to any character.
  12. VitoRyu: You can teach Shiva Fire Spell in X. Enough said.
  13. Adam Mcduck: Like them both, but Shiva's the original and has more of a legacy to he name.
  14. AK's 115th Dream: HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!! FFXII Esper versus anything...why even waste your time on a battle like this? Shiva owns virtually every other summon anyway, and especially every FFXII Esper 1138 times.
  15. MK: Hmmmm. Mateus has that whole, "blindfold, bondage, RAPE ME" thing going on which looks kinda hot but Shiva (is it Shi-VA or SHE-va?) is just more useful and hotter.... Even if she(he) is supposed to be a dude.
  16. Xadren: I like Shiva, expecially FF8's one. It's the power of tradition.
  17. PapaBear:Shiva rocks,Mateus went from hume Totema to mermaid Esper.....What the ______ is that all about.Shiva goes hand in hand with Ifrit.
  18. Fyrmer: Shiva. Why? Because Mateus is a guy. a guy with breasts...and a mermaid tail. That's just wrong.
  19. Namine Worshipper: Like with Vivi, I don't think I need a reason.
  20. Rabid Biscuit: Never having played FFXII, I'm going to have to go with Shiva. So Mateus may look cooler, but Shiva has street cred. I would hardly call her my favorite summon, but...yeah.
  21. dudutsai: Never used summons very much, but strangely I remember summoning Shiva a bunch...
  22. ornitia_danz: Shiva's cool in FF8! I like her style..
  23. Chocolancer: Shiva has always been a Final Fantasy original! So I vote for her, even though I've never used her as a summon...but I use her a lot as an aeon =)
  24. Chocobo Knight: Well yes, as it has already been said, Shiva is the original. And she is hot...or cold (that joke has probably been ton a million times already). And Mateus is a guy who looks like a girl, and it has a crap backstory behind it to why...still, that said, I don't mind Mateus. Shiva still wins hands down though
  25. Aramis: WTF?? Mateus is an esper in FFXII... Enough said...
  26. Henryacores: The reason why Shiva rocks harder than Mateus is simple: DIAMOND DUST! Seriuosly. That crazy finger-snap is so perfect. She's the 3rd best summon for me. She is the Ice Queen, no doubt about that!
  27. Pikmin Master: I totally agree with the Chief and BH. Think about it: Shiva, AKA Hot and Cold at the same time versus some Shiva wannabe bound to a freaky fish guy. However, my vote really goes to Eidolon Shiva. GF and Aeon Shivas look weird, but Esper Mateus is more rediculus. Besides, Shiva is one of my favorite female characters, after Celes, of course.
  28. Yellowmoogle: Mateus is just a poser compared to Shiva.
  29. Lockhart: Uhhh...this isn't even close. And it shouldn't be.
  30. Masamune: Poor Mateus. This was never even a contest.
  31. Sephiroth Shiva wins just because she has been in alot more Final Fantasy's
  32. ShadowLaguna: Shiva is the real beauty summon.
  33. Falbub: Voting for Shiva simply because I know her better.
  34. NirvanaPhoenix: This is actually one of the hardest votes I've had to cast. The design of XII Mateus is awesome, it's so detailed and just looks amazing. Also cool in TA, haven't seen it in Revenant Wings yet but I only got it yesterday. Shiva is a classic Summon and is so for good reason, one of the best in battle in FFX and very handy in most FF games. Shiva does look crap in Revenant Wings and TA.
  35. user: bob the geomancer definatly shiva. shiva is traditional and she (i know in myhs it's a he but ff made it a girl) and a great summon in ff IX like everything in ffIX and i've never played ffXII.
  36. DiamonDust: hmm well shiva has been my favorite summon for a long time...but mateus is also really cool, mateus vs shiva...clash of ice titans...but as you can see...or as you can READ... i side for shiva.
  37. Alcaeus: Mateus sucks along with the rest of FF12's summons. She's a complete waste of MP.
  38. RedMage: Origional, snd the best. She saved my ass in VII, and thats a hell of a lot more that i can say of Maty here
  39. SS: Oh Jesus this is an easy fight shiva rules mateus fucks up. that should tell you my opinion
  40. Doc Rocco: Shiva is the original ice summon, and is my favourite summon. Plus Mateus sucks anyway
  41. Zordrac: Ifrit whipping "Diamond Dust" Shiva gets my vote
  42. HIMBO:DUH!
  43. MYVizm: Shiva because... I dunno, I just like her better. She's one of my favorite summons ^^
  44. Terra Homing: Shiva because shes the original and about a thousand times more useful. Poor Mateus. I almost gave it a pity vote.
  45. Drake: Maybe next week there can be a fight that makes me think before I vote.
  46. BigSlurp: Mateus is cool and all, I really don't use him much in FFXII, but Shiva is the shit. While there are definately cool summons than either of these, Shiva gets my vote cause she gets around. She has been a summon in just about every FF game. All hail the Ice Queen.
  47. Bluesilver: Mateus has to have a weapon to do his/her? dirty work, Shiva uses her ice powers more dominantly, and i think she looks good.
  48. Superaeon35:PSSHT! Its all about shiva! Diamond dust from FFX is the best, plus shes in alot more games and has more costumes to choose from, so she wins. (plus shes super hot for a blue girl)

Anonymous votes[edit source]

  1. Lexoj:Finger snapping beats throwing an oversized fork anyday..
  2. Random Anonymous Person: I'm not fond at all of the XII Espers.
  3. Varehemsko: Whilst I loved Frostwave (and all of the FFXII Esper's special abilities for that matter), the traditionalist in me prevails. I know Shiva is meant to be male, but really, who cares? Mateus is supposedly a guy too (although I think the reason he appears female is because of the 'Goddess of the Demense' he bound (hence the bondage connotations too etc)). It's not a matter of whether or not the FFXII espers were better or worse than the FFVII summons or that one game is better or worse than the other. The only thing that I didn't like was that the only place the classic summons had in XII was as vehicles (although at least they made it so that the vehicles were appropriately sized; wouldn't make sense to have the Ramuh/Quezacotl in the role the Bahamut plays).
  4. shiva is one of the best summons through out the whole game she ties with my other two favorites Alexander(ffIX) Bahamut(FFX&VII advent children(if thet counts)
  5. Sigh another BORING BATTLE, you should listen to some of drakeclawfangs ideas for once. Anyway Shiva is much better than her cheap ripoff Mateus and has always been a hot summon as well, even if she does have the name of a male god.
  6. Steel Sentry: I've actually used Shiva multiple times. I don't think that I even bothered with Mateus. FFXII's summons are next to useless.
  7. Could this match be any more one sided?
  8. Rainacide - It's gotta be Shiva. Even though Mateus sounds way cooler. It's Shiva. Mateus is jut a bootlegged version of Shiva. Shiva is the original Ice Queen actually a dude. Mateus is just a second rate version that has a female attached. & Diamond Dust owns Frostwave ;].
  9. Diamond Dust: Shiva is a staple diet of the FF series. Sure its nice to add a lil extra flavour here and there but nothing could ever replace her. Mateus like Zalera are just cowards, using woman as their lil play things. Oh side note, Shiva is represented as male the hindu religion. But I'm not complaining . I'm just happy to know that she'll return for FF XIII
  10. LuvLuv G - I say it's Shiva, because I personally do not like, nor do I trust the Lucavi at all. Sorry Piscian Humes, but Shiva all the way!!! (She's not only the Totema for Humes, but represents the sign, Pisces) Also, to the person who thinks Shiva is gender confused: Shiva is not gender confused. She's always been a female, and she only shares the name and skin color with the Hindu God. Mateus, however is gender confused. First in FFTA, it's a female, in XII, it states it's a male with a female strapped as a shield. Now Revenant Wings changed it back to a female with a female strapped as a shield. Who's gender confused now?
  11. EmuMaster: Shiva. I don't even know who the other one IS, really. All I know is that Shiva's an ice goddess and that's all you really need in an ice-elemental summon.
  12. Random Voter Number Twelve: Shiva's been my fav from the beginning, so she gets my vote. Also, Mateus just looked weird....

Votes for Mateus[edit source]

  1. 8bit_BlackMage Mateus. Why? Better name. I always liked Ramuh over Shiva.
  2. N/A It's probably the design....but I dunno, Mateus has always been my fav. summon in FFXII.
  3. Azul I don't like Shiva better than Mateus but for right now, in the games i'm playing, Mateus is more useful.
  4. Oath I think the FFXII Espers are cool looking. And, Mateus sounds cool (Mateus. Mateus. Mateus.) I prefer Fenrir to them anyway.
  5. WeissTheImmaculate-One word Frostwave.
  6. Xmd5a: Superficially speaking, Mateus > Shiva. Never really used either all that much.
  7. Zombire Mateus just because he's x10 more awesome.
  8. Scottyboy: I'm back with a vengeance.
  9. Resa91: Mateus is more interesting esper.
  10. Gold: Sod the fact that Mateus is the new ice summon, it's the Totema of the humans. If you're human, you should be voting for him. Not the gender confused thing to the left.
  11. TacticAngel: I actually like both... but generally the character design here more.

Anonymous votes[edit source]

  1. im voting for mateus as its the summon equivalent of the zodiac sign pisces and im a pisces :)
  2. Troy: More of a pity vote really. I happen to be playing FFXII right now so Mateus gets my vote. Good point on the Pisces thing, since that is my sign also, it gives me another reason.
  3. May as well continue the pattern. I'm a Pisces too. Personally, I found Mateus to be one of the more interesting fights in XII though as a summon I don't use him much. Yes, it is a him. Mateus is the thing the ice lady is attached to. I find Belias, Cuchulainn and Zalera to be more useful. My all time favorite is Leviathan. God, I've said way more than I should. In short, Mateus over Shiva. Frostwave, too.
  4. RMX (too lazy to log in): Voting for Mateus 'coz I like characters who are androgynous. I really though Mateus was a girl.
  5. Punkmaster : Mateus is a fugly but awesome thingymagig! He/She RUELS

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

  • TacticAngel: On the bright side, I'll probably only leave it up for 5 or 6 days, BH. I actually like most of the suggestions from which this comes. Perhaps you just didn't realize I was busy doing other things and I wanted to see some boobies on this page... lots of them.
BlueHighwind: But Beatrix's bust size is bigger than both Shiva and Mateus's combined. Quality, not quantity.
Mymindislost: TA! My goodness! I am scandalized by your lascivious comments. ;) And BH, it seems like if Beatrix's boobs are bigger than Shiva's and Mateus's combined, that would still be an issue of quantity...
Henryacores:If you want boobs you need a Lulu vs Tifa match.Perfect *_*.

8bit_BlackMage: I LOL'ed for 10 seconds straight when I read both of the preceding comments. TA, for next week, please try to curb your lust and don't make the fight Rikku vs. Yuffie.

TacticAngel:I guess it will have to be something to look forward to...
Faethin That's not gonna happen because of the issue of quality over quantity BH just brought up. :P

Azul:It's cool to see my fight up, but TA, if it's "boobie" you wanted, you should have went for Rikku vs. Yuffie ;)

Dark Cloud or maybe tifa vs Lulu, that would be the biggest breasts competion

Faethin:@CSM:If Shiva's a guy, then Adel's a girl.

I never denied that Adel was female. You must've forgotten about Chrono Trigger. --Crazyswordsman 06:09, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
How is Shiva a guy CSM? She has breasts, her name is feminine, and she's referred to countless times in several games as the Queen of Ice. Drake Clawfang 06:51, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Maybe he thinks Shiva is the King of Transvestites. However, I don't think summons can get plastic surgery. So hot icy chick it is. Some Color Mage
Because Shiva is a god. A god, not a goddess. And like I said, you guys need to play Chrono Trigger. --Crazyswordsman 03:48, 15 February 2008 (EST)
Chrono Trigger isn't a Final Fantasy game, so it doesn't matter. The God Shiva is a guy, the Summon Shiva is a girl. I'd never be stupid enough to think the two were the same. --BlueHighwind 13:09, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Shiva from FF is only a namesake of the god Shiva. The god Shiva has absolutely nothing to do with ice. Believe me, I know these things.--ChiefKakashi 19:41, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Well, Chrono Trigger does matter. This one quote "Power is beautiful...and I have power!" --Crazyswordsman 07:15, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

Adam Mcduck: It's true the name Shiva comes from a 'God' in Hindu religion. But, in that he is known as 'the destroyer', not 'Ice King', therefore it seems as though Shiva only inherited the name of this deity, nothing more, and can, therefore, be female.

N/A:@Fyrmer: believe it or not, that blue chick is not Mateus. She's just a poor soul bondaged crucified on a black fish-like dude.

  1. Fyrmer: I know that. I read the whole sick origin story in the clan primer. I still consider Mateus a dude with boobs. And, I guess, a whole woman's body as well.
  2. PapaBear:I read the clan primer too. It seems that Mateus is a man that used shiva as a sheild against the Occuria and was fused with her into this form,that means were voting against Shiva VS Fused Shiva.

Henryacores: @Chief: Motorcicles rock hard too. Good choice for Shiva ^^

Not for Shiva. Ifrit would have been better, if they wanted to use an old summon.--ChiefKakashi 19:41, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Henryacores- Ifrit would be better as Tank, and Titan as a Hummer or a Jeep. Motorcicles are light and beautiful, like Shiva.
Have you seen a Harley lately? (uh, refering to the "light" part)--ChiefKakashi 02:50, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
Or a Gold Wing? - Oath to Order 03:05, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

Pikmin Master: End it already! We already know who's going to win. Shiva already slaughered Mateus in this competition.

Is it just me, or have the last few fights all been devesating losses? Also, CSM, Chrono Trigger does matter, you speak the truth amoungst this myriad of lies. And also, WHAT THE HELL????? THESE ARE GAME CHARACTERS YOU SICK, PERVERTED PEADOPHILES!!!(please ignore this if it does not apply) RedMage

Pikmin Master:I agree with the above post.
@RedMage: Are you refering to the people who are calling Shiva and Mateus men? or the people drooling over them (well, at least Shiva)? If neither, what in the hell are you talking about?--ChiefKakashi 23:50, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Pikmin Master (again): I've played Wii Baseball recently and I was thinking: "Has ANYONE here in FFwiki ever heard of a Mercy Rule (in this case meaning if one side has a rediculus amount of votes, they automatically win)?" I think we should have one of those. This fight really needs one, since Shiva already won and it's taking too long. Do you WANT me to indroduce the next fight?

@ChiefKakashi: The ones drooling over them, and over every single female character in the series it seems. @Pikmin Master: i think this fight has already been won, a new one would be nice, and good idea with the Mercy Rule, i think it should be introduced. RedMage
@RedMage: Ahhhhh...You're taking us too seriously. There is a big difference between thinking a game character is hot and actually thinking you have a chance with them. I know I don't have a chance with Tifa, and I know it's because she's fake, and that doesn't bother me. What can I say? I'm a guy, and guys like to look. (that goes for Shiva, too) Or, maybe I'm taking your comment to seriously...--ChiefKakashi 17:44, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
  • Hey, stupid motherfuckers. That sign that says "DO NOT ADD COMMENTS OR EDIT ANYTHING BELOW THIS LINE", you know it? Well listen to it for once. You dumbasses fuck up the whole page if you delete the "|}". I am sick and tired of cleaning that up every damn day. So learn. Or if that's too much trouble, don't bother editing. With Love, BlueHighwind 20:19, 20 February 2008 (UTC).

CSM, Shiva is the Hindu god of duality, and is both a god and a goddess, and switches sex on a whim. -- Drake1

Hindu Shiva is different from FF Shiva! Or were you even talking about that...?--ChiefKakashi 20:57, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
@BH sorry about that, i admit it was me one time (i think, not too sure on that one)I just thought someone had added it by mistake and left it there, any way now that that's cleared up, Chief, yeah, you were taking it a bit too seriously, but, heck, i was as well. RedMage

Please, someone END THIS FIGHT! Alcaeus

Troy:Not sure, but I think Shiva may win this one.
You may just be right there RedMage

Week 55: Beatrix vs. Cecil![edit source]



41½ v.22½

Cecil FF4DS CG Art.png
Two warriors of the Holy Order. Their shining brilliance leading the way to the Light. But now that Darkness has been vanquished they turn their swords against each other. Who is the greater Holy Swordsman, Beatrix of Alexandria or Cecil of Baron?

User Votes for Beatrix[edit source]

  1. BlueHighwind: This is the very first I've ever made and I'm proud to be voting first in it. This isn't half as hard as Crazyswords or TA want you to think. Beatrix is just so much more awesome, I think its the eye patch that does it. Plus she was able to defeat your party three times! A feat that has never been topped.
  2. Drake: EDIT CONFLICT Sometimes I'll play through the first two discs of Final Fantasy IX so I can play as Beatrix. Sometimes I start a new game of Final Fantasy IV so I can continue to play as Dark Knight Cecil, which is, without a doubt, the better version of Cecil.
  3. Mymindislost: I'll go Beatrix on this one. She's pretty badass. ^_^
  4. Chief: Random vote.
  5. 8bit_BlackMage: Cecil's an insect compared to Beatrix! Climhazzard ftw!
  6. Xadren: I must vote for the shogun of Alexandria, simply amazing considering that the first times I met her, she always made me hate her "Shock" attack...But everyone must vote her just because she's Steiner's Lover!!!!
  7. Pikmin Master: Sure, Cecil can top the HP of even Final Bosses like Dark Anima, Beatrix can own that still. Besides, looks plus power equals awesome.
  8. Some Color Mage: Because this is a battle of the paladins, Beatrix wins. If it was just the people, DK Cecil would probably have a chance.
  9. Yellowmoogle: Give me a reason not to vote for Beatrix!
  10. dudutsai: Cecil is nothing special (don't hit me)
  11. Triforcel: I haven't actually played FF9 yet, but Cecil being forced to change from an awesome Dark Knight into a mediocre Paladin was the greatest disapointment I've experienced in a Final Fantasy since Aeris died.
  12. Drake Clawfang:If this was DK Cecil against Beatrix, I'd have to think this over. DK Cecil was like Angel from Buffy, a former murderer on a mission of redemption. Paladin Cecil was just lame. DK Cecil gets Darkside, Paladin Cecil gets a handful of bad White Magic spells that really, I only used for Rydia to suck MP from. Beatrix, she's awesome.
  13. TheSwordofDoubt: Um, hello? Have you NEVER seen her skillset when she joins you? She has HOLY! And EVERYTHING ELSE!
  14. N/A♣
  15. User:Henryacores: Save the Queen owns all, as well as Shock.
  16. User:Booff7: Gotta go Beatrix here. Cecil was cool but Beatrix is easily one of the best characters in the series. Not much more needs to be said.
  17. Masamune: Definitely Beatrix. 'Nuff said.
  18. Darkling692: Cecil was a cool character... when he had the power of darkness, Beatrix can be really mean even using holy powers, that's enough difference for me.
  19. Lockhart: I haven't gotten the pleasure of playing with Cecil yet, but I know of the awesomeness of Beatrix.
  20. Adam Mcduck: I don't like Paladin Cecil, whereas Beatrix is great. A battle between Dark Knight Cecil and Beatrix may have been different for me.
  21. Jenerix525 : What can I say? Well, she's awesome and Cecil can't decide if he's evil or not. Plus, she was in one of my fave FFs.
  22. Alexander Namingway : Beatrix is elgegant, refined, powerful, beautiful and wields power white magic and sword skills that Zidane and his allies simply could not withstand. I know firsthand about Cecil's job change/change of heart and I can only say that I respect that but I think Beatrix did it better. I could go on and on about how she has holy and save the queen, how her eyepatch makes her look mysterious, and how she's a beautiful female character who isn't just in there to fill some quota. I could go on like that for a while but I'll leave it at this. Beatrix is simply my favorite female character from the final fantasy series, and one of the best female game characters in my opinion.
  23. Mr. Rojo: Beatrix is awesome, very powerful. Of course she is better than Cecil, she is the greatest paladin in FF. Also, great character and theme.
  24. Fyrmer: Sure, Cecil may be the Poster Boy for Paladin's, but....Beatrix is Hot!
  25. craigrules14: well cecil did go throught alot and he was my second fav in ff4, but beatrix wasted your party 3 times and she is freakin sweet when you get to use her, and stenier (or how ever you spell his name)if he is your weakest person in my game he was, she got him lved up rlly fast and stuff, and she never let me down...
  26. Judge Zarbi: I've only played FF9 but this person looks cooler. P00nag3.
  27. Alcaeus: Cecil's a pansy bitch. He should have stayed as a Dark Knight. Beatrix is way cooler!
  28. Sephiroth: no contest
  29. HIMBO: contest. Mostly because I've never played...whatever game Cecil is from. =]
  30. Child of Ragnarok: Definitely Beatrix. Hey, do you see Cecil do any cool stuff with his sword? Huh? Any Shocking or Climhazzarding? Huh? Do ya? Do you see Cecil cast Holy? Huh? Do ya? DO YA?!!
  31. Lankapoo: Beatrix would kick Cecil's ass!
  32. Sorceress Heartilly: I've played both games and know FFIV a lotbetter but I'm still voting for Beatrix. Thought Cecil might have stronger attacks and have beter equipment, he doesn't have any of Beatrix's Seiken or as many useful white magic spells either (Beatrix's Holy>Cecil's Attack if they're at the same level). Allin all My vote goes to the lady paladin who broke the mold of Paladin rules and learned decent white magic spells.
  33. Rabid Biscuit: Okay, Beatrix takes the cake on this one. Cecil was pimp and all, but Beatrix had the Save the Queen. The SAVE THE QUEEN!
  34. Terra Homing:Beatrix would win everytime she beats your party three times and as Save The Queen... no contest
  35. TacticAngel: I always liked Beatrix. I don't dislike Cecil, but he strikes me as less of an interesting paladin type.
Anonymous Votes[edit source]
  1. Duh, FF9>FF4 in terms of character development. And Beatrix was seriously one of the coolest FF9 characters. She should have been a proper playable character and she is cooler than Cecil and also pretty hot too. Although I still like Cecil as well.
  2. Rainacide - It's gotta be Beatrix from FFIX. Paladin Cecil is a fruitcake compared to Beatrix & even tho Cecil was a Dark Knight, Beatrix is still beast. Plus many just Gameshark FFIX in order to only use Beatrix. The eye-patch is sexy & she's a savage.
  4. Troy: Cecil is a good character, but the characters in IX were some of the best in the series. Beatrix is no exception so she gets my vote.
  5. Gotta go with the general for this one. Her level-headedness is one of her better qualities, insofar as I am concerned.
  6. She has Climhazzard and Shock, not to mention some great healing spells on her side. Cecil is a Lead Character and you can max out his stats, ect, however he was never a character that really STUCK with me. You play as Beatrix all of twice, but she's one of the more memorable characters in the franchise. My vote to the general!
  7. I vote for Beatrix for ALL the reasons above...and the fact that even though she is a Paladin she can use Holy! If Cecil had a special attack command to replace his Darkness it might have been harder to chose.
  8. i love beatrix and i wish i couls play here in the game instead on steiner.
  9. Random Anonymous Person: I like Cecil, but mainly because I like his game. Beatrix is overall a more interesting character.
  10. If only this was vs Cecil as a Dark Knight....
  11. This is no contest. Beatrix all the way.
  12. Beatrix wins this. I've played both games. Cecil was amazing as a DK, but then he had to go and change his class, making him weaker in the process. Beatrix was a paladin from start to finish of FFIX, was an all around interesting character, and you quickly learn to love and hate her. Besides, you never hear any of the characters from IV saying Cecil killed 100 men himself, do you?
  13. She just really, really... REALLY HHOOOOOOOOTTTT!!!!!!!! :) :) :) :) :). And her transformation from a stoic character to someone who is romantic and even funny is just amazing.

BEATRIX rocks !!!! she will kick ass with the half lagandary sav the queen!!!!

User Votes for Cecil[edit source]

  1. Oath to Order 20:36, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
  2. Crazyswordsman: Yes, it is that hard.
  3. RedMage 21:50, 29 Jan, 2008
  4. The Hexed: Lightbringer > SaveTheQueen
  5. Lancer4: I saw this and thought of my brother, so I'm voting for Cecil. Though Cecil isn't bad at all. I miss my big bro :( *sigh*. Also LB>STQ!!!!
  6. PapaBear:Cecil was the best, going from Dark Knight to Paladin,Great stuff.
  7. AnonyMan: I don't like Cecil but he does go through a storyline Job change. And that's pretty cool because he gets better from it. Beatrix(like majority of FFIX characters) she's cool but she's way overrated(As far as FFIX goes anyway.)and hey Steiner can learns all her Sword skills and more.
  8. Aramis: Poor cecil.. Anyway, I haven't played FFIX, so.. cannot tell which is better.
  9. Resa91: This is hard but I quess I'm choosing Cecil. Don't get me wrong, Beatrix an excellent paladin too :)
  10. ShadowLaguna: I'm a fan of Cecil. Enough said.
  11. Omegalink: I'm going with Cecil. Even if somebody can prove the Beatrix is a better paladin, Cecil can use items to heal himself if he has to.
  12. MK: Cecil has Kain.... Kain beats all....
  13. IvalicesLastDefense: Cecil the Paladin. 'Nuff said.
  14. Kainos: i like paladins but Cecil had to fight his bro....and Golbez was a dark knight....and he forgave him at the end of the game and that takes strength because of what golbez Cecil all the way.
  15. GimliSam: Tough... Beatrix is a very cool character, but I have to go with the hero of the first FF game I beat (not to mention THE quintessential FF Paladin.) Cecil is also probably the better character in terms of story.
  16. Zordrac: Beatrix both looks and fights like a well used tavern whore, Cecil...Lunarian Paladin and King of Baron...oh yeah! And he saved the world.
  17. [[User:Chaosjest : I've never played FF4, but it has dragoons in it and crap! That's friggin awesome (friggin is just random). This guy may or may not be a dragoon (I'm a newb to the game remember?) but I'm a swordsman kind of guy and this guy just looks way more awesome than Beatrix. Cecil all the way.
  18. Bartz235: Cecil for me. Beatrix is probably the best female lead in the whole series. Cecil, you get my vote by a small margin(a very small margin).
Anonymous Votes[edit source]
  1. I prefer Cecil because I love FFIV more than IX. IX was a "eh"to me
  2. Uh....Beatrix wasn't that great you guys, and she's NOTHING compared to Cecil.
  3. Cecil is stronger than Beatrix. Although FFIX is my favorite FF, i cannot go wrong with Cecil. Sorry Beatrix.
  4. EmuMaster: I like Beatrix, she had a decent story, and was fun to play with in those brief times when you did, but Cecil has been, to me, sort of symbolic in the FF series. He was the first "Okay, this is who you are, this is why you're doing what you're doing" character in the series, which I think Final Fantasy thrives on. He also has the story-driven job change (job changing being something of a staple in the series, and a story-driven one being all the better in a game that lacks it otherwise), which is pretty cool. Finally, Cecil is the first character in the series that you can really empathize with, which I think is often important in an RPG to really care about any of the characters. He also "feels" much more like a Paladin, since Beatrix really just gets Steiner's abilities + a few slightly more rapeage ones.
  5. Cecil is awesome, so is Beatrix, but....I mean c'mon Cecil was one of the first great characters of FF. Cecil will always have a special place in my heart for being my first. Plus, Lightbringer pwns SavetheQueen(Though SavetheQueen is still awesome). As EmuMaster said he feels more like a paladin than Beatrix. She's more of a knight/fighter job class. I think Cecil is the ultimate choice. Anyone who playedx through Final Fantasy 4 k nows he went through alot of troubles through the whole game, which made it more rewarding to actually make it to the end of it. Cecil is the best.
  6. I prefer cecil because he is a prodigy of what the propects forsee and what is beatrix?Moogle king 15:17, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
  7. I have played both FFIV, twice or more, and FFIX once. And through it all the story, setting, and chars of FFIV are more mature & interesting to me than the youthful ones of FFIX. Without doubt, Cecil is the one and only Paladin, regardless of what the 'newer' game versions of the Paladin can do.
  8. Je vote pour Cecil! Car il est tellement beaux, le meilleur paladin de Final Fantasy IV.Je vote pas pour un hero de la saga avec des histoire stupide comme Final Fantasy IX! Avec des chevalier tellement moche que les autres! Desoles car je suis francais Excuse-me....
  9. Cecil is a much cooler and deeper characters in my eyes.

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

The reason I don't like a lot of these fight is it puts an Amano character against an FFIX character, and I hate having to vote for the Amano character out of principle and then get flamed as another FFIX hater because that's something I'm not. --Crazyswordsman 23:59, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Aww don't worry CSM, we know it was hard for you to choose. Anyone who says you hate FF IX is just a stupid noobhead. =D TheSwordofDoubt 08:15, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

I'm pretty disappointed that Beatrix's battle sprite is not used, the character box's image looks kinda unblanced now.--N/A

Well I couldn't have a high quality fancy graphic Cecil next to the now crude character sprites from eight years ago, it just wouldn't look balanced. I don't want anyone voting just because the graphics are worse in one picture than another. But if you could get me a more fitting picture of Beatrix in the FMVs I'll put it up. --BlueHighwind
Sadly, I think that's the only scene where Beatrix appears in FMV form. I wish they could have done away with some of the Queen Brahne close-ups (shudder) and replaced them which a "close up" of Beatrix. 8bit BlackMage 16:08, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
Wink wink, eh 8bitBM? -- Drake1
At least this isn't Tifa or Rikku you guys are talking about. If it were.... --Crazyswordsman 07:35, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

Despite the overall greatness of the game, the ending would look much better if it had more CG in it. Specifically the seperate character segments since half of them got almost no FMV screen time. It would have been good, they should have gone all out, it's the last PS1 FF. Ah, well, IX isn't perfect just very very close to it. --AnonyMan

Man...this is hard. Once again, I'm just not voting...I couldn't possibly...Chocobo Knight 16:42, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

Jammi568: So much for FFIX being the underrated game of any of the Final Fantasy games out there. And so much for people saying that all the characters aren't that popular. Bollocks, i say.

EmuMaster: The deal is, it isn't underrated, really. It's just that the obnoxious fanboys of the... let's say sept-octo-numerical games in the series are a lot more numerous and a lot louder. And more annoying. Usually.

's true, IX has loads of fans, especialy amoung older gamers (correct me if i'm wrong, this is just the impression i've got), they just aren't so radicaly 'I'll kill you for not loving Cloud!!!' RedMage

AnonyMan: You find some fans here or there around. But in the grander scale, FFIX is very minute compared to some of the more known or talked about games of the series. For the smaller fanbase I am glad FFIX doesn't get as much hate as VIII which actually gets the same amount of love too.

  • What the hell are you talking about? As a paladin, Cecil has far HP at level 1 then he did in the 20s as a dark knight. As paladin he is stronger in all areas, and he gets much better equipment. To top it off, as a dark knight Cecil's attacks will do one measly point of damage to undead enemies. Omegalink

err... child of ragnarok? in answer to your first question, yes you DO see Cecil do cool stuff with his sword, and, well he is a, y'know HOLY swordsman RedMage

Zordrac: Oi! Keep your comments about FF VIII to yourself.

AnonyMan: Was that directed at me? If so I wasn't trying to make fun of VIII, it's got its flaws but is a good game. It's stil one of the most disliked FF titles though and that's the truth.
I've never quite seen the reason for that, ff x was so, so much worse. And it had great graphics for it's time. Sure the characters were a little, err, lame? but the swords looked cool and it was a decent game, for a certain value of 'decent'. Oh, and my comment was about vii, just in case that comment was directed at me. RedMage

Roy: It's been about 3 weeks why are the battles lasting so long these days?

Dunno, but i wish they'd just end it and put Cecil out of his pain.
I'd make the next match, but I was banned for three seconds when I made this one. So... my hands are pretty much tied. Guess you'll just have to suffer in lives of quiet desperation for now on. --BlueHighwind 20:05, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Last time Cecil got this owned, he was fighting Golbez and Kain... =S -Henryacores

Week 54: Classic Match! Rydia vs. Yuna[edit source]



By a vote of 37.5 to 26.
FFX Artwork Yuna.png
This is the second in a series of two of our first matches here, now redesigned while there's more people here!

User Votes for Rydia[edit source]

  1. Crazyswordsman: Duh. Black Magic >>>> White Magic for a Mage because Rydia knows Drain, which takes care of all her healing problems. Rydia also has access to Odin, the best summon ever. Rydia is from the second best game in the series; Yuna's game is only above average. Rydia is an independent, strong girl who has kickass lines and doesn't bow down to Edge's constant flirting, while Yuna pretty much is a damsel in distress character who is willing to believe everything Tidus says (and considering it's Tidus, that actually does say something). Rydia doesn't need her Summons, while Yuna does. Yuna's voice is one of the worst in the entire series; Rydia is far and above the need for a voice. Last but not least, Rydia's looks are so badass and so sexy at the same time, while Yuna's make her look like a flower girl. In conclusion, Rydia, the first named Summoner, is the best by far in this fight.
  2. Chief: This really was hard for me. For one, both are hot. Also, like CSM said, Rydia is hot and badass at the same time. But, all boys at some time or another (like or not) have had fantasies about rescuing a damsel in distress, so Yuna's the prime candidate there. But then I realized something. There's no FFIV-2.
  3. 8bit_BlackMage: Why was this fight picked? Rydia is going to slaughter Yuna. Slaughter. Expect the girl in green to win by at least 20 votes.
  4. Oath to Order: She has Bahamut. The single coolest summon ever. And various other reasons I will not put.
  5. dudutsai: They would be about equally matched in battle, but Rydia an infinately better character.
  6. Otherarrow: Rydia is better than Yuna. Too tired to explain the obvious today.
  7. Faethin: Poor Yuna.
  8. User:Alexander Namingway: Personality wise Yuna was far too meek. Summon wise Rydia had Mist Dragon, Odin, and Asura while Yuna had Ixion and...the Magus Sisters. Although to be fair Valefor, Anima, and Yojimbo and prime examples of awesome.
  9. The Hexed: A year ago I would have voted for Yuna, but now that I have seen the DS rendering of Rydia...
  10. Adam Mcduck: I really don't like Rydia or Yuna that much. I thought I liked Yuna more than Rydia though, but really I liked Yuna for Anima, not Yuna herself.
  11. JAP: Rydia because I personally hate Yuna. Seriously, she's too weak and too damsel-in-distress stereotype. C'mon, Rydia's one of the best heroines ever existed!
  12. Shinryu: I really don't know if Yuna is good or not, but she looks like a typical girl who always needs to be rescued by someone. But I find Rydia better, because she has good summons und Bahamut is a real kickass and the best thing is that it has no element, and for me are black mages more badass than white mages.
  13. Chocobo Knight: Rydia is better, though as a kid she can be annoying, and I'm not a big fan of Yuna (though she is tolerable). As an adult, she is hot (in that picture, anyway...and it always helps if the person in question is very hot), and her character is better
  14. User: Pikmin Master: I may have reasons to not vote for Rydia, A)I always perfered White Magic, B)FFX Shiva looks better than FFIV Shiva, C) Drain and Osmose suck in FF4, and D) I started FF with X. Yet, A)Rydia's Black Magic are ever-useful, considering 2 of ther partners (and Cecil) use White Magic anyways, B)Mist Dragon and Meteor, C) What JAP said, D)LOOK AT HER! Her looks OWN Yuna's, and finally E) If both of their summon abilities are gone, which happened to Yuna, Rydia can Overkill Yuna.
  15. Drake Clawfang:Does anyone need to ask why I'm voting for Rydia, seriously? Sexy, independent, strong, Summoner, Black Mage, heroine and a good backstory...I've said it before and I'll say it again, Rydia is everything I want from a RPG female.
  16. Roman King: Yuna doesn't stand a chance against Rydia.
  17. AnonyMan: I don't care about their different preference in Magics, IX has two characters which do Blk/Wht Magic better than everyone else. Although I've never played FFIV still, I do like its cast. Unlike FFX's, which aside from Kimahri and Wakka is lame as Hell. Rydia all the way.
  18. sjoerd777 Rydia of course, anything that even manages to get near zidane´s coolness is rydia.
  19. Ansantran This is a hard one i like both of them. I like white magic more then black. Though Yuna was in FFX-2 and that game is just trash, and shes in love with the worst hero in any ff, Tidus. Plus FFIV is my favorite.
  20. MizunoMahou: She's probably one of my favorite FF characters in general simply because she has both Black Magic and Summon Magic. Plus, she looks awesome in the DS version. Yuna (from FFX, not X-2) is good, too, but not nearly as good as Rydia.
  21. PapaBear:I will go with Rydia on this one, she was a great character in the game. I liked the summons in FFX more then Yuna.
  22. VitoRyu: Rydia. There really is no competition here.
  23. Alcaeus: While I prefer White Magic+Summoning more than Black Magic+Summoning, Rydia is definately the better character. If this were Rydia vs. Garnet, I would have a somewhat more difficult time choosing who I liked better.
  24. Resa91: I vote for Rydia. Yuna imbarassed herself in ffx-2.
  25. Xmd5a: X Yuna is bland and boring. X-2 Yuna is annoying. Rydia is pretty cool, so wins by default.
  26. LDBAMC: I grew up with Rydia, and still think she's awesome. There's no contest here.
  27. J525: I found it really hard to decide. Both are summoners. Both are female. I've never played IV but it's unfair to choose because of this. I've never played X-2 either. In the end it came down to Black > White in magic.
  28. Kainos: Rydia has everything Yuna doesnt she has the green hair...the skimpy clotheing you name it.
  29. Some Color Mage: Black Magic is a hell of a lot better than White Magic, no questions asked. And FFIV is better than FFX as well.
  30. Sexy and has a whip. :D Flameskewer
  31. Cactuar83:Yuna, you suck.
  32. craigrules14: she can summon and cast black magic, and she saves your ass when golbez almost fucks u up. all yuna has that counts for shit is her wired ass aeons, which i only used when i had to....
  33. ExecrateXMeXBaby: I'm going to have to say Rydia. Call it nostalgia, if you will, but any character from the earlier games (Er, well, excluding V, because I didn't much care for it) would dominate any of the new-fangled characters in the series. Rydia is an awesome character because: she has one of the more touching story lines in the FF series; the whip is one of the more obscure weapons in the series and also one of the most amazing; it's fairly wonderful to watch poor little Rydia, hanging out in the back row, all-of-a-sudden step forward and cast an all-consuming Meteo spell; her character isn't overkill- that is, she is NOT all-powerful or ominous as Yuna tends to become later in the game (where is the challenge in casting Anima? I mean, come on!); she's a strong woman (well, after she BECOMES a woman, that is)- she doesn't jiggle back and forth behind a staff and "pray" for her comrades- she throws down, gets the job done, takes out her whip and paralyzes herself a King Ryu! (*this is the point where all the old school fans scream "RY-Di-A!" fanatically in unison*)
Anonymous Votes[edit source]
  1. Random Anonymous Person: Well, Rydia is just plain awesome in nearly every way. On the other hand, Yuna was alright in X, but in X-2 she turned into another hyperactive sugary girly-girl. Yeah, she deserved a break, but she didn't have to give up any integrity and aura of authority that she might have had before.
  2. Because Rydia is sexier!
  3. TheCrimsonKing: wow, I'm amazed Rydia is winning this one, especially considering alot of the great chars from the earlier FFs don't make it past later ones because of improved graphics or just general ignorance. Yuna is a tad irritating as a character and I have to agree with the sentiments of Random Anonymous Person above.
  4. Troy: For nostalgia's sake I will vote for Rydia, even if summoning and black magic seem like overkill. Had to have a black mage and a summoner in the final party I suppose.
  5. Because she is so damn SEXY! thats why.
  6. Rydia is just better; nicer and stronger
  7. EmuMaster: Rydia has access to both types of magic for a while, then gets just the apocalyptic one. Yuna has access to some filler summons because it would have felt awkward having Ramuh, the REAL thunder summon. Rydia has the usage of whips, one of the coolest weapons you can use, if done right. Yuna uses a stick that looks like it'd shatter if actually hit against any of the monsters save perhaps flans. Rydia's boyfriend is the third coolest character in the series. Yuna has the third most annoying main character in the series. And yes, Rydia is very, very sexy.
  8. Rasmus: Yuna aggravates me. She almost reaches Cloud's level of angst. Rydia, on the other hand, can not only call upon the Gods themselves, but has access to a wide variety of black magic.
  9. Rydia learns summons on her own and doesn't have to go pray for them, that rocks!

User Votes for Yuna[edit source]

  1. Shyny: I didn't play FF IV so i don't know Rydia, but Yuna isn't all that bad as you say. She has strong determination and her summons were, especially in my party, absolutely essential.
  2. Hiron: I vote yuna (despite her obvious loss) because she's quite an inspiring character. despite her whole beliefs being destroyed and having lost her love, she still pushes through. wish there were more people like her in the real world today, most people would just commit suicide after all that.
  3. BlueHighwind: And yet somehow despite the opinion of so many here, I like Yuna better. Why? It may have something to do with Anima.
  4. Taro: I suppose for me, it has something to do with my first mainstream FF game being FFX-2. Other than that, I suppose I enjoyed being able to use the Aeons as characters, instead of just quick spells that drain a ton of MP in usual Final Fantasies. There's also something about how she interacts with her summons in one way or another, and.... oh, who am I kidding? I just picked Yuna because I am more used to her, over Rydia....
  5. TheSwordofDoubt: Yuna. I'm thinking of buying FF X even though I've already seen the whole of Amber(GoingCrazy201) 's walkthrough.
  6. PhoenixDew: Yay Yuna!!! It's the eyes that got me, so cool one blue one green :D
  7. Mr. Rojo: Yuna is one of my favorites characters, althought Rydia is awesome. Rydia had black magic that was cool, but we are able to use the aeons! Also with the sphere grid you can give Yuna black magic.
  8. MYVizm: I vote for Yuna because I like her more than Rydia. I admit she was a little annoying in X-2 but I really liked her in X.
  9. ShadowLaguna: I'm more fond of Yuna. Besides, I like her summons more.
  10. Pinoyzidane: Gotta be Yuna. Of all the FF characters in any games, she's the one who's gone under so many changes in her lifetime. in the beginning she was a weak summoner who couldn't hold her own in battle, always needing people to protect her. but as she grew older she became more independent, trading in her wand for a set of guns. I admire her for being able to go through such a change, but still keep her kind and gentle personality. -btiensvold (brian)
  11. Masamune: Yuna's going to lose, but I have to give my vote to Yuna. She's like the younger sister I like better than the one I have.
  12. RedMage: I know she's gonna lose, so i feel a little sorry for her, she gets my vote.
  13. booff7: I know she stands absolutely no chance whatsoever but I prefer Yuna to Rydia. Yuna is actually one of my favorite female characters of the series. Plus, she is the only summoner I ever actually liked using. Rydia was decent but I prefer Yuna by a mile.
  14. Rach24 Her summons are awesome and I really liked her as a character.
  15. Judge Zarbi: I don't have a clue about which game Rydia was off, but FFX rocks. 'Nuff said.
  16. Lockhart: I haven't had the pleasure of meeting Rydia yet, but I will soon. But I am big fan of Yuna. She is a great character with lots of change.
  17. Fyrmer: I loved her in FF-X, and I even loved her in X-2. But I really hated her in KH2. Still, she get my vote, 'cause I never really was a big fan of Rydia.
  18. HIMBO: Yunie, for several reasons. A) I haven't played FFIV. B) I've always enjoyed Yuna, and I can't see why so many people dislike her. C) She doesn't have enough votes. D) There is no d, but she still gets my vote!
  19. StijnX FFX was my first FF so it's got a special place in my heart, but seeing Yuna do, in one turn, 199,998 HP damage by doublecasting Ultima for 2MP is just amazing
  20. Triforcel I'm going to go with Yuna. Her summons are much more powerful than Rydia's and you can build her into any archetype you want with a little work on the sphere grid.
  21. Super Sephiroth: I love them both so i just randomly voted.
  22. Drake: She is more useful, plus Rydia's magic is riddled with bugs in all versions of Final Fantasy IV that I've played. Actually, this is just a pity vote.
Anonymous Votes[edit source]
  1. Yumiko:Um okkay. Normally I would vote for black mage but I just couldn't. Yuna may be sweet and inocent but she can still do some awesome stuff. Her summons are like an extra party member and they have their own special abilites and overdrives. Plus she can do more damage. And Anima. On a side note I dont really like black magic and summoning toghther. It was given to white mages for a reason.
  2. That picture of Rydia is so damn hot, but Yuna wins because FFX was just a better game and the characters were more interesting than FFIV's including Yuna.
  3. yuna. she was one of my best characters in ff10, plus i like her more
  4. Rydia looks like a bellydancer now. I hate that. Yuna while in X2 lost it, but in X she was noble and kind-hearted. I like women characters like. If a woman is hot but acts like a whore, no thanks.
  5. Rinoa - nnnnnnnoooooooooooooooo two of the best characters, im drawn in the middle and tactically voting for yuna because rydia is gonna win. yuna made ffx the amazing game that it is, her determination and drive despite the ultimate sacrifise involved in bringing the calm, and hence hope and happyness along with it, i like rydia but her story doesnt have the same emotional side as yunas does, but this was really hard
  6. Rainacide - I have to vote for Yuna, and no not the FFX-2 Yuna but the FFX Yuna, if it was FFX-2 Yuna Vs. Rydia it wulda been a different story, Yuna is sexy the way she was in FFX & I liked her personality, reminds me of some emo bitch.
  7. Voting for Yuna because she can do 99999 damage 0_0 What other spellcaster that you know of can do that?
  8. Yuna kicks ass fact.

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Sorry I was so late. I pretty much spent all day making a sprite comix (and for those of you who say these things take no should see the time I take making some of the frames. Some of them take like 20 minutes to make!) --Crazyswordsman 02:53, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

Cool! what comic do you do and where can i find it? --RedMage

Also, BH, you're voting on the Summoner, not the Summon. --Crazyswordsman 02:53, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

I still like Yuna better. --BlueHighwind 02:54, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
How the hell can ANYONE like Yuna? That's like saying Tidus is cool. --Crazyswordsman 03:01, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
I like Yuna too. I guess that it's because she was really brave through it all, and she stuck to her conviction even when everything she based her life on and had always believed in all betrayed and shattered around her. Oh, and also because of FF X-2. TheSwordofDoubt 03:40, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

Why is Rydia's picture so small?--ChiefKakashi 02:59, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

8bit_BlackMage: So that people, especially Drake Clawfang, don't enter sexual frenzies. In Yuna's case, there isn't any danger.
So? Tifa got a normal sized pic--ChiefKakashi 03:05, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
Drake Clawfang:Sorry disciple, didn't work ><.

Why does this feel like another one sided fight where CSM is pulling all the strings? Next time, please put a fight that might actually be a fight. Oath to Order 03:09, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

Like Cloud vs. Squall? Wait...That would probaly be one sided, too...--ChiefKakashi 03:13, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
I would actually find a fight like that to be very difficult "Which one sucks the least?" --Crazyswordsman 03:18, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
Cloud.--ChiefKakashi 03:22, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
You're actually right. Cloud sucks. But Squall blows. --Crazyswordsman 03:24, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
Squall seems like they took Cloud, then tinkered with his looks, gave his sword a gun barrel, then changed the actual character, and not for the better. Just my opinion.--ChiefKakashi 03:27, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
I was thinking about something like Shadow (best ninja ever) against Edge or the FFI Ninja. Oath to Order 03:30, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

"I don't like Black Magic and Summoning together." Okay. FFIV was the first game with a named Summoner. And she could also use Black Magic. And the quotes from the game "You're a Caller; Black Magic should be easy for you" seem to suggest Summoners should use Black Magic, not White Magic. Also, the purpose of Summoning isn't to do massive damage; it's easy crowd control. --Crazyswordsman 06:41, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

It also helps with keeping pyschos out of your yard, dealing with pesky next door neighbors and threats. Oh, and CSM, you do know that every game in the main series is in their own separate universe right? That black magic rule might only apply to summoners in the FFIV universe. Ever thought of that? Oath to Order 07:24, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
I agree here, FF4 is its own game, so just because Black Magic and Summoning exist together doesn't mean it is a typical thing in all FFs. Though I don't think it is. I think that quote only means "You can use Summoning, so any other Magic shouldn't be a hassle". And I agree with many others. Overkill on damaging magic...anyway, I'm voting Rydia anyway, because she is better. Though I'm not a big fan of either ~Chocobo Knight
You guys, this comment was a response to one of the anon votes ("They gave them White Magic for a reason."), as if that's what Summoners are supposed to have. Why is it always me who gets criticized for my beliefs and not anyone else? --Crazyswordsman 16:59, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
Whoah, CSM, I'm sorry if I criticized your beliefs...I didn't mean to...Chocobo Knight 14:59, 25 January 2008 (UTC)
'Cos you criticize everyone else for theirs? Also, in responce to the 'Tifa had a normal sized pic.', please, please, oh God, PLEASE tell me that doesn't means what i think it means. --RedMage
It means that her actual picture wasn't tiny. What did you think I was talking about?--ChiefKakashi 20:34, 25 January 2008 (UTC)
Yumiko: OKay. What I meant was that they gave summoning to white mages because they will be more useful in battle. Black mages already has offensive magic but if you also give them summoning it seems a bit too powerful.
In my day, White Mages used bows and arrows. --Crazyswordsman 21:31, 19 January 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, White Mages were better with bows, arrows and hammers than with the weakest weapons in the history of FFs they have today. Some Color Mage
Agreed, Rosa wasn't a fighter like Cecil or Kain, but she was a good shot with the Bow and potent when needed. Rydia's whips were alright, but hell, she had summons and black magic, she didn't need good weapons. Drake Clawfang

Falbub: Yuna... Rydia... AAAAA! I can't decide! Yuna is strong and brave and she had to go through a lot, and so did Rydia! I cannot choose between my fellow summoners!

Darkling692: I Can´t decide either, I find them both too boring

AnonyMan: What happened? FFX used to popular as hell(or maybe it was just me). I guess because of X-2 it's become a joke everyone mocks now.

LDBAMC: Just because it's popular doesn't mean that it's any good. Final Fantasy IV may become more popular, but it'll still remain good. Rydia FTW is all I really wanted to say.

Thunor: Can we shorten the battles they go on for way to long, can't we just get to the next?

Troy: I was thinking these last couple of battles have lasted a lot longer than older ones, also.

Week 53: Classic Match! Zidane Tribal vs. Tidus[edit source]

Zidane Tribal character.png
Zidane Tribal character.png

By a vote of 46 to 15.
FFX Artwork Tidus.png
This is the first in a series of two of our first matches here, now redesigned while there's more people here!

User Votes for Zidane[edit source]

  1. Hiron: i vote zidane for five reasons: *zidane gets the girl in the end (Im not counting X-2 because tidus coming back like that is just stupid). *Zidane is a theif *Zidane has a tail *zidanes an angel of death *i can make more sense out of zidane coming back at the end than tidus did in X-2.
  2. Crazyswordsman: I've said this once and I'll say it again. Zidane rules. He's one of the best heroes in the series. Why, you ask? Well, he's not whiny, emo, or a jerk. He's just a regular guy. He's probably the only hero I'd like to hang around. He cares deeply for others and is just a real people person. He also controls his emotions very well. The one time he freaked out, a really good song played. And he evolves as a true hero quite a bit. Tidus didn't have that. Instead, he was a huge whinefest the entire game.
  3. Lockhart: I actually like Tidus. I think he's an interesting character. But he is nowhere near the awesomeness of Zidane. Zidane is better cause he doesn't follow to mold.
  4. AnonyMan: CS hit every mjor point as to why Zidane's the best Main character in the series and just plain awesome as well. FFIX has the best cast of characters(as stated the most overlooked and underrated as well), he and many others from the game don't have and actually deserve HALF the amount of popularity as losers like Cloud and Auron get. I can't see why anyone would vote for Tidus he's got nothing going for him, and his crew would get eaten alive by Zidane's pals in coolness.
  5. Mymindislost: Love Zidane, hate Tidus. 'Nuff said. :P
  6. Zario:Never played FF9, but I never really liked Tidus so much.
  7. Blue。 Finally a new fight! Vote goes to Zidane for being the Magicite Madness champion's friend (and lots of other reasons I don't want to write here)!! WOohoo!
  8. MK: Haha. I actually had this argument with another user Unfortunatly, I convinced her Tidus won but I know Zidane's better. He's the angel of Death and a theif and Tidus doesn't exist so almost everyone beats Tidus.
  9. Mangartist: Zidane, for pretty much everything Crazyswordsman said, plus I'm big on humor and Zidane was frikkin' hilarious troughout the entire game.
  10. I don't mind Tidus as much as most people, but still Zidane rules, and most of the reasons are above, I don't feel the need to repeat them.~Chocobo Knight
  11. BlueHighwind: Tidus sucks, Zidane rules. That's all I need to say.
  12. Masamune: "HA-HA-HA-HA-HA!" I hate Tidus so much. Sure, Zidane was corny, but it was a nice kind of corny, and he wasn't a whiny bitch.
  13. AzureDrake: if this was based on how much i liked the games, it would be many moons before i could choose one. however, this is a character battle and tidus despite being in the better game is a bitch. end of story good bye
  14. Falbub: Voting for Zidane here for one reason: He is not Tidus. I've never even played FFIX and I don't think I have to to know that it's 69 times better then X.
  15. Otherarrow: Zidane is better than Tidus. And most other theif class characters for that matter.
  16. dudutsai: Zidane was corny in an annoying way, but when he "freaked out", he was so much cooler for it for the 15 minutes it lasted. Still, he is a hell of a lot better than Tidus, who I wanted to gag the whole time I was playing.
  17. TacticAngel: There are few times I can claim to be both voting for someone as well as voting against someone else.
  18. 8bit_BlackMage: Does Tidus need to buried in yet another poll by a insanely huge margin? I think so. Polearms ftw.
  19. GimliSam: Zidane is cool, Tidus is not. Besides, who else can drop exploding treasure chests on your enemies?
  20. Hexed: Because I just hate Tidus
  21. Fyrmer: I like Tidus well enough, but Zidane is by far my favourite Final Fantasy protagonist to date.
  22. Ansantran: I cant say it enough, i hate Tidus, he isnt half the hero Zidane is.
  23. Alcaeus: Zidane is the best main character and easily the greatest thief in the series. Tidus is the worst main character in the series. He's actually worse than Squall, who at least understood that it's best just to stay quiet if you have something stupid to say. Tidus NEVER knew when to shut the fuck up! Then there was Tidus' voice...ugh! I wish Tidus died 5 seconds into the game rather than at the end of it. Oh wait he didn't die, it turns out he was a DREAM and he never really existed. Tidus is soooooooo lame. Zidane, on the other hand, actually wants to help people, he's a leader(which is something Cloud, Squall, and Tidus were not) and he wasn't whiny!
  24. Otens: Idiot who can always get the ladies XD
  25. Alexander Namingway: Zidane interacted with the world and the cities in funny and interesting ways. Tidus floundered around like a goofy dork (perhaps because he didn't belong?). Zidane dealt heavy attacks and had thief skills. I used Yuna, Auron, and Lulu in my party and saved tidus for Blitzball. Brotherhood was really cools. Double swords are cooler.
  26. Nelo:aww....I was hoping to see Dissidia Zidane's image.
  27. Kainos:Zidane is just like cloud squall and other main Characters...but he has something they dont! hes Got a name one Main Character with a monkey tail!!!!
  28. SaviourSeph: I don't really like either of them much, but Zidane wins on account of not having an obnoxious Californian accent (also I vastly prefered FFIX to FFX, so this probably has something to do with it too).
  29. VitoRyu: Zidane.
  30. Drake Clawfang:Zidane grabbed Garnet's ass on-screen and raised the bar for FF-sexuality all on his own. Don't know who Tidus is and don't care. Did he grab Yuna's ass on-screen? Unless he did so, no thanks. And besides that hentai-comment, Zidane is just awesome.
  31. Roman King: Tidus was my second best character in FFX behind Auron, but Zidane would kill him. I didn't like Zidane as much as the other characters in FFIX, though.
  32. Sabata82: Zidane: Faster. Stronger. Better.
  33. pinoyzidane: zidane is definitely going to win. zidane is faster (everybody knows that). he is the only character that wields a dual bladed naginata, that ultima weapon was the best weapon i've seen so far. fuck blitz ace, have you seen zidane perform grand lethal??? zidane is just going to kick tidus' ass man, enough said.
  34. Taro:Zidane: Although I did like playing through X and such, it was more for the overall story than just Tidus. Instead of overly sporty crybaby Tidus, I guess I'll go with the overheroic monkey tailed thief instead. Both are quite contradictory if you think to hard, but Zidane takes the vote for me because to me, stealing items from monsters is much better than Blitzball....
  35. Resa91: I don't like Zidane that much but compared to Tidus, he is more better main character. Tidus was annoying and stupid, and I didn't enjoyed playing ffx because of him.
  36. Xadren: He's got my vote, he's my favourite character after Cloud and I like his life's think.
  37. Darkling692: There's not much left to say in favor of Zidane, but what makes him different from other main characters and gains my vote is that he really is a leader, and a great one at that and not an Emo kid. I doubt that Tidus could've handled Quina or Amarant.
  38. BigSlurp: I had a thought about Zidane. Since the writer of the game was the same guy who did Dragonball Z, Zidane is more or less a Sayjin warrior. Too bad the game didn't give him a super mode. But the fact that he gets the girl in the end doesn't hurt, because many FF characters cannot claim that.
  39. RufusS: My favourite would have to be....Zidane. I really enjoy playing Final Fantasy IX, even though I have completed FFX, but I can kind of relate to Zidane, he wants to protect the ones he loves, but to me he doesn't want to be a hero to impress everyone unlike Tidus who wants to be with Yuna, but can't because he is dead in a way, also he tries to crash Yuna's wedding, and not be happy for her choice in life. But Zidane (even though he loves Garnet) let's her get on with her life, but isn't that what you do when you love someone?
  40. Jenerix525: Zidane . <--- Full stop. That's a full stop. Tidus may be fast, but Zidane would kick his weak little ass. The only bonus to Tidus is the ability to personalise his skills, sphere grid. Zidane can still kick his ass on every level.
Anonymous Votes[edit source]
  1. Zidane is probably the most under-rated main character in the series. (IX being the most under-rated game)
  2. This would be an interesting fight. Both are very quick fighters, and both have the Ultima Weapon (Tidus' best weapon was named this in Japan). But the big differance is Zidane does not play blitzball, making him 10 times cooler. Plus Grand Lethal > Blitz Ace
  3. RMX (too lazy to log in) - Never really played FFIX, but I HATE Tidus... And FFX.
  4. EmuMaster: Yeah. This was as difficult as... There quite simply isn't anything as easy as Zidane vs. Whiny Little Bitch. Z's a badass and a ladies' man. Tidus spends one extremely uncomfortable scene fake-laughing and raising my blood pressure. Zidane wields a weapon that can only be described as "totally freaking awesome." Tidus uses that old tired formula of "Main character gets a sword."
  5. Random Anonymous Person: Tidus just annoys me. He's an arrogant little boy, and he still ticks me off even when he's supposed to have "matured". Zidane is very awesome.
  6. Some random dude:He´s one of the characters that,s acctually funny.
  7. Katie: Zidane is my favourite FF character. Why? Because he kicks butt. And he's cute in that cheezy ladies man kind of way. Tidus is just annoying, I don't know how Yuna could have fallen for such an ignorant bum. Besides.. have you SEEN the Zorlin Shape lately? How freaking awesome!
  8. I agree that Zidane is one the most underated characters. Come on if it wasnt for Zidane, the ideal for Tidus would not have even been! Theyd probably have kept doing Emo's such as Cloud and Squall. Plus, Zidane is stronger then he looks, his Trance abilites rock. I also have to say that the only reason is that some of the people of their are not voting for him cause they havent played FF IX or dont like his tail. They are not open minded.
  9. ReatardChristian Zidane all the way, Tidus may have some pull as "the cool guy" from some of the fanboys, but the simple fact is that Zidane was sent from another world to be the Angel of Death and Tidus was sent from another world to be...uh...a guy who asks stupid questions and whines a lot.
  10. I haven't played FFIX throughout (due to disks being scratched) and while I have played FFX I ALWAYS enjoyed 9 for Zidane. He's in a class by himself. He's not emo yet he isn't overly hyper, he's not stupid person who knows nothing about the world he's in yet he doesn't know everything like Auron, and most of all he's a thief! Always loved how in FFIX there were so many goodies you could get off of bosses, the steal skill was actually VERY useful because of him.
  11. SentientRace Alright, well, considering the fact that Zidane actually gets over his childhood problems whereas Tidus ends up crying like a pussy, I'd have to say Zidane gets my vote. I don't mind Tidus all that much, but truly, he needs to get over his problems. Zidane was the only character, out of the last few Final Fantasy games (VII, VIII, IX, X & XII) that moves on with his life and just stops crying about the fact that he got picked on as a kid by his 'brothers' and all of that. Tidus is always complaining about how he has a dad that sucks (which, really, isn't that big of a deal, compared to what Zidane had to go through, and for the third time, Zidane got OVER THAT, unlike Tidus.) Plus. He goes super saiyan. =d Which is much cooler than a human that can hold his breath underwater for more than 3 hours.
  12. Yumiko: Zidane is the angel of death. Enough said. Oh and I don't really like the trance/limit thingy in IX, way too short

User Votes for Tidus[edit source]

  1. Tuga: Hmm.. a guy with a tail? No ty
  2. Saje: Tidus was Final Fantasy X. Sure at first he whined but who wouldn't. I connected with him because he really was genuine. On top of that he had that drivreally shined in battle, character development, love and had some great lines. Way better at dealing with love and dressing then Zidane. Even Amano's conceptual art looked cooler. All in all Tidus was a great character that can't be replaced and I honestly fought hard to get him back to Yuna in X-2. His narration of X was amazing! Tidus you rock!
  3. FFFan: You guys I'm BACK! We were at my grandparents for all of break so we couldn't work on the FFV enemies, but uh....a lot has changed. We lost a lot of people but gained new people as well, which is always good. Anyways Tidus is awesome, and so is Zidane but I like Tidus better. Saje pretty much said everything and his theme was awesome too, but yeah Zidane wasn't that great in battle and I think that the reason most people think that FFX sucks is because of the slack of SquareEnix for FFX. They could've done so much better, with the voice acting, an actual overworld and REAL airship system, longer script, etc. Also in Japan Tidus's voice actor was sooooooo much better than James Arnold Taylor, as his voice wasn't so childish and whiny. But yeah...Tidus for me!
  4. Chief:Pity vote.
  5. TSD: Flipped a coin(well an eraser really, but who cares?).
  6. Yuna997: Tidus. Purely because Zidane sucks.
  7. Mr. Rojo: I think both Tidus and Zidane are great. It was really hard to choose, but at the end I think I like Tidus a little more and also there are very few votes for him.
  8. DrakemasterDrake: What the hell! I just saw a really bad anime and it reminded me that Zidane is pretty much a really crappy anime character. Tidus, I like him, I don't see why everyone hates him so much. Not once is he too annoying. He's just trying to keep his cool after he went to another world. I'd be pretty freaked out too. Cut the guy some slack.
  9. BlackBelt11: I vote for Tidus because 1. I've never played FFIX and 2. He may be whiney, but at least he has good taste in clothes and doesn't have a tail.
  10. Fflover: Tidus would so clearly win! it's a joke to say monkey boy could win against Tidus!
  11. Hiroplat:uh Tidus could kick zidane around a room all day long
Anonymous Votes[edit source]

1. Arceval: Tidus all the way. In every possible way, Tidus is better than Zidane. Attacks, character design, weapon, storyline, up to and including getting the better girl. Tidus was an engaging character, and while the story was hurt a bit by not hearing his name, he is featured in some of the most memorable scenes of Final Fantasy history; the night by the lake, the farewell scene, and of course, the otherworld blitzball scene.

2. Archangel: Tidus all the way. Zidane is weak as hell

3. hariboboy: Tidus, enough said

4. Steel-Sentry: Tidus, for reasons already stated. Also, his "whining", or at least what I remember of it, was about his father being a monster who killed hundreds of people weekly and the fact that his friends were suicidal. Personally I don't know anyone who wouldn't freak out.

5. Zidane has a tail. Come on, that's just silly.

6. Zidane was really cool, but Tidus just made a better main chracter.

7. One thing i liked the most out of the final fantasy series was X mainly for the story line but anyway ffX was the best so tidus gets my vote

8. Tidus is more like a hero, so I will vote him!!

Go Tidus!!!

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

AnonyMan: Can't get any better than Zidane, as far as Main characters go, he was the Apex of greatness by far. He's beats all the others by leaps and bounds. Even Vaan who is pretty cool(best since Mr. Tribal) despite some gripes people have with him and his "purpose" can't see him. But alas he's not in or from FFVII so he's probably forever doomed to drift into near obscurity.

CrimsonDragoon's target: how is this a "classic" match? maybe zidane vs balthier but not this

Otens: Dood, I so keep trying to get them into doing it. Maybe they should add Revenant wings characters to some matches. Like for example: Golbez versus Lloyd, stange mix but it may produce an interesting "battle" or the other word that escapes my mind.
dudutsai: It has already been done. People who haven't played one game usually vote for the one they have played. Zario and Falbub's votes made me laugh because it proves how much Tidus sucked.
Falbub: Always glad to be of service. *bows*

Henryacores: I want to vote for Zidane, but I have no arguments cause I didn't play IX...Plus, nothing owns Blitz Ace.

FFFan: Poor Tidus....anyways I have to quit this wiki because I'm moving to my uncle's place for the rest of my college, and their internet sucks. See ya guys.

TacticAngel: Personally, I'm not running out of ideas, but I haven't been updating this for about a month now. I think CSM has some stuff he wants to do and thats cool. If you have suggestions, you can always consult the talk page!

AzureDrake: if this was based on who would beat whom by their story-lined strength, Zidane would defeat Tidus. Zidane is the fucking ANGEL OF DEATH made by Garland! I mean cmon! Sephiroth (on a totally different note) took on the image of an angel at the end of FFVII but Zidane has the power to rival gods. All Tidus has on his side is that memories are very, very hard to kill :D}}

Alcaeus: Umm...Drakey-poo, you do realize that you're beloved Final Fantasy 7 is a crappy anime. Not only that, but Tidus is anime. All of the FFs are anime.

Otherarrow: Why do people care that Zidane has a tail? I think it makes him unique.

No it makes him AWESOME! I wish I had a tail, or wings, or vampire fangs, or a third eye, or a crazy demon eye hidden under an eyepatch that can blow people up when I take it out, or a second head, or boobs. Okay that last one was pretty weird, but I stand by all the others. --BlueHighwind 23:28, 14 January 2008 (UTC)
I agree with BH. The tail suits Zidane for the kind of person he is. --Crazyswordsman 02:38, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

8bit_BlackMage: I want glowing yellow eyes and an awesome mage hat. And the physical ability to incinerate anything with a boiling point under 100000 degrees Celsius.}}

N/A: Tidus has good taste in clothes? Blasphemy!!!!

Yumiko: ...I thought I already voted...

Chief: Please...end it already! It's been more than a week now!

AnonyMan: Indeed, this was over 3 days ago.

Chief: Yeah, the score so far is 52 to 19. Don't really think Tidus is getting a comeback.

Week 52 The championship!!! 1. Vivi Orunitia vs. 1. Kain Highwind[edit source]

Crystal1.jpgFF WIKIA'S
Vivi Ornitier character.jpg
Vivi Ornitier character.jpg

By a score of 50 to 23.5
Kain DS CG Render.png
In the red corner, he slayed the Mysidian Twins, scorched Panelo, chilled Celes, jolted Rydia, flared up Bahamut and cast Ultima on Tifa, he's the cuddly Black Mage, the champion of all mages, top seeded VIVI ORUNITIA!!!! And in the blue corner, he stabbed Tidus, he avoided Beatrix's Shock attack, he ended the bitter rivalry between him and his friend Cecil, he showed Auron that drinking isn't always fun, he overpowered Freya and he beat the mastermind Dr. Cid, the master Dragoon, the legend himself, the high flying wonder, the champion of knights, top seeded KAIN HIGHWIND!!!!

User Votes for 1. Vivi[edit source]

  1. Welcome To The NHK 13:56, 7 January 2008 (UTC): Well Vivi Has A Special Place in My Heart Because FFIX Was The First Final Fantasy I Completed From Start To Finish & Him Being I Kingdom Hearts 2 Only Cemented That Decision
  2. Hiron: LOL! Wow, just a few hours and vivis got almost a twenty point lead. I knew the little guy could pull through! I'm stickin with my argument, kain may have his jump and seniority, but vivis biggest strength is his trance, Double Black. Four Ultimas in two turns and kains nothin but a small sizzling pile of atoms! Thats a good little machine of ultimate destruction.
  3. BlueHighwind: Even though I'm personally a Dragoon, I'm voting against Kain. He's not the greatest character ever, nor is he even the greatest Dragoon - that title belongs to Freya. Also Vivi is a fucking Black Mage, and a playa. Remember how he got eight kids in six months? Oh yeah, that kid has got the bitches on a string (I think its the bulge in his pants). Let's go Vivi, kick his ass!! I want blood!! KILL HIM!!! KILL HIM!!!
  4. Mymindislost: Vivi for me, please. ^_^
  5. AzureDrake: Holy crap, I just got back here after a few weeks or so. I seriously didn't think these two would win against the fanatics or w/e. Anywho, vote for Vivi :D
  6. Hecko X: Vivi just HAS to win, it's the rule of the universe: The underdog always pulls through in the end. After coming this far, how can people NOT vote him?
  7. Azul: What Hecko said!!! Hands down, Vivi is the best.
  8. Renmiri Vivi!!! (*fangirl screech *) {{grin}}
  9. The Anti-BH: Now this is a hard choice. However, Vivi is one of the best characters in Final Fantasy of all time, and Kain is also. So I'm gonna pull a BH here and vote for whoever's winning.
  10. 8bit_BlackMage: The underdog? rofl. It gives me tears of joy to see Vivi come this far, but I didn't expect anything less. No offense to Kain, great character, but I do believe a Meteor can hit things in mid-Jump. VIVI ALL THE WAY!!!!!!
  11. TacticAngel: I think I predicted Vivi would win it all, and he deserves to. Kain is pretty neat, but he's not even the best dragoon, let alone the best character.
  12. Lockhart: I cant definitely live with Vivi winning this. He's one of the few characters I was okay with beating Tifa. Go Vivi!
  13. Chaos Theory: Vivi wins this one hands down. He's much better than Kain. I mean, no offense, Kain is great and all, but Vivi is a much better character. He has a much more in depth storyline, a better character design, and will completely massacre the poor Dragoon. Also, in my own little world Vivi marries Eiko, so he can also control an army of moogles, including Mog, whose awesome. VIVI!!!! I mean who else is so adorable and at the same time can completely destroy you... He makes you wanna say: "Awwwwww. How -- AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! *In extreme pain as Ultima is casted on me*"
  14. Otherarrow: Eh...Hard vote, but Vvi is a better character than Kain. But not by much.
  15. Hexed: Flare > Jump. 'Nuff said.
  16. Drake Clawfang:I have consulted with the Holy Trinity. Although Terra didn't make any sense in doing so, she gave her support for Kain (what does "Teh sex" mean anyway?). Celes, however, noted that Vivi possesses powerful magic, making him much stronger than Kain with much more versatility in his spells while Kain can only Jump. Relm also gave her support for Vivi, citing "he's adorable" as her reason. Thus, I must go with the decision of my Goddesses and vote for Vivi.
  17. JAP : Vivi rulez. I personally not really fond of both of them, but Vivi is better than Kain. Period.
  18. Blue。. What got me voting for Vivi? His cuteness? His innocence? His power? His curiosity? His ability? His friendliness? His attitude? His personality? IDK, but I vote him.
  19. Henyacores: Black mages are like, 1000 times better than Dragoons, and Vivi aint no exception.
  20. Chocobo Knight Yes! He has made it! At long last, Vivi will take his rightful seat at the throne, where he shall be crowned KING of FF. And yes, captitals were necessary there. Kain may be cool, badass, and an awesome character, but once again, he just doesn't come close to Vivi...Vote Vivi!
  21. TheSwordofDoubt: GO VIVI GO!!!!!!!!!!! Don't need to say anymore. =D
  22. Cloneseffy VIVI ALL THE WAY! But I feel it should be pointed out that vivi can't actually cast ultima..
  23. Quetzal: Vivi! Vivi! Yeahhhhhhh!
  24. gokus789: Well since I haven't played IV I guess I'll vote for Vivi.
  25. Kaiser Dragon: OH YEAH, I KNEW Vivi would make it! Vivi all the way. Anyone who complained about Vivi casting Doomsday, has obviously never heard of Shadow-absorbing armor. Kain has his Jump and a spear. Vivi has no need for weapons as he has more doom spells than you can count on your limbs. V is for Victory, and Victory is for Vivi!
  26. dudutsai: Vivi isn't the best by far, and his story got a bit boring after a while, but he is still a bit better than Kain, who I have almost consistantly voted against.
  27. DrakemasterDrake: Whew, am I glad I didn't miss this. I got so caught up in Oblivion and War Of The Lions I forgot all about the wiki. Not to mention that I finally got a real life! But I'm glad I was able to get here in in time to vote for my main mage Vivi. Yeah, I loved Kain and all, but really, Vivi kicks ass. It's good to be back, and it's even better to vote for Vivi in this, the finals of the Magicite Madness tourney.
  28. Wary: This was tough, especially since I know very little about the characters. In the end, though, I had to go with the Black Mage. GO BM!
  29. Falbub: Voting for Vivi because he's just so darn adorable! Kain is cool, but Vivi is cute as a button and he kicks ass.
  30. Masamune: Salt in Kain's wounds, here. But seriously, Vivi's cool. Not amazing, but good.
  31. Pikmin Master: If I was Ezel, I'll say "Dragoons rub me the wrong way." I'm not the Dragoon person, so I've voting for the guy who'll inevitably win AKA the definition of an FF mage.
  32. Zario: Crud! My two favorite Characters against each other in the finals! Oh well I like Black Mages better than Dragoons.
  33. lennethebeauty: Vvi is the better character here, I do believe that is unanimous(hope I spelled that correctly...)Vivi has a more indepth character structure and is more powerful when it comes to battle. So Vivi has my vote, obviously.
  34. Jonty: Landslide mofo. Vivi killed so many Grand Dragons for me and Freya, and she was very thankful when Dragon's Crest did 9999 damage.
  35. OtensCan one who believes he or she do not exist lose? The answer is yes, but I told myself to vote for Vivi.
  36. Xmd5a: Putting in my vote for the mage with the most, Vivi! Kain's a'ight, but once Vivi's done staff-whipping and spamming Flare... well, 'Kaned' would be a more fitting name.
  37. RMX:All I can say is... Vivi's cute in a special way. :)
  38. angelbless: this has to be one of the best chracters in the FF series, Nobody can compare his kindness, his eyes and his will to live.
  39. Roman King: I like Kain and all, but Vivi was such an amazing character... I should have used him more in the game, though...
  40. BigSlurp: Vivi!!! Vivi!!! Vivi!!!
  41. BlkMage: Vivi is the greatest mage of any final fantasy and he would dominate kain GO VIVI!
  42. Asantran: I'm voting Vivi because hes a much better character, I always hated tho mysterious badass type. Plus Kain beat Cicel i wanna see him get knocked down.
  43. Alcaeus: My favorite character from my favorite FF. I loved how he grew up emotionally during the course of the game. He's nine and he actually accepted the fact that he had a short lifespan. The fact that he dies at the end of the game just makes him seem more human, and that's why I think he's so popular.
  44. Fyrmer: Now, don't get me wrong...I love Kain. But Vivi has always been one of my favourite FF characters of all time.
  45. Darkling692: I don't see a reason to vote for Kain, Vivi is cooler as FFIX is cooler than FFIV.

Anonymous Votes for 1. Vivi[edit source]

  1. Aww...Tifa got owned...My vote's on Vivi now!
  2. Alright Kain is cool but lets face it Vivi is the coolest!
  3. AnonyMan: Yeah, let's go Vivi! Someone from FFIX may finally win one(a VERY small victory but who cares?) Although Kain is a much better character than Tifa as far as I know, he's still not great, and I still don't know what his major appeal is. Here's hoping Vivi can best another unecessarily popular character consecutively.
  4. Vivi was a great character. Kain was alright. Vivi wins easily.
  5. IX is my favorite game and black mages are icons. Vivi represents everything Final Fantasy.
  6. Vivi would totally get pissed off and go ape-shit and destroy Kain. Besides, Kain would probably start out bitching about how he didn't get the girl, or how he betrayed his friend/king/fellow dragoons/etc.
  7. Vivi for the win! go little black mage dude!
  8. Yumiko: I thought about giving Kain a pity vote but I couldn't. Vivi is so awesome! I vote for him the same reason I voted against Tifa. He is so adorable. :)
  9. Vivi rules
  10. Cross: Kain is an emo loser, Vivi can take him any day of the week. w00t.
  11.  ??????: Have to say Vivi. I've always liked Vivi and I believe that I have a small plushie of him somewhere.
  12. Guy who's username usually contains Vivi: Don't get me wrong, Kain is an awesome character. But really, you can't beat the little Black Mage. He manages to focus all that power of destruction into a body cute enough to fit into a hello kitty anime yet cool enough to star in a film likely set in an American high school. Now imagine that film for a second. Wouldn't that just be awesome?

User Votes for 1. Kain[edit source]

  1. Crazyswordsman: I absolutely HATE this matchup since both Kain and Vivi are in the top ten FF characters of all time. Kain's higher up though. Don't flame me because I didn't vote for Vivi though. I absolutely positively ADORE VIVI.
  2. Faethin: Yeah, I hate this match too. My two favorite jobs. And Vivi. And Kain. But no matter what BH says, Kain is the greatest. I vote for the legend himself, Kain Highwind.
  3. Chief: I've gone from simply disliking Vivi, but now I just hate him. FOR TIFA!!!
  4. Resa91: Kain is one of my favorite characters in Final Fantasy series, and because none of my other favorites didn't make in this Final, I'm voting for him! Dragoons rules! :D
  5. Dark raven: A one-side match. Kain stands no chance against Vivi. Cid should be here. Or Tifa. That's a pity vote.
  6. Gilgamesh:Mmm... this is a hard choice but I vote for you Kain... Go Kain!
  7. SaviourSeph: Hmmm... I love Vivi, but it's got to be Kain (besides, he needs the votes... :) )
  8. Aramis: Well, have played FFIV, but didn't play FFIX so.. well, I vote for Kain.
  9. Pablo618: Anyways Kain is going to lose but, hey! both got to the final and both are great! who cares? =)
  10. The great sauce of MK!!!! He's really more of the underdog here......
  11. Adam Mcduck: Both competeters are here because they're grand and amazing, but Kain wins my vote because I prefer the slight bad-guy side to him and th fact that he's a physical fighter as oppossed to a mage.
  12. BritBoy: Comon, Kain he's such a badass, and he's a Dragoon
  13. Scottyboy4:Crap, Kain lost!
  14. Moogle24: I think that Kain might have a chance because he's a dragoon, allthough if Vivi cast Ultima a several times well he loses
  15. PapaBear:Kain is one of the main if not the first of one of the best classes in this game series, I've been playing this game since it first came out and yes the black mage is cool,but Vivi is not the original black mage. Were i'm very sure Kain is the original Dragoon. My vote goes to Kain.
  16. CrimsonDragoon: Im voting for Kain cuz hes a dragoon. XD
  17. Alexander Namingway: If only I voted sooner, I definitely would have voted for Dr. Cid or Bahamut. However, Kain deserves to over Vivi (not by much though)
  18. Triforcel: I'm going to go with Kain on this one. Sure Black Mages are cool and have powerful spells, but I've always preferred Dragoons.

Anonymous Votes for 1. Kain[edit source]

  1. Despite loving Final Fantasy IX, I've been a fan of the classics since I can remember. Come on, it's Kain. The coolest anti-hero ever. How could you not vote for this guy? Don't get me wrong, I love Vivi, but I've been a fan of Kain since I was...four or so. Go Kain!
  2. EmuMaster: Yeah. This isn't really hard for me. I liked Vivi, but I loved Kain.
  3. painfully match set up: But I have to go with Kain in this one.
  4. Kain was just too cool. Vivi had his black magic, but then he got Doomsday and killed the whole party too... Kain doesn't do that. He just kills from above, without using anything up. No MP, no nothing.
  5. TheCrimsonKing: Kain all the way. He practically invented the Dragoon class in the FF series. Without him they'd be no Cid Highwind, no Freya Crescent, no Kimahri Ronso; some of the most beloved characters in the entire 20 years of this great RPG series. I loved FF4, it was the first game in the series I experienced, before I went back and played the earlier ones. It was a good twelve years ago, but it remains one of my favourites. Vivi is cool in his own right too, but what does his competition consist of in the Mage Class? Lulu or Tellah can hardly be considered as popular as say the cigarette-smoking legend Cid, who takes from Kain his name anyway. Anyone who's played the series for as long as I have can't dispute the points I've made here. Little Vivi is by no stretch of interpretation an innovator of character design; there would always be the Mage Class in the series. He may well be a benchmark for all characters of that type, but so is Kain and my how the bar has been raised in his field over the years. Kain should be king!
  6. I voted for Vivi before but after a though decision i realized Kain is cooler than Vivi(not for much)
  7. This is a pity vote. Vivi is MUCH better..... but how bad Kain is losing is pathetic.
  8. kl4969 says: Kain has a dark side to him that makes him a very believable character. Plus dragoons are waaay cooler than black mages. One good Double Jump would not only dodge ANYthing Vivi could come up with, but also take out that black mage in one hit. Kain's agility would also ensure his initial strike. Vivi's cool, but Kain's infinitely cooler. (At least Tifa didn't make it to the final, that would've been embarrassing..boobs aren't gonna beat anyone up, people!)
  9. I, of course, agree with the people above. Kain set a class benchmark and has a darker and more mature side to him. Also, unrequited love is something almost everyone can relate to. The fact that he is more realistic than some character who looks tailor-made for kids earns him my vote. Go Kain!
  10. I vote for kain because he can inspire a sense of respect that very few characacters can, and he is like very strong in the battlefield.
  11. Veritas: My vote rests entirely with Kain. I share no love fro FFIX, and while Vivi is one of its' few redeeming qualities, Kain is a smooth operator, powerful, well designed, and a master of the often overlooked lancer as a main characters class. Plus, I mean just look at him!

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

Hiron: I find it odd that all those who voted for kain last week seemed to have mysteriously disappeared. Where are you guys?! This is so boring! Or did you all jump bandwagons when you saw who your going up against? Show some backbone, will ya?! Kain won by only a few votes then, now he's behind over twenty points! Make this a bit interesting, will ya? 7/1/08.

I miss Tifa already... - BlueHighwind 01:53, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Drake Clawfang:Oh, the difficulty in this decision....a kick-ass Dragoon and a kick-ass Black Mage...I must consult the Holy Trinity for answers, and shall vote at a later date.

BlueHighwind: I am the Holy Trinty. I am both Eric Fuchs, and BlueHighwind, and the Holy Spirit is the Q?. Together we order you to vote for Vivi. It is God's will.
Drake Clawfang: No no, BH, I mean the Holy Trinity of Clawfanism - Terra, Celes and Relm. :p
Faethin: Hey, BH, how do you pronounce your last name?
BlueHighwind: I get this all the time. Nobody ever seems capible of pronoucing it correctly the first time (and the fact that its one letter away from "Fucks" doesn't help at all). The "H" is silent, the "U" is long. "FEWX" is the probably the most phonetical way to write it.
8bit_BlackMage: I managed to screw up Vivi's voting area. Someone please repair my error before I get a Comet in my face.

Good riddance, FFVII characters! --Crazyswordsman 04:33, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Hey, does anyone think I should just declare Vivi the winner and get it over with? --Crazyswordsman 04:48, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Drake Clawfang:Unless Kain has had any semblance of a comeback tomorrow, yeah, the vote is quite slanted. So I say wait a little longer, just for the sake of fairness.
I actually have a pro-pre-FFVII reason to support Vivi. Vivi is spelled VIVI. Break it apart and you get VI VI. VI is the roman numeral for 6. FFVI is the best one in the series. That's a good reason to support Vivi. --Crazyswordsman 05:14, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
Heh, CSM, I bet you are glad I told you that one! Chocobo Knight
I'm just glad that not a single FFVIII character is left. The only one worth anything is Edea. But at least FFVII did better than say, FFVI. Na na, we beat you! Ha ha ha! But the real winner is FFIX. - The Anti-Kaizer.
FFIX is fine. There's nothing wrong with that game. I like the fact that we kicked Squall out in the first round. --Crazyswordsman 14:47, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
I say just leave it up a week. No one thought this would be a fight. Just imagine what it would have been with Vivi v. Cidolfus. In any case, we've kept some of our less competative ones up a week anyway... besides, I haven't made new templates for next week. -- TacticAngel TacticAngel 05:48, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Just someone who passes by every now and then, but this fight should have been Vivi versus Kefka.

Faethin: Yeah, I totally agree with you, Passer-by.

Chief: Is it just me, or do Vivi fans tend to be more long-winded than their opposition?

What are you trying to say? Personally I would find that any implication that we are somehow more verbose, that is one that is meant to slight us or be in some way derogatory, of great insult, but at the same time more laughable. We, as a group, should not be judged one the total characters used in creating our responce, so much as we should be judged for the content of our opinions and the thoughtful nature of those observations. If anything, we those who support Vivi with more pronounced explainations, should be wondering what it is that draw people to Kain, since their support is either almost inexplicable by contrast or just incredibly shallow and unworthy of a full effort to validify. I do not want to fall into this broad stereotype you have set aside for those of us who like the tragic, little mage, so I will try to draw my thoughts to a point with as much haste as I can. I propose the following; that those who support Vivi do it for reasons more profound, numerous, and valid than those who support any other person who has yet to appear either here in the Magicite Madness competition or, indeed, on a larger stage, in the entire lengthy history of the Dragon Neck Colosseum! There. I have said my peace, and I hope you find these words enlightening. --TacticAngel 22:23, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
That Crimson King wrote a whole essay. And not a word of it was at all interesting. And my reasons weren't at all valid or profoud. I voted for Vivi because he was a little pimp. -BlueHighwind 22:25, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
Chief:Crimson King was an exception! And I wasn't insulting Vivi voters. If you look, most Kain votes are 2-4 lines long. Vivi votes are at least double that (mostly).

Joanno: Now, this is most disheartening. Just how can you do this to me? I could vote for Kain just to take one vote away from Vivi. I don't know him too good (what with KH2 behind my back), but I'm starting to hate him already, and this is my second time here. I don't consider myself a FFVII fanboy, but I would dump that Vivi any given day. For one, that costume is one of the reasons I scarcely used black mages in Tactics Advance (viera all the way!). the way, who babbled something about Tifa placing the good brawlers like Zell' into bad light? Now, while FFVIII was my first FF _without_ a character I didn't hate at the first sight (Wakka and Barret come to mind as ones I only later learned to understand), Zell was not exactly impressive, the least as a brawler. Whereas Tifa, ... ... ... ... ... -,,,- I think I'll refrain from praising her. Okay, okay, I admit - I may be a Tifa fanboy, but that does not make me a FFVII fanboy. I could rant on about her and my Paine and Lulu, but you'd only get me wrong...

Anyway. I'll just Final Eclipse Vivi after he supposedly won. In the meantime, could anyone please tell me what happened to my dear Ashe during this contest?

Chief:Wait...You're a non-FFVII fanboy but a Tifa fanboy, too? Can I put you on my Tifaboy list?

Ashe got knocked out...

Cloneseffy: I think people are a little confused with vivi. He can't actually cast ultima. :P
AnonyMan:: Tifa ins't as cool Zell(or most others for that matter). Not as strong either. Story wise he can take and Gameplay wise...well if you're familiar with VIII you'll know Duel>>>Tifa's Slots-like limit.

Drake1: Okay, don't be hating on Vivi because he beat Tifa in a "fan" contest on a fan "wiki!" Tifa is an awesome character, and you should be glad she lost with honor near the end of the tourney against someone as great as Vivi. If you truly are a Tifa fanboy (and I know you don't like her as much as some, BH and I must be the top two contenders on this wiki for that title) than you would be glad she lost to this kickass black mage. Vivi is more kickass than the original Black Mage himself. In all of Final Fantasy, the top three characters are Tifa, than Delita, than Vivi. If Tifa lost to someone stupid, like Terra, Kefka, Bartz, Quina, or Baltheir I'd say you have the right to but Vivi! Dude, you are out of your mind!

Chief: Part of it is the fact I've never had the honor of using Vivi. And I'm not totally pissed off. I knew from the start it was an uphill battle for Tifa, and I'm glad the score was relatively close. And I do like her as much as anyone here! Who else has this on their userpage?
Joanno:Chief, I may not be giving it away, but the version I have of that picture is bigger and of much better resolution. Not that it was any kind of proof or anything. Actually I hope that version you have here is toned down, maybe to better meet limits. Right?
I think I would sell almost anything to get that paper version on the wall... Too bad it was already taken off from that party where it was when I was informed about it's existence.
Chief: I would have a better resolution of that great picture, but I couldn't find one. (If you ever find one, please tell me.) I would have also made it bigger, but I wanted it to perfectly fit the page (668 px for anyone curious).
Hiron: this is probably one reason square isnt making FF VII for the PS3, this would really tick off parents seeing their sons (excuse me for using this vulgar term) "beating off" to seeing Tifa in high-def 3D. 0_0
Joanno: Oh come on. That's almost the same face as used in AC, right? And she was not half bad there (well, her english seiyuu could have been better). I really think she should have pants, though. Long as she's sleeveless and has that kind of face, I won't complain on that department. And if they stick to the script, her inner side is secured. Nothing to lose, eh? And, if they would this time do it the way they first intended to - what with reviving Aerith and all - there would be no stopping me getting it. Now, don't get me wrong, I kind of hate Aerith, but I kinda wanna see that resurrection part.
And Chief, I have that Tifa as 1134 x 1602, got from GameSpot if my memory serves. Could've been some random site to where I got a link via GS or IGN...

Joanno: ...did you just mock Terra? And come on, Balthier's fun to listen to. I know, hating Vivi over this wouldn't do any good, but I can always 'hate' you people. Not that I really could, but I can try real hard?

8bit_BlackMage: You're right, Vivi can't use Ultima, he uses Doomsday, which is just as good. I think we should all be happy that we at this wiki put in characters like Tifa, Vivi, and Kain (okay fine, and Cid *grumble*) in the Final Four, unlike that other forum. They must be having Squall and Rikku battles and fan parties about now.
Joanno: Rikku ftw. Squall is actually kind of frightening, he's just too close in personality with Jo. And Jo is frighteningly similar to me. And, he was designed well before I even knew about Squall. Ah well, he's a better leading man than Tidus, anyway.
Drake: Yes, I did mock Terra, and no, Fran is fun to listen to, but all the XII characters suck. And Cheif, I truly doubt you like Tifa more than I do. First, most people like her because of her body. That's stupid, she's a videogame character, not a real person. Can't be hot, she was made with a computer. I actually like her character. I played Final Fantasy VII so many times because of her. She is my favorite character in any videogame for any system. No crappy Zelda or VI character can compare!
Joanno: Drake, I'm with you there. Well, almost completely. The 'giant Tifa pic' which Chief has on his page, if that kind of Tifa would be in the never-coming FFVII remake, that face is more than enough reason to get it by any means possible. (I still kinda think pants are better than miniskirts.) Tifa is a proof that beautiful face doesn't always make you a bimbo. It's always rejuvenating to find likeminded people.
HOWEVER. Even though Fran does speak good words, her seiyuu could've been so much better. Some Luluesque voice was what I imagined from the pics I had seen. Balthier is funny, and has a lovable accent, that's why I like listening to him. Ashe's voice, on the other hand, is something I could listen to all day without even noticing what she actually said. Just like Lulu and Paine. What, something wrong with preferring low over high?
Lulu's voice actress was dreadful. The acting was so wooden I bet the cast was picking spinters out of their asses for weeks. Fran's voice actress did an excellent believable job. And the accent fits perfectly. -- BlueHighwind 20:29, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
You could say that for the entire cast. Except MAYBE Auron and Wakka. But ESPECIALLY Tidus, Yuna, and Seymouor. --Crazyswordsman 00:50, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
AzureDrake: yea, Seymour sounded like a complete gay-ass homo. Not really bad on Yuna cept that she was usually monotone or w/e.
Seymour sounded like Newman from Seinfeld only on a very powerful depressant that makes him lose any emotion at all. --Crazyswordsman 02:30, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
LOL! That one made me laugh! -Faethin 02:32, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
Joanno:So, there is something wrong preferring low over high, you say? I agree on Seymour though.

Um...can I just say, right now...I think this has gone pretty one sided, and I REALLY doubt Kain is gonna have a come-back at this point. Just look at the vote difference. I think you might as well just end this. You said you'd wait and see for a bit longer if Kain came back...well, we have, and I'm pretty sure now he won't...Chocobo Knight 17:36, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Precisely. I'm getting bored already waiting for the fight to end.It's pretty much evident who is winning and I would like to see new fights go up, and besides, we have too many users and not enough content. Blue。 22:30, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
Yay! Someone agreed with me, and Vivi won! Woohoo! Chocobo Knight 18:41, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

Week 51: Final Fantasy Wiki: Magicite Madness Final Four[edit source]

Match 1: 2. Tifa Lockhart v. 1. Vivi Orunitia[edit source]

Crystal1.jpgFF WIKIA'S
Vivi Ornitier character.jpg

By a vote of 46-35
Vivi Ornitier character.jpg
In the red corner, Tifa, winner of the Monk bracket, defeater of rogues. In the blue corner, Vivi, champion caster, defeater of summons. This is a special, final four, Magicite Madness event!

User Votes for 2. Tifa[edit source]

  1. Mr. Rojo: I really like Tifa. She is beautiful, she is strong, a great character. She is my favorite female character in the FF universe. She is just awesome!
  2. Falbub: W00t! My first post as a user! I've voted on these things before but-- meh, that's beside the point. i am voting for Tifa because she is so fricking cool. End transmission and stuff.
  3. User:Booff7: Easily Tifa, I may have realized that I was being harsh on Vivi in earlier brackets but there is no way he's a better character than Tifa.
  4. King Dead: I voted for big ol titties
  5. Nelo:I'mnotvotingforTifa I'mnotvotingforTifa I'mnotvotingforTfa I'mno- Fuck That!
  6. BlueHighwind: Sorry but I have to throw my lot in with the underdog. I always root for the one that's going to lose (this is why in movies I'm usually on the villain's side). It may be a somewhat sick and self-destructive urge, but still its enough for me to throw my lot in with my love here. And of course FFVII > FFIX.
  7. TacticAngel: I like FFVII. I happen to really like both of these characters, but if people want to make a big deal about liking Tifa, let them deal with me. I'll friggin' ban you. (Probably kidding... probably)
  8. Chief:Go, Tifa! GO!!! (According to my poll, this is going to be really close. Don't get cocky Vivi fans.)
  9. Drake: I think this was harder for me then it was for BH. Final Fantasy VII is my favorite game of all time, and IX my second fave. At first, I just wasn't going to vote, but then I would be forsaking both these characters by not voting, so I decided I had to pick one. At first I put together a council of advisors, which consisted of my little brother and that's it. He was too busy playing with all his new Star Wars legos he got from Santa, so he was no help afterall. Well, I decided that Tifa is my favorite by far, and though she never left my party when I could help, there were time when I rolled a die to decide what members to have in my party in IX, and if Vivi wasn't rolled he wouldn't be included. And all that rambling made this vote my longest in Magacite Madness, so I'm gonna stop now.
  10. One eye: Dunno why I'm doing this, but, yeah, Tifa... Yeah, I know Vivi is awesome... but... but... Waaaaaah!
  11. Adam Mcduck: I love them both, but I vote for Tifa in the end because i'm more fond of physical fighters than mages. I'm sorry Vivi!
  12. User:Landavia: she is sexy!! no more comment from me!!
  13. Dark raven: Whoever wins this battle, wins it all. I vote for Tifa, because she's hotter than Firaga.
  14. Scottyboy: I never really liked mages.
  15. Cactuar83:I am sooooo sorry Vivi but I have to go with Tifa. She's from the best FF but well you're next in line.
  16. Xadren: I cannot vote for Vivi, this time, I love Tifa in every sense of the word; physically and psychologically. She is FF best female character (in my opinion) with Aeris, Dagger and Yuna (FFX). So...go, Tifa, I cheer for you!!!!!
  17. Masamune: I love Tifa, but if she loses to Vivi, I can handle it. Go, both contestants!
  18. MYVizm: I love Tifa! I think she should sooo win this! She was so cool in FFVII
  19. lil:I dunno much bout FF...but i feel TIFA is way cool especially in FFVII!!!
  20. Lockhart:To me, this is the finals. But Tifa has always been my favorite and I can't go against her now. Nothing against Vivi, he's still awesome.
  21. Henryman!: Tifa is just plain awsome. She's the only good monk in the series and she eats black mages at breakfast.
  22. RalisII: If it was just up to the games I'd vote Vivi, but after seeing her kick but in Advent Children I have to vote Tifa.
  23. AmyAmber: BIIIIG VOTE FOR TIFA! She'll win this battle, I hope so ^^. EVERYBODY VOTE FOR TIFA !
  24. CristoPT: Well, it happens to be a difficult decision. Having played and liked both FF7 and FF9, i still prefer FF7 over FF9. I'm voting for Tifa because I felt that her charisma and overall personality captivated me more than Vivi's. Although I prefer black mages, I'm sorry Vivi.

Anonymous Votes for 2. Tifa[edit source]

  1. Tifa= is hot, kicks ass, has a continuous limit break combo, etc.
  2. What's a 'Vivi'?
  3. Rinoa = Final Heaven lol, best limit breaks, awesome character, kept it interesting great story, would smack vivi, i like vivi and i did use him but hes not the best black mage theres more interesting characters than vivi, such as tifa
  4. Tifa is awesome. Vivi is too, but Tifa is more awesome!
  5. Gotta go with my childhood sweetheart
  6. She can beat him!
  7. Tifa is so going to win! -Nods-
  8. Tifa rulezzzzzzzz
  9. Tieria Erde votes for Tifa!
  10. C'mon now. What can some Vivi hold for Tifa? Not a candle. If there was a black mage, it was Lulu. Vivi won't be supported.
  11. Tifa is better than Vivi. She has a pretty face while Vivi only have 2 yellow eyes
  12. I like black mages in general, but Vivi is a weakling. Any character from FF7 loaded up with magic matera has significantly more powerful magic than Vivi. Also, martial arts chick vs emo kid = easy choice. - iddqd
  13. hell yea thats exactly why i rp as her and i'm the one and only original so tough luck noobs..xD PWNAGE!!!!!!!!!!
  14. Vivi is a great black mage and all, probably my favorite... but I have to go with Tifa, I grew up with FFVII as my very favorite, and Tifa has always been one of my favorite supposrting characters
  15. I hope you win Tifa!
  16. WOO! tifa's way cooler than vivi, and she kicks ass! i vote 4 tifa.
  17. Vivi is a wimp! Tifa helped beat the greatest villian in FF history, and she did it with style.
  18. Tifa is hot!!! She could kick Vivi's ass any day!!!
  19. I like magic and IX is my favorite FF, but being a martial artist I have to go with the hot lady that kicks ass. Tifa, I'd risk being shot down by you any day.
  20. It was a tough one but it had to go to Tifa. As written characters they're pretty close and it's hard to say, but Tifa was in the fantastic VII (still ignoring the Compilation), and she would kick Vivi's arse in a fight. (though she'd probably rather give him a hug)
  21. Obviously Tifa!!! She is so cool while vivi is so introvert (allright, I liked him because he's the clasic black mage, but...)
  22. Tifa gets my vote!

User Votes for 1. Vivi[edit source]

  1. Gryndel: I vote ViVi.
  2. Hiron: call me old fashioned, but i beleive in tradition, and when you of a monk in final fantasy, you do not think of a woman in short-shorts with a skin tight tank top and double-D's. but if you think black mage, you think of something along the lines of vivi. plus, i like IX more than VII because it sticks more to the first six final fantasies. plus, in a real fight, vivi would win sicne he would go into trance mode and and cast two ultimas on her.
  3. Hexed: You have got to love a little child-sized machine of destruction!
  4. 8bit_BlackMage: Ah, we're doing it in the DNC, hmm? Nice layout. You all know why you should vote for Vivi by now, if not, a little Doomsday might help.
  5. Otherarrow: While Tifa is a good character, Vivi is just...Vivi, in my opinion the greatest black mage character known to man.
  6. AzureDrake: This should prove once and for all (or at least for a few minutes after the end) that real people CAN beat fans.
  7. Crazyswordsman:Oh, TA did this already? In this case, the battle is already won.
  8. Faethin votes for the Black Mage.
  9. Drake Clawfang:Tifa's hot, but there's an abundance of hot animated chicks out there (believe me, I've looked). On the other hand, Vivi is cute and bad-ass at the same time, and there are not so many of those.
  10. Zario: Well he is my Favorite Character.
  11. Pablo618: This is so cool! Go vivi!
  12. Mymindislost: Definitely Vivi for me.
  13. dudutsai: Tifa has had easy fights up till now. She is a lot worse than Vivi.
  14. Xmd5a: I never really used Tifa too much. And Vivi is great for reasons that have already been explained many times.
  15. TheSwordofDoubt: Black Mages kick ass and Vivi is the best of them all. Without him, I would've gotten a Game Over a LOT of times when I played FF IX.
  16. Azul: Vivi= Bad-ass of FFIX.
  17. Blue。 Vivi. Vivi. Vivi.
  18. Gold 13:04, 28 December 2007 (UTC): I refuse to see Vivi loose to a pair of tits.
  19. Quetzal: I felt an obligation to officially create a user account JUST to save this vote from the Tifa fanboys. Viva Vivi!
  20. Rigel: Vivi is definitely way better than Tifa. For one thing, he's got the ability to toast her, freeze her, electrocute her, drown her, poison her, etc. For another, he doesn't have crazy fanboy support like FFVII characters do. Definitely has to be Vivi.
  21. Mangartist: How is this even a competition? I mean, first of all, it's the almighty Vivi, second, his opponent is a character with almost no character development at all. Tifa was just fan service (though I admit she was almost always on my team, I was basically to lazy to change the team)
  22. Chocobo Knight: Grr...damn edit conflict. Thanks, BH...anyway, I'm currently campaigning for people to Vote Vivi. He rocks so much, I'm trying to get him to win this whole thing. He rocks so much, we puny humans cannot possibly begin to describe his true awesomeness, because our small brains cannot begin to comprehend how much of a cool character he is. Go Vivi! Go Vivi! Vivi...for President!
  23. Pikmin Master: Vivi's the MAGE! He'd own Tifa anyday, strategically speaking. Besides, who wouldn't resist having a party member who's a killer Black Mage. Tifa? She's good too, but not only her Limits stink, but Vivi can cast magic easier than Tifa. Go Vivi! Go Kain!
  24. Renmiri Vivi!!!!!!!!! Ren breaks the tie
  25. Spindle: When I defeated the last boss of Final Fantasy IX, Vivi was the last one standing, still enduring Necron's attacks dozens of moves after my other party members had been wiped out. Simply for that, he deserves my vote. A character who can stand up to a god on his own...
  26. ShadowLaguna: Just because Tifa's sexy, doesn't mean she can kick Vivi's ass. Not even her breasts can save her.
  27. Alcaeus: The best character in the most underrated game of the series vs. a mediocre character from the most overrated game in the series. My vote DEFINATELY goes to Vivi.
  28. Arkanemancer: Tifa is annoying and in Final Fantasy VII, the Movie, one of my favorite movies, she barely seems to do anything. Also, Vivi and all black mages look cool and are mages and magic is the best, unless you also have some kind of magic (like jutsu in Naruto), then you're pretty useless and you get old after a while.
  29. alessa1235:VIVI IS the Cutest, sweetest and best Black Mage ever! He would teach a lesson to anyone, anytime.
  30. Rach24:Tifa's a great character but I loved Vivi and his story. I also always used him for almost every fight.
  31. Kuvio: Vivi is such a lovable and interesting character. How can you not love him. Tifa=sexy, but I gotta give it to my man Vi.
  32. Cloneseffy: Vivi is the greatest character from any final fantasy ever. Anyone who says any differently is WRONG. He could just blast Tifa away with Flare, or Doomsday if he's feeling merciless.
  33. BigSlurp: Tifa was really a blah character. Vivi may be a tad annoying, not nearly as much as Tifa was. And despite all the annoyingness of the two, I have to give Vivi props, because he can lay a heck of a smack down for being so freaking small. And his magical prowess is far greater than Tifa could hope for.

Anonymous Votes for 1. Vivi[edit source]

  1. Vivi looks weak on the outside, but he's definitely strong on the inside! Black Mages, go!
  2. Yeah, Vivi's got my vote :D Tifa doesn't stand a chance, sorry Tifa fans ;P
  3. Vivi has a much cooler action scene than Tifa ever does. The Black Mages rule!!!
  4. Vivi's a black mage. 'nuff said. Gotta love the droopy pointy hat.
  5. Final Fantasy VII was great, but I really don't see how the fans boys could get off on polygons. I have a dream.... That the black mages can overcome the drooling mass known only as..... Fanboyism. Black mages of the world unite!
  6. The only reason Tifa can win ANY fight is because her foes get distracted due to her massive rack... Hooray to BMs!
  7. Some Fellow: Poor Vivi, such a sad story for him...but he would best Tifa any day
  8. Yumiko: This was hard to choose but I think Vivi would win. I think he's cute. ^^
  9. Trabian; Vivi gets my vote.
  10. Vivi rules!!!!!!
  11. Gottis: Vivi would so totally win all the way! His Black Magic rocks, and you just have to adore a wee little (killing machine) thing like him! =D
  12. AnonyMan: Tifa is such a boring character,and is in VII which makes it worse. Take away her fanservice atuned image and she's nothing, just someone who makes good brawlers like Zell and Sabin look bad. Although Vivi himself has some fanservice going for him he's got substance behind him and who doesn't like Magic Sword with him and Steiner another great FF character?
  13. EmuMaster: Tifa's a slut, no doubt there. Vivi's cute and can rape you in the ass. I'll end it here.
  14. Scras: Absolutely loved Vivi both as an evolving character, and as a main party member.
  15. That Guy - Vivi. Hes a BLACK MAGE, people.
  16. Er...-Vivi, cause he's in final fantasy 9.
  17. Viva is just plain cool!!
  18. Adeaphon: How could anyone not vote for a black mage?
  19. Vivi. He's deep...
  20. Vivi wins hands down.
  21. I love Vivi! I thought it was so awesome that he was in KH2.
  22. Vivi wins my vote, considering that I have many reasons to vote for Vivi rather than Tifa, for one, Vivi has a more in-depth story than Tifa does, and has more of a reason to fight than her. Tifa fights to save the world and to be next to Cloud, Vivi fights to help his friends, save the world, and to prove to not only himself but to everyone else that he does indeed exist. Vivi's story is bittersweet and heartsnatching and it ends very ambiguously. I'm not just voting for him just because of his character developement though, I am also considering battles. Tifa has her limit breaks, going all the way to Seventh Heaven, Vivi goes into trance and can cast Double Black Magic, his stats are also temporarily increased. Vivi can also very well use extremely powerful magic that would most definitely knock Tifa out. In battle, Tifa and Vivi are practically equals, Vivi is stronger in other aspects, while Tifa has more power in others.
  23. I grew up with final fantasy 9, vivi was so deep and innocent. Also his magic amazed the 9 year old me so he deserves to win, tifa just hits hard.
  24. Vivi totally wins this one. He is an entrancing and amazing character that won my heart the first time he tripped and fell over, and even more so when he stood up, fixed his hat, and brushed off his pants. Vivi not only is an adorable character with an awesome background and story, but is a total bad ass in battle, not to mention he looks rather snazzy in his trance. There's not much else to say that no one else already hasn't. Oh yeah, all that Tifa has is her Triple D breasts.
  25. Vivi the new Boss!!!!
  26. Random Anonymous Person: Tifa's okay, but Vivi rocks my socks.
  27. I like Tifa a lot but Vivi is just classic and classic rocks.

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

  • BlueHighwind: I cannot make this descion. Its just not in me. I spent all of today debating who to vote for. In fact even my spirit guide, Sephiroth came down, and he told me only this: "(Sigh) I don't know. Sucks to be you. Glad I'm only a figment of your imagination." So I'm out. I'll cry for the loser and be glad for the winner. Whoever wins this fight has my official BH endorsement for victory. This is not a happy day for me.
  • Hexed:Don't worry BH, it took me about 5 minutes to decide.
  • Crazyswordsman: I'm going to put the second fight on when I decide to close Kain-Freya, which I will do between 6 and 7. After that, the Final Four will be open for a week. Then, the title matches will be open for a week.
  • AzureDrake:This is frickin funny, Vivi 5, Tifa 0. Cmon FFVII fans, IM WAITING, im waiting for your votes which will be nothing against the votes for Vivi. What's that? I think I hear no one there! HAH. ok i think i should lay off the juice D:
BlueHighwind: I'm starting to think the the legions of brainless delusional Final Fantasy VII fans are a myth. Or at least their presense at this wiki is greatly exaggerated.
They don't have a presence here; they mostly roam smaller Anime forums with fancy sigs with about 48000 photoshopped pics and scripts showing their favorite character. --Crazyswordsman 00:57, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
BlueHighwind: Then if they aren't here, then what the fuck are we bitching about them then? When I first came here (and to a smaller extent I still believe this), I thought that I was the only one who even liked FFVII, considering just how much you all complain about it. If Tifa is still completely shut out by next Thursday, I'll give a pity vote for her, just like with Edea vs. Sephiroth.
Because otherwise we'd see an invasion of them. --

Crazyswordsman 02:15, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

AzureDrake: WAIT WAIT, I THINK I SPOTTED THE FIRST FFVII FAN. Falbub you sad, sad horse.
No flaming plz thnx --Crazyswordsman 02:24, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
AzureDrake: ugh sorry about that, i think i had some sugar that time, can't be sure :\
Nelo:this is no fun at all....
  • BlueHighwind: Huh, in an ironic twist, the "phantom" army of FFVII idiot fanboys actually appeared to vote for Tifa in scores. Good thing they're all annons, and thus don't matter. Also I am very sorry Vivi. I hope you can find it in your Black Mage heart to forgive me.
TacticAngel: I wouldn't worry. I check IP#s.
8bit_BlackMage: Vivi has a heart of gold BH, of course he'll forgive you. Unless of course he loses by one vote, then I might convince him to drop a Meteor on your head.
Nelo:oh, you devil. >:)
AzureDrake: Vivi's dead so you'd have to bring one of his spawns :D
  • King Dead: I don't have anything against Vivi (FFIX is my favorite in the series), but I can't vote against Tifa. Definitely one of the best supporting women in the series.
  • BlueHighwind: Is voting against someone just to spite fanboys any more rational than voting for someone for fanboyism? Neither one is voting for the individual characters. So for now on I will reffer to many of you as "anti-fanboy fanboys", because you're thought processes are just as poorly run, and because your influence is just as insipid and detrimental to all. Enjoy.

Chocobo Knight: Wow, this is getting wild...edit conflicts all the time, flaming...what's next? P.S: I hope my vote doesn't sound like fanboyism (oops, that said "does sound like fanboyism" by mistake...stupid typo). Really, Tifa is cool too, a good character, and a hot one at that, she just isn't on par with Vivi when it comes to how good a character she is

  • King Dead: Wow, serious action on this Final Fantasy character poll.
8bit_BlackMage: There is a limit to fanboyism you know, you don't see any Cait Saith or Amarant cliques anywhere. I don't really see a problem with people liking Sephiroth or Kefka or Vivi or Tifa. I just debunk them when their statements make no sense :)
  • dudutsai: It looks like from the history some anon voted 3 times for Vivi. Just thought you should know...
TacticAngel: Actually they appear to have voted, deleted their vote and voted again if you look at what they actually did.
Alessa1235: Vivi is the sweetest, cutest and best black mage of all! When I played ffIX he ruled and he would teach a lesson to anyone anytime!

Match 2: 4 Cidolfus Demen Bunansa vs. 1. Kain Highwind[edit source]

Crystal1.jpgFF WIKIA'S
Kain DS CG Render.png

By a vote of 34-31
Kain DS CG Render.png
In the red corner, it's one of the baddest mothafuckas of all time. I give you, the mad scientist himself, the champion of the Cids, the great Archadian mastermind, fourth seeded Dr. Cid! And in the blue corner, the high flying Dragoon who flew all the way from Baron to be here with us today, the champion of all Dragoons and Knights, the top seeded Kain Highwind!

User Votes for 4. Cid[edit source]

  1. Hiron:Some where between weeks 40 and 50, i had to vote for either freya of IX or kain, and i didnt vote for kain back then. plus, this cid is unique in that its not just a vilain, but a villain who actually had a kinda noble goal. plus, did kain ever gain control over a magical being that was created by the "gods" to keep order in the world but instead went rogue? uh-uh. plus, cidolfus got a mini gun. A FRICKIN MINIGUN! he would blast kain away.
  2. AzureDrake: Pity vote :D
  3. Mymindislost: Definitely Dr. Cid for me.
  4. dudutsai: I never liked Kain. He is such a tool. And Dr. Cid is awesome.
  5. User:Booff7: Tough, but, while Kain was cool, Cid was a character unlike any other we have seen in the series. He was a madman but there was a reason to his madness and what he wanted in the end was actually for the good of the people. The other madman in the series (Kefka) had no reason for being insane or trying to destroy the planet. This makes Cid one of the most interesting characters in the series. Final Fantasy has had its share of awsome looking guys who sit around and feel sorry for themselves like Kain. I'm not saying I don't like Kain but Cid was highly original and one of the most interesting characters in the series to date.
  6. Xmd5a: Must... resist... voting... for... Cid... on... the... count... of... having... cool... weaponry... D'OH! Ah well, he IS Balthier's daddy.
  7. One eye: Heh, Cid, favorite FF character from my favorite FF game. I loved his magicite rants.
  8. RMX: Madmen rule forever! ...At least for me. XD
  9. Azul: Ahhh this is hard!!! I vote Cid soley because he is losing :(
  10. Setanbedul: vote because he is normal person who have ambition . sadly he act wrong!!
  11. Dark raven: I'm not a Seph fanboy. I stay with Cid, even now, when he's losing. Stand up and fight, Doctor! You can do it! Kain is nobody compared to Kefka!
  13. Blue。 Kain is an emo. Cid is Cid.
  14. Quetzal: By far, my favorite Cid. This man was INSANE. He added a very interesting flavor to the closing chapters of FFXII. Kain, on the other hand... well, I always feel disappointed by dragoons in any FF game, and IV is no exception.
  15. User:Tabris93I haven't played IV, but I have played XII. Cid was a cool and interesting character, indeed.
  16. Masamune: On this one, I vote out of ignorance. I've never played FFIV, but I have played FFXII, and Cid rules. I wouldn't vote to be fair, but he's probably going to lose, so...
  17. Lockhart: I have to vote for Cid here. He's just better. But the winner of this is just third place to Tifa/Vivi in my book.
  18. Jammi568 16:03, 31 December 2007 (UTC): Cid, the Man with the Machine gun. And the bloody powerful pistol. And the one with the coolest laugh in the series.
  19. DarthIvan: Cid is the number one!!! I MUST vote him! And, if someone says that i'm only a tool of Cid, remember: How quaint, we are allies!
  20. Falbub: A very tough decision, but I'll have to vote for the crazy person here. This is the first Cid to be an antagonist, and he's crazy. Gotta love the crazy.
  21. LeaMonde: I've actually played FFIV and now playing FFXII and I choose Cid because he's freaking crazy, wears stylish clothes, and did someone and created Balthier, who I think is freaking hot. Thus Cid gets my vote.
  22. BigSlurp: Kain looks cool and all, but I have to go with Cid. Mainly for the fact that there is a Cid in pretty much every FF based game out there. I dislike the chosen Cid pictured above, but I did like many of the others.
  23. SaviourSeph: Tough call (Kain is my favourite FFIV character), but I'm going with Cid for being one of the best villains in the series.

Anonymous Votes for 4. Cid[edit source]

  1. I vote for Cid because of his manic behavior and huge kickass gun <lolz>...I'll definitely not vote for Kain because he was a villain during most of FFIV/FFII...mostly because of Golbez...
  2. I hate dragoons, so this isn't so much of a vote for Cid, as it's a vote against Kain. However, Cid's character was the only interesting one in the whole game, so he gets a pity point for that.
  3. Ahhh this is hard!!! I vote Cid soley because he is losing :(
  4. Gottis: Cid mainly because I don't know who the other guy is, and Cid is DA MAN! I love him! XD
  5. Dr. Cid simply because of his son.
  6. AnonyMan: I'm going to go with Doc Cid, and definitely not because of Balthier, I'm a Vaan maan. Despite the fact I've never played FFIV past the first few minutes, Kain(like Balthier)is a bit overrated for no reason really. If you want overrated Dragoons who are actually really cool, go see Freya Crescent.
  7. Sergei Smirnov votes for Cidoflas Demon Bonanza!
  8. Rinoa - Don't like Kain, rydia, rosa and cecil stole the show in ff4, he just irritated me, cid was completely insane, and made some really interesting boss fights, didnt think a great deal of him but thought he was ok, vayne was better, not voting for him cus of balthier though, hes overrated too lol, (his quickenings jsut look stupid)
  9. i just like Cid more
  10. He has a long name that sounds cool
  11. I don't dislike Cain or anything, but I've never understood his popularity. He jumps! Jumping is his thing. Somewhat useful towards the end, but there's not a lot to distinquish his character from Generic Fighter #4. Evil Cid is one of those lovable maniacs who just ooze class. Teh win! - iddqd
  12. 5. how could people love Cain more than Cid? okay i havent played the game with cain in it or anything, but if what i read, how he's kinda emoy andstuf he just reminds me of a cloud/Seph knock off, while Cid on the other hand is so BA. I mean he was like a mastermind in this game you never find out much, but when you do he's like the one who pulls alot of strings, and like all madmen you never do know what his motive truely is. i mean in the end he dies so easily he had things even the game didn't talk about planned he's as bad as they come, he's smart, and powerful, and you don't know the meaning of his actions, while from i know its not much fair to say, but Cain sounds like the predictable type, he does things that you expect his character to do, he may be pretty kick ass with that out fit and spear but, he mopes, and moping people arn't that great.
  13. Eh? of course any normal person would vote 4r someone with high IQ than their opponent......
  14. Cid is a bad ass!!!
  15. I like that this Cid is actually a bad guy, it makes a nice change. Also, I've no faint idea who the other guy is
  16. What can I say? Cid is a mad genius, which is my favorite kind of person.

User Votes for 1. Kain[edit source]

  1. Crazyswordsman: Who do you think I'm gonna vote for? The one who stays airborne and avoids all attacks, duh!
  2. Otherarrow: Cid may be a interesting character [one of the only ones in XII], Kain Highwind is a Dragoon, involved in much of the story's interesting parts and is from a good game in the series.
  3. Faethin votes for the Dragoon.
  4. Mr. Rojo: I like Doctor Cid, but well maybe Kain is better. And for sure the drgoons are cool.
  5. Drake Clawfang:Kain kicks all kinds of ass. Cecil's, Zeromus', Bahamut's, Freya's...
  6. BlueHighwind: I'd much rather see Freya here, but hey, Dragoon beats not Dragoon in many cases. This is one of them.
  7. Zario: Hard fight, A dude from Ivalice and a REAL Dragoon. I choose the Dragoon obviously!
  8. Hexed:As much as Dr. Cid was cool, Kain was much cooler.
  9. Pablo618: Kain is one of the best characters in FF history, I'm proud of playing FFIV!
  10. TacticAngel: After Cid beat lolKefka, I can say there's a point beyond which he must not advance... of course he should have been finished off by the last Highwind Dragoon.
  11. 8bit_BlackMage: Poor Cid is going to get squished this round like he should have been last round. ABEL'S LANCE FTW!
  12. Drake: *sigh* Well, Kain loses next round, but at least he'll go out in style, crushing one of the worst Cids in the series.
  13. Adam Mcduck: Even though XII Cid is my second fav Cid, compared to Kain he's nothing. Kain is playable, a Dragoon, a Highwind & a good guy, this makes him better.
  14. Scottyboy4: Kain is a dragoon and is bad-ass.
  15. Gold 13:03, 28 December 2007 (UTC):Kain mowed through them all, and there is NO WAY he's losing now.
  16. Chocobo Knight: Go Kain, the King of Badasses, the awesome Dragoon...honestly that FF4 DS pic makes him look even cooler.
  17. Pikmin Master: Kain should win. It's the logical choice. Dude, his best lance is named after me. ME, I tell you!
  18. Xadren: I can't say I like Kain, but he's a good character after all. Beside, Cid isn't the best mad scientist around, Hojo is far better (and fooler) than him!
  19. Gilgmaesh: Cid is a looser... Kain is stronger and darker than him and... is the king of the dragoon
  20. Renmiri Go Kain go!!!!
  21. MK There are few character created that could stand up to Kain.... The good doctor is not one of those characters.
  22. Henrydude: Kain may be a treacherous ass, but he is a DRAGOON first!
  23. Rigel: As awesome as an evil Cid might be, the series' best Dragoon ever definitely has to come out on top.
  24. ShadowLaguna: Kain owns all the other supporting characters combined!
  25. Alcaeus: I guess I'll vote for Kain. He's sexier.
  26. Arkanemancer: I pretty much don't really play FF, but I still love it, so I don't really know dragoons, but I've always found them to be one of my favorite classes.

Anonymous Votes for 1. Kain[edit source]

  1. Yup I'll place my vote here just because I hate Cid. Muahahaha!
  2. _______I'M VOTIN' FOR THIS GUY CUZ HE'S WAYYY COOLER!!!!!!!__________
  3. There's been a Cid in every FF game. He needs an original name.
  4. Kain, cuz that Cid looks, well... a bit *coughqueerfaggetgaycough*
  5. Some Fellow: The brooding loners always win, haven't you realised? Plus the Dragoons are one of the best classes out there...btw at the end of FFIV do you think Kain attempts to become a Palladin? Let's hope they make a PC version of FFIV: 2
  6. Final Fantasy has been going downhill lately. Cid is a prime example of this. I don't feel for that guy at all. Kain on the other hand, is a landmark in the series. He's been mentioned in practically every Final Fantasy since, as well as shaping the Dragoon class.
  7. EmuMaster: Kain. Dear GOD Kain. The only way any Cid would even hold a candle to the guy is if he were Cidolfas Orlandu, which this does not appear to be at all. Even then, it's a tough call since Kain is essentially the Naked Snake of Final Fantasy. All bad ass, nothing else. Not to mention the spear. I mean, look at it.
  8. That Guy: Kain, all the way. I don't get how Dr. Cid got even this far; even if I agreed to the fact he made it into the top eight, he should NOT have beaten Kefka. I mean, Kefka is Kefka. Kain all the way, people. Kain.
  9. Er....-The fact that he can own cecil says enough.
  10. Cid has no fighting ablity but Kain is a Friggin DRAGOON!! Can't beat that!!!
  11. hmm... what to pic a cid in the series who is mean and mad, or a FFIV very own Kain. Kain beats this cid anyday.
  12. Kain is such a legendary Dragon Knight that he is referenced as far in the future as FF9. Besides, Kain could just jump out of the way and lance through anything that other guy throws at him.
  13. I choose Kain,Dr. Cid rather annoys me with his useless antics and Kain is a much better character all around. I'm plainly surprised that Dr. Cid even made this far, it surprised me further to see that he beat Kefka.
  14. How the hell did Kefka not make it to the Final Four!?! Kain wins this hands down. He is the only guy who back stabbed you twice then joins your party! Kain should take his spear and stick it up Cid's ass!
  15. Kain gets my vote!
  16. Random Anonymous Person: Dr. Cid is an incredible character, but he just doesn't compare to Kain.

Peanut Gallery[edit source]

This is the best quote on the Wiki:

Kain Highwind can STILL kick your ass

Faethin 00:48, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

  1. Eh...Cid has no fans...

8bit_BlackMage: Look at the Kefka vs. Cid battle in the Elite Eight and you'll see their reasons. You know, 2 characters from FFXII that look like they have good backstory being in the final eight almost makes me want to buy a PS2.

King Dead: I don't want to vote on this one, really. If it was another Cid I'd vote for him in a heartbeat, but eh. Kain was never my cup of tea either.
--Landavia 11:59, 28 December 2007 (UTC) : I was kefka clone

Drake Clawfang:Who was the 12th anon user who voted for Cid? The one who thinks the FF IV character is a knockoff of VII/VIII characters?

Yep, people like Anon No. 12 are the reason why many users wanted to ban anon voting altogether. Faethin 21:48, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
Man what a dick. I'd put up a warning on his Talk Page if that wasn't a clear abuse of my Moderator Super Powers. Hell I'd ban that idiot, such scum could never be a useful contributor to the wiki. -BlueHighwind 00:58, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
8bit_BlackMage: His opinion may be blatantly wrong, but there's nothing really offensive about his post barring the way he rambles on and on and on in one sentence. Much ado about nothing methinks.
Drake Clawfang:Oh come on BH, what's the point of having power if you can't abuse it now and then? Seriously, how could anything in FF IV be a knockoff of something in VII or VIII? If anything, it would have to be the other way around, although Cloud and Squall are *nothing* like Kain. Cloud, maybe, I don't know his whole story, but Squall? I don't hate him like so many others, but Kain is still five times the character Squall was.

Hiron StakeIt has come to my attention that my illegal votes have disrupted some things. It was certainly not my intention to bother anyone and i would like to make a full apology to those i bothered. I have no excuse for my action and can only ask for your forgiveness. I also apologise for taking up space with this message, but it seemed like the most efficient way (Mind you, I thought about using the forum, but was worried that it might get washed away, if you will, in a large amount of people adding new threads). One more time, I sincerely apologise for my actions and beg your forgiveness.

Apology accepted, however you're still on very thin ice. Its going to be a long time before I trust you again. -BlueHighwind 05:34, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

Quetzal: Hey! Anonymous voters that like Cid! Go register and move your vote to the registered list, where it counts! :D



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